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  1. #61
    The Forever Walker remydat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malachi View Post
    I'm worried that when we get to where we wanted this comic will be over. Like the last episode of a tvshow or the last book in a series. Before the final fight the lovers finally solve their issues and have that kiss. Then the fight happens and the story ends.

    I want issues of a happy and overall funtioning Romy has adventures. The drama has been focused so long on their relationship that I'm more then ready to have the drama being placed in some other aspect on the story.

    I might also add that I think KT is doing a wonderful job on the story. She just needs to ask herself more questions like: "If I include Magneto in this comic what does the readers want from that appearence?" Not only what does the story dictate. Most readers would probably have told her that either you move on and not include him or he needs to be smacked around a bit, verbally and/or physically.

    The same with fights. With Rogue having WM's powers she's a powerhouse. Heck WM himself had the death fear aspect added because writers thought he was to powerful back in the avengers days. From a story point of view Rogue can clear up most fights by herself. Just punch it hard enough. Gambits powers have been written with a very sliding powerscale and in general he needs to be written more powerful not to just be a nuisance in fights while Rogue starts cleaning house. Sure with clever writting his affect would be more with his wits. But just look at JL or Avengers with CA or Batman. That balance is never easy. The easy solution would be him being someone who with a bit more deceit can take down the big guns. While still respecting the difference between Rogues powers and his.
    Yeah I guess I just expected the book to be about Romy not a continuation of let's deal with Rogue's issues. We already had a mini for that where Rogue supposedly got over her drama and yet the first 8 issues of this comic just seem to be rehashing stuff the mini was meant to resolve. Having said that, I would agree it is a well written story. KT is a talented writer. I just question her story choices as I think this horse has been beat enough.

    As for the fights, at least we are now seeing Gambit being clever like he was against Longshot. That scan that seemed to indicate a charged punch is one avenue to even the power scale. I always viewed Gambit has having a utility belt similar to say Batman where he had all kinds of objects to charge. So depending on the fight he may charge his fists, charge his kits, throw cards, throw spikes, or even have a gun or rifle for longer distance attacks. Basically a guy will to throw the kitchen sink at you in order to win a fight.
    It's hard for me to listen to someone not in my position. A caterpillar can't relate to what an eagle envisions.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malachi View Post
    I'm worried that when we get to where we wanted this comic will be over. Like the last episode of a tvshow or the last book in a series. Before the final fight the lovers finally solve their issues and have that kiss. Then the fight happens and the story ends.

    I want issues of a happy and overall funtioning Romy has adventures. The drama has been focused so long on their relationship that I'm more then ready to have the drama being placed in some other aspect on the story.

    I might also add that I think KT is doing a wonderful job on the story. She just needs to ask herself more questions like: "If I include Magneto in this comic what does the readers want from that appearence?" Not only what does the story dictate. Most readers would probably have told her that either you move on and not include him or he needs to be smacked around a bit, verbally and/or physically.

    The same with fights. With Rogue having WM's powers she's a powerhouse. Heck WM himself had the death fear aspect added because writers thought he was to powerful back in the avengers days. From a story point of view Rogue can clear up most fights by herself. Just punch it hard enough. Gambits powers have been written with a very sliding powerscale and in general he needs to be written more powerful not to just be a nuisance in fights while Rogue starts cleaning house. Sure with clever writting his affect would be more with his wits. But just look at JL or Avengers with CA or Batman. That balance is never easy. The easy solution would be him being someone who with a bit more deceit can take down the big guns. While still respecting the difference between Rogues powers and his.
    Smack Magneto for what? Saving Rogue's life or her always going to him when she needs a unapologetic friend who tells it like it is? This is 616 Rogue. Not some off brand fantasy version.

  3. #63
    The Forever Walker remydat's Avatar
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    I would agree. Mags is not the problem with Rogueneto as Mags owes Gambit nothing. It is Rogue that chose him. Mags need not ever have appeared in the book as there really is nothing to resolve between the two and no reason for Rogue to confide in him. All that was required was for her to tell Gambit that while she could have dated whomever she wanted at the time because they were broken up, her choice in Mags was a poor one. That is all that ever needed to be said but for whatever reason KT refused to have Rogue say it.
    It's hard for me to listen to someone not in my position. A caterpillar can't relate to what an eagle envisions.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by remydat View Post
    I would agree. Mags is not the problem with Rogueneto as Mags owes Gambit nothing. It is Rogue that chose him. Mags need not ever have appeared in the book as there really is nothing to resolve between the two and no reason for Rogue to confide in him. All that was required was for her to tell Gambit that while she could have dated whomever she wanted at the time because they were broken up, her choice in Mags was a poor one. That is all that ever needed to be said but for whatever reason KT refused to have Rogue say it.
    If she says that, after going back to him for help/advice...whatever...it paints Rogue as a idiot. That's a dangerous angle to play.

  5. #65
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    I thought Kelly did say that through Remy's words in the miniseries. Remy said "letting go of past mistakes" and Rogue didn't refute him ; she had didn't retort: being w/ Mags was NOT a mistake!

  6. #66
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    I posted a Tumblr post about why Rogue feels so indebted to Mags. It had been covered somewhat over the years here.

  7. #67
    The Forever Walker remydat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MichelleDiMera View Post
    If she says that, after going back to him for help/advice...whatever...it paints Rogue as a idiot. That's a dangerous angle to play.
    No my point is she shouldn't have gone back to him for help/advice. It is pretty immature to be sneaking around talking to your ex.

    Quote Originally Posted by smokey78 View Post
    I thought Kelly did say that through Remy's words in the miniseries. Remy said "letting go of past mistakes" and Rogue didn't refute him ; she had didn't retort: being w/ Mags was NOT a mistake!
    You don't see how that would appear to be a cop out? Why can't Rogue own up to it directly? Further, she tried to excuse it by saying she needed to see other people to figure out what she wanted. Yeah great. No one is saying you can't see other people. We are saying Mags probably isn't the best choice given the history. It would be like me telling my girlfriend, oh I need to experience other things before I can figure out if I want to be with you so I am going to go sleep with your sister now.
    Last edited by remydat; 02-15-2019 at 04:53 PM.
    It's hard for me to listen to someone not in my position. A caterpillar can't relate to what an eagle envisions.

  8. #68
    Incredible Member Romy Ship's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LegoLiz View Post
    Part 2

    Rogue needs to grow up. Poor girl. Not only do her powers need maturing, but also her relationship skills. We Rogue to hurry up and grow up, but can we give credit where credit is due and understand that she is trying to. For someone who is terrified of forever, she loved Gambit enough to marry him (and we say very clearly that she never loved anyone else enough to accept a previous and recent marriage proposal). Rogue does look like such a straggler when paired up with all-in Gambit, but let’s give her time. When she realized in the mini that it is time for her to commit and fight her instinctual and ingrained by her life’s circumstances fleeing survival skills, that mean it all works out and everything falls into place? Not only would that be a boring read, but it’s unrealistic. Gambit says it himself. He had to do a lot of growing to get where he is. He realized long ago he wanted a future with Rogue (he says it in the first rogue limited series, then when they broke up in X-Men #45, Harbour Speech, when they were without powers and on the road and they got into a fight with mutant teenagers…ah! too many times…). The mini was just like a few weeks/months ago (maybe not for us, but definitely for the newlyweds) so I think the fact she is planting her heels and trying to work through her issues is a huge sign that she loves Gambit. And isn’t it fair that in this situation she would be the one more insecure about the relationship and to question if love is enough? When you love someone, I think it is easier to be in Gambit’s role where you are willing to sacrifice everything for it. But on Rogue’s side, if you truly love someone, would you want them to? What if being with you puts the person you love most in danger (reminds me of X-Treme X-Men when Rogue didn’t want Gambit on the mission because the possibility of him being hurt would destroy her - much more than if she hurt anyone else she cared about). From Rogue’s perspective, wouldn’t you be haunted by the wondering how much easier Gambit’s life would be if he loved someone else? We all saw her biggest fear replayed over and over in this arc. Being with her right now is life and death. Like what if the bracelet/collar malfunctions? Do you have to recharge it (we’d be in big trouble if it was me and my always red blinking low-battery signs on my cell phone)? One small slip and he’d be dead. Is it wrong for Rogue to wonder that if the most horrible thing were to happen (i.e. her killing Gambit), she’d think back and wonder if love was worth it? Was love enough?

    I definitely say the pay-off is coming. Will Rogue step up and finally support her husband? Will she be willing to sacrifice the way he has for her? I say yes and I believe it’s coming in the Thieves Guild arc. This is an excellent opportunity because it’s a storyline driven by his past, life, family and responsibilities. Also, we are treading into a territory that is usually separate from Rogue or one she’s taken the morally high ground towards in the past. With how much Gambit has done for Rogue in the mini and in MMX, I can see this being the foundation where Rogue is willing to adjust her life and perspective to support her man. Especially since Gambit being a master thief will be one of the reason Rogue will be able to hopefully get control of her powers, thanks to the deal with Spiral. I am with you purplevit and Mateo3000 that I feel so starved in waiting to see Rogue declare her love more or show it in her actions. But I think this is deliberate. I bet Kelly is just masterfully weaving her web and when she hears us crying about the lack of love on Rogue’s part, she’s just like mojo/Mr. Burns and thinking “Excellent!” Come on, this issue pleased me so much because I needed more Gambit shine and got it (NOTE: I NEED MORE GAMBIT SHINE), so I figure this wait is the build-up to Rogue stepping up.

    Finally THANK YOU KELLY THOMPSON. I see KT as Marvel’s personal gift to those who waited so long for stories like this for Rogue and Gambit. I love the art (okay, yes, RomyShip, sometimes Rogue’s face is off), but the colours are so beautiful. We waited so long and MMX is the pay off. And they’re not done yet. PLEASE LET THERE BE MORE ISSUES AFTER THE THIEVES GUILD ARC!!! And Omegarogue is right. Please Kelly Thompson - write Rogue and Gambit forever. Please! While there are so many call-backs to the past, you bring a fresh and new approach. And it doesn't feel like rewriting history. You just know the characters so well that the references just pop up!

    I know I am full of empty promises. But my affirmation - this is the book where I will finally write to the X-Office. So sorry it's taken me so long.
    *SLOW CLAP*
    This was some kind of beautiful. BOTH POSTS. Thank you for taking the time out to create this wonderfully thought out post. I've noticed your absence on here... stupid life getting in the way of comic book time! I really wish you were on Tumblr. I would love to re-share this there.

    I found it interesting that KT tweeted the following: Want a peek at why it can be a bad idea for creators to listen too much to fans /reviews of their work? This week I've seen almost universal praise from fans for #MMX #8. Annnnnnd we also just got the worst review the book (and I personally?) have ever received. Same book.

    I really want to read this said "review". This was seriously the BEST issue and I can't believe it got dissed. The truth is you will never be able to please everyone. It's impossible.
    Quote Originally Posted by DearMachine View Post
    I feel as if, uh, little Remy would make an issue sell more than little Bruce.

  9. #69
    Incredible Member Romy Ship's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by remydat View Post
    I would agree. Mags is not the problem with Rogueneto as Mags owes Gambit nothing. It is Rogue that chose him. Mags need not ever have appeared in the book as there really is nothing to resolve between the two and no reason for Rogue to confide in him. All that was required was for her to tell Gambit that while she could have dated whomever she wanted at the time because they were broken up, her choice in Mags was a poor one. That is all that ever needed to be said but for whatever reason KT refused to have Rogue say it.
    After reading Uncanny #368 (someone asked about the issue where Remy says Rogue needs time to mourn Josephs's death and you linked us to it) it makes even less sense to me that Rogue ever got with Mags. Joseph was someone so special to her and Mags killed him... I mean, I get it... Joe was his clone but that whole Mags relationship makes zero sense to me on so many levels. I can't hold it against Rogue forever that some writer felt compelled to write a poorly written love triangle. It is what it is... in comics we will always have holes no matter how many retcons and other writers try to keep things (that don't make sense) within continuity. KT probably doesn't want to discard one of Rogues (unfortunately) only other relationships no matter how stupid or lousy it was. I give Kelly so much respect for writing these stories. It cannot be easy or as easy as we think it might be.
    Quote Originally Posted by DearMachine View Post
    I feel as if, uh, little Remy would make an issue sell more than little Bruce.

  10. #70
    The Forever Walker remydat's Avatar
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    Well at least you admit the problem. At the end of the day if some are more forgiving than I then so be it. That is your choice which you are free to have.

    Some people like the nostaglia. I personally just want something new about Romy and right now not getting it. All I see is the same Rogue so forgiving of everyone else especially Mags yet can't get past her issues with her relationship with Gambit.

    Gambit could have left the toilet seat up one time 10 years ago and this version of Rogue strikes me as a gal that would bring it up today as an unresolved problem between them.

    Meanwhile Mags could murder a bus full of babies and Rogue would still be inviting him over for tea and to discuss intimate details.
    Last edited by remydat; 02-16-2019 at 11:42 AM.
    It's hard for me to listen to someone not in my position. A caterpillar can't relate to what an eagle envisions.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romy Ship View Post
    After reading Uncanny #368 (someone asked about the issue where Remy says Rogue needs time to mourn Josephs's death and you linked us to it) it makes even less sense to me that Rogue ever got with Mags. Joseph was someone so special to her and Mags killed him... I mean, I get it... Joe was his clone but that whole Mags relationship makes zero sense to me on so many levels. I can't hold it against Rogue forever that some writer felt compelled to write a poorly written love triangle. It is what it is... in comics we will always have holes no matter how many retcons and other writers try to keep things (that don't make sense) within continuity. KT probably doesn't want to discard one of Rogues (unfortunately) only other relationships no matter how stupid or lousy it was. I give Kelly so much respect for writing these stories. It cannot be easy or as easy as we think it might be.
    The reason Joseph was special to her was because she thought he was Magneto without his memories...yes..when he went down at the end, she cared. But the VERY NEXT issue, she flew to Genosha to reason with Magneto...to try to understand why he went that far to gain attainment of Genosha...she kissed him. She cares more deeply for Magneto than Joseph...Magneto saved Rogue. She was finished..she was done and he gave her a 2nd chance at life. She's never gonna forget that part of him.

    I know the anti Rogneto fans want her to magically turn on Magneto but it doesnt make a lick of sense because Rogue tried to just talk to Magneto in X Men #1 and they tried to blow her out of the sky simply for being a mutant and AGAIN...Magneto spared her. She knows he's not evil nor perfect...and most importantly, she knows he's an asset in her life. Their connection is legitimate and its stood the test of time. 28 yrs deep now. It's no "love triangle ". It never was. Magneto and Rogue are close on their own...Magneto barely even acknowledges Remy LeBeau. He's the least of his concerns. He fights for mutant survival against bigotry and institutionalized racism..Remy usually cares about keeping up lies and falsehoods. Two different mindsets.
    Last edited by MichelleDiMera; 02-16-2019 at 11:59 AM.

  12. #72
    Incredible Member Romy Ship's Avatar
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    MichelleD


    I appreciate your insights on their relationship but we obviously have dif views on the Rogue / Mags and Rogue / Gambit ships...

    Remy has not been this way for a very long time... he has been through a lot of character changes since Antartica.

    I'm just going to agree to disagree on our stances. Thanks again for your input though.

    Quote Originally Posted by remydat View Post
    Well at least you admit the problem. At the end of the day if some are more forgiving than I then so be it. That is your choice which you are free to have.

    Some people like the nostaglia. I personally just want something new about Romy and right now not getting it. All I see is the same Rogue so forgiving of everyone else especially Mags yet can't get past her issues with her relationship with Gambit.

    Gambit could have left the toilet seat up one time 10 years ago and this version of Rogue strikes me as a gal that would bring it up today as an unresolved problem between them.

    Meanwhile Mags could murder a bus full of babies and Rogue would still be inviting him over for tea and to discuss intimate details.
    I completely understand where you are coming from about wanting something new. I'm a hopeless soul who is praying we are headed in a direction that can allow for Romy to get past the same ol' issues. I think Kelly needs to confront this within their marriage if they're ever going to survive... or Marvel will change their minds. Anything is entirely possible.

    I do hope we get a huge moment where Rogue gives as much as Remy has been giving.

    The way some writers write Rogue in regards to Mags you're not wrong about that last line. LOL.
    Quote Originally Posted by DearMachine View Post
    I feel as if, uh, little Remy would make an issue sell more than little Bruce.

  13. #73
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    Yeah, we can't have Rogue come across as an idiot, like her clearly admitting that was a mistake... even though real or important character development is admitting the mistakes you've made (not vaguely admitting them with a lame excuse), seeing them for what they really are, trying to correct them and to never come close to repeating them again. Like what remydat said, it wouldn't have taken much for a scene like that. However, I think user bitchin’ on tumblr makes some interesting points on Rogue's choice.
    https://mr-and-mrs-lebeau.tumblr.com...the-thing-with

    I've never been able to see how or why Joseph was special to Rogue in anyway, when you compare all the times she spent with Gambit, and what those events meant to them, compare that with Joseph and even mag... it's minuscule and meaningless. But like with Pulse, he was only there to create a love triangle. Mag's reasons for fighting have been outdated for decades, they weren't even remotely relevant during the relaunch of the X-Men title in the 90s. It's not the 1960s anymore and the US is not apartheid Africa, the US is actually the most tolerant country on the planet.
    Last edited by III-III; 02-20-2019 at 10:39 PM.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by III-III View Post
    Yeah, we can't have Rogue come across as an idiot, like her clearly admitting that was a mistake... even though real or important character development is admitting the mistakes you've made (not vaguely admitting them with a lame excuse), seeing them for what they really are, trying to correct them and to never come close to repeating them again. Like what remydat said, it wouldn't have taken much for a scene like that. However, I think user bitchin’ on tumblr makes some interesting points on Rogue's choice.
    https://mr-and-mrs-lebeau.tumblr.com...the-thing-with

    I've never been able to see how or why Joseph was special to Rogue in anyway, when you compare all the times she spent with Gambit, and what those events meant to them, compare that with Joseph and even mag... it's minuscule and meaningless. But like with Pulse, he was only there to create a love triangle. Mag's reasons for fighting have been outdated for decades, they weren't even remotely relevant during the relaunch of the X-Men title in the 90s. It's not the 1960s anymore and the US is not apartheid Africa, the US is actually the most tolerant country on the planet.
    Tolerant? Not to Blacks and immigrants. Lol. This country has a near Hitler level hatred of people of African descent.

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