Minorities in Comics and Other Media, etc

[Username taken]

We're witnessing a repeat of the whole DCEU drama from a few years ago. Big hotly anticipated movie comes out and proves more divisive than the studio intended (though Last Jedi did way better than BVS), so the studio panics and very hastily tries to "course correct" the sequel to make everyone happy while also meeting that staked out release date. Unsurprisingly, the end result is not very good and it doesn't do much to win over people who didn't like the last one.

I'd say it points less to problems with Star Wars (though it's clear this is a very troubled franchise right now) and more to do with the entire annual franchise film market right now, with the exception of Marvel and maybe the Fast and the Furious.

Exactly.

Considering how much TLJ made, Disney should have continued on the path they set themselves on. I hated TLJ but they have made a creative decision and they should commit to it. Listening to fans is good but pandering to fans is never, ever a good idea (I would argue that doing everything to move away from the prequel trilogy itself was a mistake).

That being said, I hated Finn constantly pining over Rey in the movie. The optics of it isn't good and it makes Finn look like an idiot when he's screaming out "Rey!!!!" when she's fighting for her life. Like, what exactly was he going to say to her in that position???

Finn being force sensitive was call and all but ultimately i feel his character was wasted in this trilogy.

[MindofShadow]

Well, TFA renewed interest in SW movies and TLJ was the highest grossing movie of 2017 despite the fan backlash . The only blunder she seems to have on her record is Solo and maybe TROS but we'll have to see how this pans out.

TFA was going to make whatever it was going to make regardless. It was the return of SW and this time under the Disney hype machine. That movie was fool proof. Hell, look how hyped Phantom Menace was at the it came out and that movie was dogshit.

TLJ made tons of money but also 700 million less than TFA.

People forget the original trilogy wasn't planned either. The only SW movie trilogy that was planned was the prequels.

It is disingenuous to compare the OT to the ST. Completely different era of movies, they had no idea SW was going to be a thing.

Disney knew SW was huge (hence the price tag) and always planned on doing a trilogy. And then never even bothered to map it out despite wanting to pump them out every 2 years.

Kelly Marie Tran's reduced role in The Rise of Skywalker has drawn criticism.

I really didn't like the character so good.

I hope they never revisit the Skywalkers again. I really wish they'd built an entirely new story from the ground up.

The ST should have been set around an adaptation Yuuzhan Vong War with Luke's new jedi and Han's doing Han's stuff

Allows the old guard to shine for the old heads while introducing the younger cast the carry Star Wars later.

That way you have a non-sith bad buys but it still allows jedi to do jedi stuff. And, if they wanted, they could use the war as an excuse for the darkside for hte force to rise again for future trilogies

They still could have easily killed off all the old guard, but this time doing it after letting them SW nerds nerd out a bit.

I mean, I am not a huge SW fan, but I still wanted to see Luke wreck **** for a bit lol.

I'd much rather see a movie based on Tie-Fighter, Dark Forces, or dealing with a completely new threat from beyond the outer rim.

I imagine we will. They messed up the Jedi stuff so bad idk how you revisit it anytime soon.

We're witnessing a repeat of the whole DCEU drama from a few years ago. Big hotly anticipated movie comes out and proves more divisive than the studio intended (though Last Jedi did way better than BVS), so the studio panics and very hastily tries to "course correct" the sequel to make everyone happy while also meeting that staked out release date. Unsurprisingly, the end result is not very good and it doesn't do much to win over people who didn't like the last one.

I'd say it points less to problems with Star Wars (though it's clear this is a very troubled franchise right now) and more to do with the entire annual franchise film market right now, with the exception of Marvel and maybe the Fast and the Furious.

Both studios had weak leaders at the top who make hasty reactionary decisions.

Finn being force sensitive was call and all but ultimately i feel his character was wasted in this trilogy.

That's because he should have been force sensitive from the get go. Dude should have been the main character. A former stolen child turned stormtrooper who breaks his programming to be a leader of the rebellion as a Jedi in training is such an easy movie to make.

They could have easily had Luke train Finn and Rey. And then it makes the fights make more since... the much more powerful and trained Kylo vs two newbs. instead of "rey knows everything bc" reason

[Surf]

I had Lobot.



I'd like to think if Solo was successful, he would have been the next Star Wars character to get a spinoff movie.

Lobot: A Star Wars Story

Yes. The weirdest one I wanted and got was a Gamorrean Guard. I remember the sitters dog we went to that summer like to chew on things and we lost a couple of action figure limbs during that time. My GG lost a hand and I was upset but then realized he kinda looked cooler with a missing limb. I did want that bounty hunter that looked like a bi-ped dinosaur. All he did was kind a sneer and I thought he was dope as hell.

When I was a kid my Mom insisted either me or my brother get a Lando, this was post Empire and pre-Return so he was still a traitor to the 'Rebels'and we were the rebels right. This was a struggle and years later I got what she was meaning. We weren't allowed to have G.I. Joe's and even with the 3 or 4 brothas in that toyline, Black characters we few and far between. What helped was Star Wars had Wookies and Droids and guys in masks so we didn't have a whole cache full of Anglo lookin' figures that got the heavy play rotation. I bring it up because I don't know how this younger generation takes Finn knowing what their parents know. Lando redeemed by the time Jedi came out but do adolescents even play with action figures like that nowadays? I know the market and It ain't 7 and 8 year olds anymore. As an adult after getting TFA cliff notes on the Stormtrooper defector I still haven't sat through it and Finn didn't have to be Force sensitive at all to me, he could have just been a badass and that's not what it was and quite the opposite. Sucks for me I guess, my 5 year old has an idea of Star Wars but it's all from commercials and couple of Happy Meals so it's not like it was, lots of choices for kids and she don't need a Rey.

[Nate Grey]

I feel like I brought this up a loooonnnngggg time ago, but if not I'll bring it up again since we're talking Star Wars toys. I remember seeing this guy at Toys R Us maybe a year before it closed down:



I regret not getting him. Apparently he had one brief scene and wasn't even named at the time but hey that's all it takes to get a Star Wars toy.

[leo619]

I'll be honest, I just watched it this weekend and I enjoyed it. It was my favorite of the three for certain, though it definitely had it flaws. Finn was by far the most competent he's ever been, plus he was clearly revealed to be spoilers:

force sensitive

end of spoilers I'm pretty sure that would have develop if that plot was expanded more in the last jedi. The fact that we had 3 black people in one film was awesome.

I also definitely expected there to be a backlash. I expected folks who loved last Jedi would hate this film, but I believe they did the right thing. This movie was a good reset into what made a star wars movie, and most importantly for Disney, help with resetting fan expectation when Lucasfilm goes back to the well for another star wars film.

[MindofShadow]

How was it clear?

It was so "clear" that Abrams had to tell everyone after the fact.

Hinted, sure. Definitely not clear

[Vic Vega]

Did anybody else think that the only reason Jannah and Zora Bliss (otherwise known as Booba Fett) are in this movie was so they could kill any speculation on Finn and Poe possibly being gay?

[Agent Z]

TFA was going to make whatever it was going to make regardless. It was the return of SW and this time under the Disney hype machine. That movie was fool proof. Hell, look how hyped Phantom Menace was at the it came out and that movie was dogshit.

TLJ made tons of money but also 700 million less than TFA.

The second movie in a Star Wars Trilogy always makes less than the one before it. TLJ was still the highest grossing movie of the year and it making less money than TFA simply says that movie was lightning in a bottle not that TLJ was bad.

It is disingenuous to compare the OT to the ST. Completely different era of movies, they had no idea SW was going to be a thing.

Just saying, there's precedent.

Disney knew SW was huge (hence the price tag) and always planned on doing a trilogy. And then never even bothered to map it out despite wanting to pump them out every 2 years. [/QUOTE]

Well caving in to fan backlash and ignoring TLJ's success didn't help.

[jetengine]

Did anybody else think that the only reason Jannah and Zora Bliss (otherwise known as Booba Fett) are in this movie was so they could kill any speculation on Finn and Poe possibly being gay?

Yes. Tons of people have said that

[KOSLOX]

We're witnessing a repeat of the whole DCEU drama from a few years ago. Big hotly anticipated movie comes out and proves more divisive than the studio intended (though Last Jedi did way better than BVS), so the studio panics and very hastily tries to "course correct" the sequel to make everyone happy while also meeting that staked out release date. Unsurprisingly, the end result is not very good and it doesn't do much to win over people who didn't like the last one.

I'd say it points less to problems with Star Wars (though it's clear this is a very troubled franchise right now) and more to do with the entire annual franchise film market right now, with the exception of Marvel and maybe the Fast and the Furious.

I loved The Last Jedi, the democratization of the Force is much more interesting than a having the Palpatine/Skywalker oligarchy. It wasn't a perfect movie but it actually set up the series to swerve in a vastly different direction. RoS was just fanservice and felt really, really hollow.

I genuinely don't get how people think RoS "good". I'd say it's a a B- movie in it's most inspired moments, but generally a hard C.

[Handsome men don't lose fights]

How was it clear?

It was so "clear" that Abrams had to tell everyone after the fact.

Hinted, sure. Definitely not clear

Well, Finn was reading minds and having super-accurate hunches, and knowing things he couldn't possibly know (Like Rey fighting Palpatine). But people still didn't want to believe he was force sensitive, so Abrahams had to say it outright.

All the Stormtrooper exiles they met at the Deathstar are Force sensitives. They're the building blocks for Rey's new Jedi order.

[skyvolt2000]

Did anybody else think that the only reason Jannah and Zora Bliss (otherwise known as Booba Fett) are in this movie was so they could kill any speculation on Finn and Poe possibly being gay?

YES. Folks wanted to happen before the first movie came out.

That's because he should have been force sensitive from the get go. Dude should have been the main character. A former stolen child turned stormtrooper who breaks his programming to be a leader of the rebellion as a Jedi in training is such an easy movie to make.

If TFA came out AFTER Black Panther....

No way Disney was going to make him the main guy despite his story being good enough for a movie let alone a trilogy by itself.
If certain folks at Disney had issues with Black Panther being made-I am sure Ike would have made sure Finn wasn't going to be the main.

That toxic fandom was ready to act a fool in a violent way if he was the main person.

It is disingenuous to compare the OT to the ST. Completely different era of movies, they had no idea SW was going to be a thing.

Disney KNEW what they were getting. Dark Horse let alone the Star Wars novel gave them a blueprint of what they could do. Stuff that expanded beyond the Icon three.
We saw diverse casts and new folks galore.

Stuff that TRUE Star Wars fans not the bigots who lost it when they saw Finn would know.

Finn being force sensitive was call and all but ultimately i feel his character was wasted in this trilogy.

He was suppose to get "US" in that theater. Nevermind most of us were going anyway.
Then came Moses AKA Black Panther-who had grown men crying, kids doing the holy dance and folks dressing up like they were going to the Oscars.
Then Miles Morales showed up and proved everybody could be Spider-Man.

So you had Black Panther, Finn & Miles Morales. Black Panther & Miles had books galore about them with way more merchandise than Finn.
Finn like Justice League Cyborg didn't stand a chance. The Where is Finn hashtag got buried by whereisrose and how toxic white males are.

SO someone with a great story gets buried and no one is going to tell it. The story of almost every black male character.

[leo619]

How was it clear?

It was so "clear" that Abrams had to tell everyone after the fact.

Hinted, sure. Definitely not clear

It started out as hinted, but became more clear towards the end of the film. Everyone I talked to all know that about finn now, what seal the deal was when spoilers:

Him knowing the right star destroyer and feeling when Rey temporarily passed away.

end of spoilers

[leo619]

Did anybody else think that the only reason Jannah and Zora Bliss (otherwise known as Booba Fett) are in this movie was so they could kill any speculation on Finn and Poe possibly being gay?

I wouldn't say that about Finn, Finn from even the force awakens appeared to have a crush on Rey and had tons of chemistry. In the last jedi, there was hinted at with a relationship with Rose. So canon wise, Finn has regularly been depicted as mostly straight. Poe on the other hand, yeah, I had that lingering thought as well. I also believed they had Kylo Ren and Rey kiss to kill speculation between Finn and Rey. So double whammy.

[leo619]

I loved The Last Jedi, the democratization of the Force is much more interesting than a having the Palpatine/Skywalker oligarchy. It wasn't a perfect movie but it actually set up the series to swerve in a vastly different direction. RoS was just fanservice and felt really, really hollow.

I genuinely don't get how people think RoS "good". I'd say it's a a B- movie in it's most inspired moments, but generally a hard C.

It's because we're viewing it differently, I genuinely don't get how people who have diversity as a strong point can view The Last Jedi as a good movie. For me it was a solid pass/no thank you and was one of the worst depiction of a PoC I've seen in a action flick. And the changes just for changes sake was like TLJ wanted to be MoS of the Star Wars universe, and we all know how MoS was viewed. Just like Justice League, etc. It all feels hollow but for the opposite reason.