Thor's iffy. He's a gigantic beefcake that the women all swoon over and he saves the world often... but he also proclaims himself a legitimate god and the average citizen is REALLY iffy about that. At best he's a liar and at worst he's insane. That was one thing that they did pretty well in the Ultimates book. But yeah, between 'false gods', supervillains, and outright terrorists... The Avengers reputation comes and goes.
Meh... not really. A lot of those never even wore a costume and were only there for 3 issues tops. Wolverine, Hulk, Ghost Rider, weren't even sanctioned or atttached to the FF. They just got called that as a marketing ploy. If you don't wear the '4' you don't count. Most of the public wouldn't even have known about them.
She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel/she-thing count. Probably Blank Panther and Storm... but the rest? They were little more than a guest star for an issue or two.
Reed saw them as members and had them in the "all members" story. Plus the new ff was in more then one story. Why do you need to wear a 4 outfit? Luke cage didn't. Thing girl didn't. Ant-man didn't. thundra didn't. Herbie didn't. Heck the thing didn't have a 4 outfit for a long time!
Did storm and black panther wear a 4 outfit? I can't remember.
If they showed up in that "all members" story they are members as reed saw them as members.
Spider-Man and Scott Lang wore the numbers.
"Cable was right!"
Spidey didn't at first and as for ant-man-
I don't see a 4 on that outfit! He didn't have one at first.
[IMG][/IMG]
Which is kind of my point. Most of them were never 'family'. Ghost Rider, Hulk? Never Family. Luke Cage? Never Family. He was 'hired' for 2 issues to pick up the slack till Reed could get Ben a 'Thing Suit' and the moment Ben had some strength again, Luke was out the door.
She-hulk, She-thing... absolutely. Spider-man and Black Panther... sure, They're 'family' with decades long ties.... Storms kind of an 'in-law.' without BP in the mix, she's got no connection. Ant-man I can't say anything about, I missed those issues.
Luke Cage? Hulk? Wolverine? Ghost Rider? Not Family. Usually ENEMIES. Between Wolvie's face slashing and Hulk's epic beatdowns... None of them are invited to Thanksgiving.
And logan went to thing to say sorry and they went out and had drinks together after they talked. Hulk and thing may not get along that much but thing did stand up from hulk at one time when the army attacked him and every year they have a arm wrestling contest. (this lead to a funny story with a bunch of bad guys wanting to attack them but both ignored the bad guys.) Ant-man and cassie got along well with the ff. They even lived with the ff while there. As did lyja and kristoff.Between Wolvie's face slashing
You really want to talk about mixed up members try to figure out who is a defender. With the "no team" rule and "defender for a day" saying anyone can just join many think ANY one who helped the defenders on a mission is a member and others don't! Some sites list wasp and man-thing as members and others don't. The wiki members page changes all the time! What a mess!
Last edited by Gaastra; 09-17-2020 at 07:08 PM.
The FF because they don't change their roster that much.
I think the Avengers despite Marvel wanting us to think, in story that the FF is the most loved and respected. But FF has gotten into a lot of trouble especially due to Reed, even the Shiar went after him for helping Galactus. They were actually seen as odd and troublesome and saw them as responsible for the more bizarre things going on.
Edit: Also they ere most likely to team up with the X-Men then the Avengers would.
I think the Avengers lost a bit status around the Civil War time when we had Avengers, Dark Avengers, Secret Avengers, Mighty Avengers, Great Lakes Avengers, anybody and everyone Avengers... Once 'everyone' is called an Avenger, it loses a lot of the prestige that it had.
I thought their actions in Civil War were what cost them some of that respect. I mean, when you have Iron Man and those who sided with him going full-tilt fascist, locking up anyone that objects to or resists registration in a Negative Zone prison where they don't have to heed Earth's laws against cruel and unusual treatment of prisoners, then unleashing a weaponized Thor clone that goes out of control and murders Bill Foster, yet somehow nobody really pays for that . . .
The spider is always on the hunt.
Even discounting Civil War, the Avengers have been more likely to draw serious public ire over their history. Their membership has brought out bigots of every stripe against them. Further, their large and variable roster makes it easy for doubters to characterize them as a dangerous, private vigilante army.