Good point about the non-linear Doom with the Beyonders power reaching back in time to collect as many realities as he wanted during Incursions. I still like my 22 realities forming Battleworld though.
But there is a discrepancy on the amounts of realities in Battleworld, as there is more than 22 realities.
Last edited by jackolover; 08-17-2015 at 09:39 PM.
I still think much of Hickman's story is related to Sumerian mythology. There is an astonishing array of gods and demigods, often warring with each other. Beyonders -> Builders -> humans seems similar to Sumerian myths where lesser gods grow tired of drudgery and create humans, then the higher gods decide to destroy everything with a flood. White space seems like the salt waters of chaos from which everything arose, whereas I think there is a dream space such as the Builders Superflow and Franklin Richards dreamverse that is the equivalent of fresh water that nourishes life. And surviving the flood there are rafts, that is, an ark.
Now this being comics, the rebel Gilgamesh instead of merely seeking immortality is able to wrest from the gods the equivalent of the Tablets of Destiny and to rule the cosmos himself.
Last edited by jphamlore; 08-17-2015 at 01:51 AM.
The only reason I knew of any Sumerian connection is that at the very beginning of Hickman's New Avengers story, Black Swan is apparently speaking in Sumerian.
For the Sumerians, apparently the story almost always ends in suffering, although I think Gilgamesh eventually becomes a judge of the dead. Unfortunately the stories are literally in fragments of tablets with giant parts of them lost. From Gilgamesh's perspective the flood was a distant lost legend that he rediscovered in his journeys.
The Sumerian view of the afterlife was almost complete pessimism, the underworld being a terrible place of suffering and decay. If by chance its denizens could escape, the Earth would be overwhelmed by a horde of zombies.
I finally had the time to read #5 and I loved it. Yes, it's a mostly expository issue but for SW to function as a story, this chapter had to exist and the mechanics behind what Doom has accomplished had to be revealed. Not everyone has read Hickman's Avengers run and even for those who have, a brief refresher was welcome. And the level of characterization Hickman brings to Doom, Molecule Man and Valeria ensured that this wasn't just an info dump. And even if it was, Ribic's art would make it the most gorgeous info dump ever rendered on a comic page.
But even though this was something of a breather or an interlude, the final pages nicely ramped things up for the major conflicts of SW's back end and the inevitable unraveling of Doom's world. Valeria's determination to go against Doom's wishes and Thanos' smile as he gazes at the SHIELD were priceless.
I completely agree with you. One could argue Phoenixclops was the strongest of the raftees and Doom snapped his neck no problem. I don't think it's strength Doom fears from the raftees presence, but what you have mentioned. It's been repeated various times throughout this series that people in Battleworld strongly believe in Doom and believe in his power, that he is god. What is the common thread with all the people that oppose Doom? They don't believe he is god. That is why they are dangerous. They can stir disbelief in the residents of Battleworld.
That's all Secret Wars has been so far, same goes with Avengers Time Runs Out. This series has just been one long boring convoluted mess where character drone on endlessly. Does the action in this series take place outside of this series or something stupid like that? Because every time it builds up to what feels like it's going to be some big fight, you don't get anything...guess they had to cut that stuff so characters could babble-on.
Even this issue didn't have to feel so damn slow. Something like Molecule Man killing himself over and over again in fights with himself could be presented in a very cool visually interesting way, but it's not...nor is really anything in this series. It's some nice art, but this is a very boring story told in a very boring way in some very boring looking locations.
Baron Sinister does not seem particularly respectful of anyone let alone regarding them as a god, and he is apparently plotting against Doom after capturing one of the Raftees.
As far as having the ability to sustain Battleworld with his willpower, there is another person from Hickman's Fantastic Four run who was being specifically trained by his future self to have limitless imagination: Franklin Richards.
If all Molecule Men across the Multiverse equals one giant bomb, I speculate all the Franklin Richards across the Multiverse are the Dreamverse that can reboot this Multiverse.
Last edited by jphamlore; 08-17-2015 at 09:39 PM.
The only issue with that is that just as there were limited numbers of Reed and Doom from Hickman's run in Fantastic Four, the council of Reeds was mostly formed by Reeds that abandoned the family -- so there's no guarantee that there are multiple Franklins.
I think one of the points of Hickman's FF run was that this set of Reed, Franklin, Valeria and Doom was unique in the multiverse.
Man, you said it. The main series has been a slog, and I expected it based on Hickman's Avengers work, but I've been having fun with a few of the minis. Everyone seems content with sifting through the muddy details, but I've just not been given enough of a reason to care. It's not a total loss though, and it'll all be swept aside in a few months!
Actually technically there was another doom in Ultimate Manhattan, but I doubt Doom let him into battleworld. Hickman's FF run didn't confirm that all of the Reeds and Dooms were dead. Just all the Reeds from the council, and their corresponding Dooms. There could have been other Reeds that didn't build a bridge, etc, just that Doom would never let them cross the threshold of his Kingdom, nor would he allow their Doom. The only person Hickman confirmed to be unique in the multiverse is Nathaniel.