Changes to the Fantastic Four

[Crimz]

In another thread one apparent thing that the Fantastic Four need is change, whether that's drastic change or subtle change remains to be seen.

What changes would you make to the Fantastic Four/Future Foundation that you think would improve the team/book?

Some of the changes I think they need are in this thread: http://community.comicbookresources....uot-dated-quot (not writing it again because I'm lazy, ) I will say what other changes I have in mind later.

[Montressor]

The only change I'd like to see would be Franklin returning as a teen, around 16-17 years old. NOT still a toddler.

Aside from that, minor things like Frankie Raye being alive (and human) again, and a good writer who can take them into uncharted territory (I'd love to read Grant Morrison's take on the team, but that's just me).

But yeah, age Franklin up, for the love of Christ.

[Ianbarreilles]

Have reed die sacrificing himself somehow or have reed take a break from superheroing while Susan and her children reunite with Ben and Johnny.

[jackolover]

The change I would want, is to reflect that cynicism in Reed about how the 616 sort of was handled incorrectly, and spiralled out of control. That could take the form of an analysis of the super hero tradition as it stands, and maybe start a different tradition? Like murder all super villains, quietly in their beds. Start an elimination process that takes in immediate destruction of adversaries, (which may include eradicating possible allies like a Silver Surfer type character, unfortunately).

That's one alternative. Another alternative is to start a Norman Osborn inclusion process like in Dark Reign - have the super villains incorporated into the the super hero tradition from the start. Hold a meeting, inviting all super humans to attend, (maybe in stages, or at various locations so as not to hire the whole super bowl). Then invite the super villains to a seat at the table. Be Avengers, or, as most likely is the case, offer them a section of the city, (like the Kingpin to work unhindered), or, come up with a venture normally a result of gaining money from a bank robbery. Then get Reed to come up with the money instead, so the villain gets to make whatever he wants to make. Settle the villain problem, by defusing the confrontational element in the MU.

I don't know if that is possible, because it may be that the villain/hero dynamics makes the world go round, and if you take that antagonism away, it unbalances the whole social structure? But it would be worth attempting to see how far it stresses the super heroes, because the consequences of acquiescencing to villain urges, may be like giving into our baser elements, and then you wonder what the point is of the Law, (and testing of self) is for?

[Marvel Forever]

Well, I have pondered this question for many years and I keep coming back to the same answer. There simply must be a change in the Fantastic Four line-up. Now this does not necessarily mean that one or two of the founding members must go, though such is worthy of serious consideration. You could keep Reed, Ben, Johnny and Sue, while adding one or two new members. Regardless, there is no doubt in my mind that the original FF quartet is just not that popular anymore. Actually, my idea might be worthy of it's own thread?

[Sutekh]

I'm kind of bored with Franklin, so yeah, aging him up, or having him step adjacent to some sort of cosmic territory (perhaps his awesome potential is required to repair some sort of multiversal damage, and he has to transcend humanity and go become a cosmic entity, crashing with Owen Reese?) would feel better, for me. (And free up Sue to be something other than 'the mom.')

Right now there feels like there's a Fantastic Four shaped void that needs filling. Reed has, in the relatively recent past, suggested that there shouldn't *not* be a Fantastic Four, even for a second, when he recruited Scott Lang, Jennifer Walters, Medusa and Darla Deering to stand in for them, so it's inconsistent for him not to care that there isn't a Fantastic Four at present, even if he's not on it.

And while it runs the risk of retreading Thunderbolts ground, it could be interesting to see some villain-ish types attempt to claim the mantle, for far less sinister reasons than Zemo did. A group consisting of the Wizard (experimenting with the good-guy role out of sheer scientific curiosity/pragmatism, even if his heart isn't really in it), Sandman (in one of his various face turn phases), Dragon-Man (just doing what he's told) and Songbird (wondering why she has to be the moral center for teams like this, is she cursed?), could be interesting as a short 'filler' run that ends up serving as 'proof' that the 616 universe needs the *real* Fantastic Four back, and not just any four super-folk willing to operate out of 4 Freedoms Plaza.

[JackDaw]

Move Franklin and Valeria up a notch in age...I'd say mid teens for Franklin, 12ish for Val. Start with Johnny as responsible and mature (NB...no..that doesn't require removing all element of fun and enjoyment) and keep him that way. "The Johnny matures a bit story line" was interesting the first time around, gets a bit tiresome on 12th time out.

For goodness sake make Ben more obviously useful to overall team balance.

Yelling "Clobbering time", fighting for 5 minutes, and acting as comedy relief might be fine for some characters, not for greatest character in comics. Not necessary to make him even stronger (though he has slipped down comparative power stakes a lot)...but stop portraying the guy who was a test pilot and good enough company to be Reed's best friend as a wee bit thick. Make it obvious for example that he acts as team pilot, because he's much better at it than anybody else. And going on from that it would be easy to establish that he's better at controlling/ repairing complex machinery in field conditions than Reed.

Keep power levels for the main low-ish (e.g. Fine to establish that it's a fact that future Franklin will be amazingly powerful, and he may come back from future sometimes...but keep present day Franklin down to fairly low power levels.)

[Crimz]

Here are my changes in a less "wall of text" way:

The Team

• Much less focus on Reed (most stories, villains etc. are focused on him)
• More adventuring/exploring new things
• Less retreads of old storylines and villains (no Reed vs Doom for the 1000th time)
• Creation of new places, characters and concepts should be one of the priorities
• Create villains that consider the members other than Reed as their greatest enemy/rival
• Expand the team to be the Future Foundation with so there's an increased roster
• Increase the teams power so they don't have to rely on Reeds inventions

Reed Richards

• Doesn't solve every problem the team has, making the others look superfluous
• Has gotten over the science vs family thing
• Isn't the reason for every adventure the team goes on, other members could have a place they want to go
• No longer hides important things from teammates and treats them like equals instead of children

Susan Storm-Richards

• Becomes a doctor/surgeon to have a role on the team other than "just there", it suits her character and history
• Loves the adventure like her brother instead of going because she has to (The Storms should be thrill seekers at heart)
• Less focus on her being a mother as that isn't all she is
• More interactions and appearances outside of the team like the others get to

Johnnny Storm

• No more storylines about him having to mature, he already has
• His role should be the mechanic that helps Reed with his inventions, but is mainly on the teams vehicles and spacecrafts
• Increase his power to the level of when he had the cosmic control rod
• Reveal him to be bisexual (I wouldn't be upset if this never happens though)

Ben Grimm

• The pilot of the team and one of the best in the MU, can get them anywhere they want to go
• Increase his power so that he can be a challenge to the Hulk and other strong characters again

Franklin and Valeria

• Valeria actually sounds her age instead of an adult
• Franklin's power is not at a God-like level yet so that he is no longer their deus ex machina
• Age them up if that improves them and the story (I'm fine whether they age or don't)

Ben has the least changes because he needs the least amount of change as he's pretty great already, he just needs refinement.

[Mike]

A back to the basics approach.
Concentrate on the core four characters and their adventures.
Sorta like what John Byrne did in issue #232.
I would like to see Franklin preschool age and Valeria gone but I know that isn't going to happen. So keep them young and and out of the spotlight.

[MajorHoy]

A back to the basics approach.
Concentrate on the core four characters and their adventures.
Sorta like what John Byrne did in issue #232.
I would like to see Franklin preschool age and Valeria gone but I know that isn't going to happen. So keep them young and and out of the spotlight.

Actually, the way to do that is to REALLY go back to basics!

Find an adventure from the past when Reed and Sue aren't yet married (so no kids yet) and the original four members of the FF use Doc Doom's time machine/platform. Have it turn out that, in an untold moment, reality splits and a separate version of the FF instead are transported into our present-day time, only to be stranded here with no way back!
(Hey, if they can do that with the original X-Men, . . . )

[Digifiend]

Of course, that'd mean two Johnnys and two Bens running around.

I agree with the people saying that Franklin and Val need an age up. Franklin was born in the 1960s and per sliding timescale ought to be at least 12 years old - he was last stated to be eight. Isn't he meant to be roughly the same age as Katie and Jack from the Power Pack (the team Franklin was the fifth member of)? They're now in their early teens, certainly no younger than 12. As for Val, she's been stuck at 3 years old for over a decade - age her up by the same amount as Franklin.

Recruit new members to the Future Foundation. Maybe, instead of going back to villainy, this could be Doom's new role, as another teacher for them. New students could include several of the hyper-intelligent kid/teen heroes introduced in the last few years, if their current books get cancelled. We know they already rejected Moon Girl, but she's since proven herself in the field and Ben would probably vouch for her now. Incidentally, if Val was aged up they'd be close in age. Kid Kaiju has also been shown to have a relationship with the FF, as his family has a HERBIE.

Johnny should do double duty, staying with the Uncanny Avengers. He'd keep his current uniform and the other three would have individual outfits as well. The Avengers and X-Men don't wear exactly the same outfits, so why should the FF?

Sue should definitely have another role outside the team and family. In Time Runs Out, she'd joined SHIELD. Espionage is actually a good career for someone with her powerset.

Maybe Ben should finally get the ability to switch between Thing and human forms at will? His angst has always been about being stuck in his rocky form.

[Myetche]

Definitely get rid of Franklin's god-powers, and I mean FOR GOOD. No backsies!

It's bad enough the whole of reality bends over backwards for Reed, but giving him a deity as a son that can do it literally is just plain bad writing.

[pageturner]

Get rid of the four.
I have always hated set numbers on a team.

I agree with letting the kids age somewhere around 12 and 10. However put them in the background. It is great VAL is smart but the cuteness is played out.

[Jean-Michel]

I agree with the "back to basics" idea - and perhaps it could be possible with the forthcoming "Marvel Legacy" trend...

[Factor]

Here are my changes in a less "wall of text" way:

The Team

• Much less focus on Reed (most stories, villains etc. are focused on him)
• More adventuring/exploring new things
• Less retreads of old storylines and villains (no Reed vs Doom for the 1000th time)
• Creation of new places, characters and concepts should be one of the priorities
• Create villains that consider the members other than Reed as their greatest enemy/rival
• Expand the team to be the Future Foundation with so there's an increased roster
• Increase the teams power so they don't have to rely on Reeds inventions

Reed Richards

• Doesn't solve every problem the team has, making the others look superfluous
• Has gotten over the science vs family thing
• Isn't the reason for every adventure the team goes on, other members could have a place they want to go
• No longer hides important things from teammates and treats them like equals instead of children

Susan Storm-Richards

• Becomes a doctor/surgeon to have a role on the team other than "just there", it suits her character and history
• Loves the adventure like her brother instead of going because she has to (The Storms should be thrill seekers at heart)
• Less focus on her being a mother as that isn't all she is
• More interactions and appearances outside of the team like the others get to

Johnnny Storm

• No more storylines about him having to mature, he already has
• His role should be the mechanic that helps Reed with his inventions, but is mainly on the teams vehicles and spacecrafts
• Increase his power to the level of when he had the cosmic control rod
• Reveal him to be bisexual (I wouldn't be upset if this never happens though)

Ben Grimm

• The pilot of the team and one of the best in the MU, can get them anywhere they want to go
• Increase his power so that he can be a challenge to the Hulk and other strong characters again

Franklin and Valeria

• Valeria actually sounds her age instead of an adult
• Franklin's power is not at a God-like level yet so that he is no longer their deus ex machina
• Age them up if that improves them and the story (I'm fine whether they age or don't)

Ben has the least changes because he needs the least amount of change as he's pretty great already, he just needs refinement.

I agree with pretty much all of this.
I'd also like them to focus on each members' individuality. I think each of them should have a special side project and a different color scheme for their costume. (John would keep his current yellow, Ben's would be the red/orange from his GotG costume, Sue's would be white and Reed's would be the classic blue).