Future Remains Uncertain for a New "Marvel vs. Capcom" Game

[daisetsu100]

They're completely different teams with completely different people overseeing them.

true but all under one company using same company resources. also the risk of putting out a game with same genre with another they're supposed to also support for long-term, they might end up cannibalizing each other and they have too much bad rep. its important to note that SFV initially didnt perform well as theyd hope. so theyre doing the long run with it. unless they're all in with fighting games, or just really willing to take up losses for the sake of the fans, i just dont see it happening yet. maybe after 5 more years.

[simbob4000]

true but all under one company using same company resources. also the risk of putting out a game with same genre with another they're supposed to also support for long-term, they might end up cannibalizing each other and they have too much bad rep. its important to note that SFV initially didnt perform well as theyd hope. so theyre doing the long run with it. unless they're all in with fighting games, or just really willing to take up losses for the sake of the fans, i just dont see it happening yet. maybe after 5 more years.

They aren't even both made under one company. Street Fighter 4 & 5 were developed by Capcom and Dimps. Marvel vs Capcom 3 was developed by Capcom and Eighting. If a new Marvel vs Capcom, or just Marvel game came out, it wouldn't be happening tomorrow, it would be a few years from now if nothing at all has been happening with that at Capcom already. Street Fighter 5 is also exclusive to just one system.

[KCJ506]

If by some slim chance there ever is another MVC, the Marvel side would most likely consist of characters that will be appearing in the MCU or have already within the past few years. Characters like Black Panther, Black Widow, Loki, Ultron, Thanos, Scarlet Witch, Quicksilver, Star-Lord, Groot and maybe even some characters from the live action Marvel shows like Daredevil, Luke Cage and Punisher. So the people that are still stuck in the 90s and want the roster to consist mostly of X-men characters and complained about the MVC3 roster not having as many X-men characters as MVC2 most likely won't be satisfied again.

[simbob4000]

If by some slim chance there ever is another MVC, the Marvel side would most likely consist of characters that will be appearing in the MCU or have already within the past few years. Characters like Black Panther, Black Widow, Loki, Ultron, Thanos, Scarlet Witch, Quicksilver, Star-Lord, Groot and maybe even some characters from the live action Marvel shows like Daredevil, Luke Cage and Punisher. So the people that are still stuck in the 90s and want the roster to consist mostly of X-men characters and complained about the MVC3 roster not having as many X-men characters as MVC2 most likely won't be satisfied again.

It would probably still have just as many X-Men as MvC3 if the cast was still around the same size. Wolverine isn't not going to be there, same is probably true of Deadpool, Magneto, and Storm. Capcom apparently fought Marvel to have Sentinel and Storm in MvC3, so there's two X-Men right there that Capcom at least wanted kept in the series. I'm almost surprised some of the MCU characters that weren't there in MvC3, like Loki; because even in MvC3 Marvel was push MCU centric characters. You also did name off two X-Men characters in that group.

I wouldn't say those people are stuck in the '90s. The '90s are just the last time people actually read comic books, weirdly this seems to be an idea that people still reading comics don't seem to get; even though they clearly all know not as many people read comics now.

[Immortal Weapon]

It would probably still have just as many X-Men as MvC3 if the cast was still around the same size. Wolverine isn't not going to be there, same is probably true of Deadpool, Magneto, and Storm. Capcom apparently fought Marvel to have Sentinel and Storm in MvC3, so there's two X-Men right there that Capcom at least wanted kept in the series. I'm almost surprised some of the MCU characters that weren't there in MvC3, like Loki; because even in MvC3 Marvel was push MCU centric characters. You also did name off two X-Men characters in that group.

I wouldn't say those people are stuck in the '90s. The '90s are just the last time people actually read comic books, weirdly this seems to be an idea that people still reading comics don't seem to get; even though they clearly all know not as many people read comics now.

They are stuck in the 90s as they always request characters that were relevant in that time period. Those fans would freak out if Capcom brings back Venom only for it to be Flash Thompson instead of Eddie Brock.

[daisetsu100]

flash venom would be fine. 90s kids can ask for carnage if they want the old brock venom.
if hulk turns out to be cho hulk, im out. id rather they bring back the professor hulk style they used in the 90s games.
if they would use some synergy between the game and comics, we'd probably have old man logan. x23 in full wolverine.
they should just use a multiverse/secret was/battleworld/coc plot device so we can whoever or whatever version of which character.

[KCJ506]

You also did name off two X-Men characters in that group.

Who the twins? Well they're mostly involved with the Avengers as well. And if they were put in a vs game it would mainly due to their appearances in the MCU.

They are stuck in the 90s as they always request characters that were relevant in that time period. Those fans would freak out if Capcom brings back Venom only for it to be Flash Thompson instead of Eddie Brock.

Exactly. If a character that wasn't in some cartoon in the 90s gets in, they'll be labeled as some "obscure nobody" by these people. Fighting games based on licensed franchises have the tendency of promoting current or upcoming materials. Hence games like X-men COTA and X-men vs Street Fighter. At the time, Marvel was trying to push X-men as it was the most popular Marvel cartoon at the time. Which is also why MVC2 ended up with so many X-men characters. And with MVC3, they promoted tv shows, movies and comics. Exact same scenario.

I really do have to wonder if the people that hate lesser known characters being in crossover games so much play the Smash games. And if so, what were their reactions when they saw Captain Falcon and Ness in the original or the Fire Emblem characters in Melee.

[simbob4000]

Who the twins? Well they're mostly involved with the Avengers as well. And if they were put in a vs game it would mainly due to their appearances in the MCU.

They seem to have more to do with the X-Men, to the point that they're not showing up in some of those mobile games that don't have X-Men. And it isn't like they would look like their MCU versions.

Exactly. If a character that wasn't in some cartoon in the 90s gets in, they'll be labeled as some "obscure nobody" by these people. Fighting games based on licensed franchises have the tendency of promoting current or upcoming materials. Hence games like X-men COTA and X-men vs Street Fighter. At the time, Marvel was trying to push X-men as it was the most popular Marvel cartoon at the time. Which is also why MVC2 ended up with so many X-men characters. And with MVC3, they promoted tv shows, movies and comics. Exact same scenario.

This point is so extremely stupid to even try and make when two of the most popular characters in that series were Blackheart and Shuma-Gorath. Shuma-Gorath is so damn obscure that most comic book fans didn't even know who he was when he showed up in that game. People that read comic books probably saw those two in Marvel Super Heroes before the actual comics.

Even Children of the Atom didn't have the most well know characters from the cartoon in it. There was no Rogue, no Gambit, no Sabertooth, no Jubilee, no Mr. Sinister, no Bishop, no Mystique, no Nightcrawler, no Jean, no Beast. Two of the characters on the villain side are in like what, one episode of that cartoon? The lineup of that game sure doesn't look like the opening of the X-Men cartoon, and it pretty easily could have been made up of those characters.

I really do have to wonder if the people that hate lesser known characters being in crossover games so much play the Smash games. And if so, what were their reactions when they saw Captain Falcon and Ness in the original or the Fire Emblem characters in Melee.

Ness is the main character of a huge cult game that even if someone hasn't played it is still widely know to gamers. Captain Falcon had a game on Nintendos biggest system. The Fire Emblem games were very well know, even if they weren't big here.

[simbob4000]

They are stuck in the 90s as they always request characters that were relevant in that time period. Those fans would freak out if Capcom brings back Venom only for it to be Flash Thompson instead of Eddie Brock.

Here's the thing, Eddie Brock Venom is Venom. When someone's playing a video game, they want to play as the iconic version of a character, not whatever version is around the year the game is coming out. Flash Thompson Venom is also a whole different style of Venom, his gameplay would be based around using weapons, which would be nothing at all like the Venom in MvC2. The two characters also look completely different from one another. Eddie Brock Venom is also the more relevant verson of the character, if Venom is showing up in movies, or cartoons, or other video games, that's the version they're going with.

If they put Kraven the Hunter into the game, people would probably want the original version too, because nobody really gives a **** about the other two. If MvC3 had come out in 2002, people probably also wouldn't want Ultimate Green Goblin, because he neither looks like, nor would he play anything like normal Green Goblin. Likewise, people wouldn't want Iron Man Norman Osborn over Green Goblin Norman Osborn. Because why would anyone? You've already got a character there that looks and plays like Iron Man, his name is Iron Man.

[KCJ506]

Ness is the main character of a huge cult game that even if someone hasn't played it is still widely know to gamers. Captain Falcon had a game on Nintendos biggest system. The Fire Emblem games were very well know, even if they weren't big here.

Both Falcon and Ness are more known for being in the Smash games than in their own games. Earthbound sold like crap in 94/95 and barely anyone in the west cared for it until Ness appeared in Smash. If you mention Captain Falcon to the average gamer, the first thing that will most likely come to their mind would be "Falcon Punch!" Which originated in Smash. If the internet was as big like it is now back when Smash 64 came out, there would be arguments such as why a "practically unknown racecar driver who has never been shown to fight" would be a "wasted slot" and that either Bowser, Diddy Kong, Meta Knight, King Dedede should have gotten instead. I guarantee it.

And yes the Fire Emblem games were well known beforehand......in JAPAN that is. Barely anyone in the US knew about the series at the time and had they not put in Marth and Roy there, it would still be a Japan exclusive series. Hell Roy was a nobody who made it to Melee just to promote his game... his popularity didn't start until then and these days people who like him like him based off of his appearance in Melee than they did the actual Fire Emblem game he appeared in.

Here's the thing, Eddie Brock Venom is Venom. When someone's playing a video game, they want to play as the iconic version of a character, not whatever version is around the year the game is coming out. Flash Thompson Venom is also a whole different style of Venom, his gameplay would be based around using weapons, which would be nothing at all like the Venom in MvC2. The two characters also look completely different from one another. Eddie Brock Venom is also the more relevant verson of the character, if Venom is showing up in movies, or cartoons, or other video games, that's the version they're going with.

Which was exactly what the problem with Venom. Capcom wanted the Eddie Brock version, however Marvel wanted the Flash Thompson. And if the Thompson had gotten it, the people that only know Venom from the cartoons and video games would be raging because they'd have no idea what was going on.

Though the Marvel Ultimate Alliance games actually did use the Mac Gargan version.

[simbob4000]

Both Falcon and Ness are more known for being in the Smash games than in their own games. Earthbound sold like crap in 94/95 and barely anyone in the west cared for it until Ness appeared in Smash. If you mention Captain Falcon to the average gamer, the first thing that will most likely come to their mind would be "Falcon Punch!" Which originated in Smash. If the internet was as big like it is now back when Smash 64 came out, there would be arguments such as why a "practically unknown racecar driver who has never been shown to fight" would be a "wasted slot" and that either Bowser, Diddy Kong, or King Dedede should have gotten instead. I guarantee it.

And yes the Fire Emblem games were well known beforehand......in JAPAN that is. My point being there is that Marth and Roy's inclusion in Melee was why the series gained fans in the US and why the series started to be released in the US. Had that not happened, it would still be a Japan exclusive series.

It doesn't even kind of matter that it sold like crap when originally released. Gamers here still knew of the game, and many had probably played it on emulators by the time the first Smash Bros.; I know I didn't play Earthbound until years later, but I still knew of it from when it was being released. The internet was huge in '99, don't remember anyone bitching about Captain Falcon back then. That he's awesome I'm sure goes a long ways in helping that someone may not know who he was, although it's not like F-Zero was some unknown game.

And like I said, your point is really stupid. Two of the most popular characters in the MvC series on the Marvel side were obscure characters, so obscure that people that had been reading Marvel comics for years didn't even know who they were; and those two characters first showed up in a game where they made up half of the villains you could play as.

The Capcom side of the cast is also full of characters that would be obscure to the west. That side has characters that only showed up in Japanese games, a wholly original character, a character from a cancelled game that outside of MvC2 I only ever saw once in a ad/game on their site, and a female granddaughter version of a character whose only games came out in the '80s. The Capcom side didn't have a good deal of more well know in the west Capcom characters as playable until MvC3.

[simbob4000]

Which was exactly what the problem with Venom. Capcom wanted the Eddie Brock version, however Marvel wanted the Flash Thompson. And if the Thompson had gotten it, the people that only know Venom from the cartoons and video games would be raging because they'd have no idea what was going on.

Though the Marvel Ultimate Alliance games actually did use the Mac Gargan version.

It's more the problem with Marvel. When you're playing a game build around the idea of pitting fan favorite characters against each other, you want to play the big vision, not the new random version. There's also the point of things like gameplay and aesthetic. Flash Thompson Venom would be a completely different character from both an aesthetic and gameplay perspective. Flash Thompson Venom would be built around using guns, because that's what he does in the comics, he also wouldn't have any of the visual flourishes that make Eddie Brock Venom so visually interesting in MvC. If they were both there, fine, I guess, (there are cooler Marvel gun characters) but Flash Thompson Venom over Eddie Brock Venom is pretty stupid.

The thing about the Mac Gargan version is gameplay wise he wouldn't need to be any different from Eddie Brock Venom. He isn't even really visually different from original Venom. He's just normal Venom with a different person in there. Although there ain't much point in putting Mac Gargan in there if that's the Venom you're going with.

This whole idea of making them go with the most modern comic book version just seems really stupid. It's not like the Hawkeye and Doctor Strange of MvC3 were made to visually look like their comic book counterparts of the time. And why would they, those versions sucked then.

[KCJ506]

It doesn't even kind of matter that it sold like crap when originally released. Gamers here still knew of the game, and many had probably played it on emulators by the time the first Smash Bros.; I know I didn't play Earthbound until years later, but I still knew of it from when it was being released. The internet was huge in '99, don't remember anyone bitching about Captain Falcon back then. That he's awesome I'm sure goes a long ways in helping that someone may not know who he was, although it's not like F-Zero was some unknown game.


And like I said, your point is really stupid. Two of the most popular characters in the MvC series on the Marvel side were obscure characters, so obscure that people that had been reading Marvel comics for years didn't even know who they were; and those two characters first showed up in a game where they made up half of the villains you could play as.

The Capcom side of the cast is also full of characters that would be obscure to the west. That side has characters that only showed up in Japanese games, a wholly original character, a character from a cancelled game that outside of MvC2 I only ever saw once in a ad/game on their site, and a female granddaughter version of a character whose only games came out in the '80s. The Capcom side didn't have a good deal of more well know in the west Capcom characters as playable until MvC3.

Are you seriously denying that those two are more known for Smash than their own games? Sales do matter when it comes to a game's popularity. Yes there were people that knew who they were then, but the amount that did pales in comparison to how many people know of them post Smash. The character of Captain Falcon was more fleshed out in his games' manuals than the games themselves. In F-Zero X, all you get of Captain Falcon is a static image when you select the Blue Falcon (the exact same treatment given to the other 29 racers). I'm pretty sure the original F-Zero for SNES didn't even have that. What are gamers gonna remember most about him? His games where he doesn't even set foot outside his vehicle and only appears as a picture or his trademark special move in the Smash games which has become a meme? As a Nintendo fan since the early to mid 90s, I can unequivocally say that Falcon and Ness weren't as well known as you make them seem, let alone people actually expecting them in a game about Nintendo all-stars.

As for the rest of your post, I didn't even try to argue what you said in your other post about who the two most popular Marvel characters were. So I don't know why you went off on that little rant there. And the internet was nowhere near as big in 99 like it is now. Sites like Smashboards wasn't around and neither were the Gamefaqs forums. I mean on the latter site, you had people complaining about inclusions such as Palutena, Shulk and even the Duck Hunt Dog and Pac-man in Smash 4. So you can pretty much be sure this would have happened had Falcon and Ness had either been added in that game or Brawl rather than being one of the original twelve.

[simbob4000]

Are you seriously denying that those two are more known for Smash than their own games? Sales do matter when it comes to a game's popularity. Yes there were people knew who they were then, but the amount that did pales in comparison to how many people know of them post Smash. The character of Captain Falcon was more fleshed out in his games' manuals than the games themselves. In F-Zero X, all you get of Captain Falcon is a static image when you select the Blue Falcon (the exact same treatment given to the other 29 racers). I'm pretty sure the original F-Zero for SNES didn't even have that. What are gamers gonna remember most about him? His games where he doesn't even set foot outside his vehicle and only appears as a picture or his trademark special move in the Smash games which has become a meme? As a Nintendo fan since the early t0 mid 90s, I can unequivocally say that Falcon and Ness weren't as well known as you make them seem, let alone expected them in a game about Nintendo all-stars.

Sales don't really matter, all sales tell you is that in 1995 the game didn't sell well. Those sales don't tell you nobody knew who Ness was, or what Earthbound was until '99. If you looked at a comic or video game magazine back then you probably were aware of the game and its main character because of the advertising, (of which there was a lot) even if you never played the game. And the sales in 1995 don't tell you how many people played it later on an emulator. The game was very well known with gamers before Super Smash Bros., and there were ways to play it for free before the release Smash.

F-Zero is a Nintendo game that started on a way bigger system than the N64, and Captain Falcon was the main character in it. There was also an F-Zero game on the N64 before Smash Bros. came out, it was one of the few really good games on a system without a lot of good games.

They'll remember that Captain Falcon is a Nintendo character from a game called F-Zero, and that the F-Zero games were good. It's basically all they have to remember when the whole idea behind Super Smash Bros. is that characters from different Nintendo games are fighting each other.

As for the rest of your post, I didn't even try to argue what you said in your other post about who the two most popular Marvel characters were. So I don't know why you went off on that little rant there. And the internet was nowhere as big in 99 like it is now. Sites like Smashboards wasn't around and neither were the Gamefaqs forums.

Your whole point, originally, was that people wouldn't be able to handle the obscure nobodies that weren't in cartoons and whatever. Well, the point is BS. One only needs to look at Capcom's past Marvel games to see that. There wasn't outrage at Blackheart and Shuma-Gorath, in fact , there was the opposite. There was no outrage that the cast of characters in Children of the Atom wasn't made up mostly of the biggest X-Men characters at that time. Nobody was mad about Jin Saotome, SonSon, Hayato Kanzaki, and Strider Hiryu being put into the Capcom side in those games.

The internet was god damn huge before '99. It was huge back when basically everyone was using AOL and talking in their many many chat rooms. Video game sites like IGN had already been around for a few years by 1999. Sites like Smashboards were around in '99, they just weren't there for a game released that exact same year...actually, that's not true, No Mutants Allowed has been around since '97. Games that could be played online had huge boards before '99 too.

[KCJ506]

Sales don't really matter, all sales tell you is that in 1995 the game didn't sell well. Those sales don't tell you nobody knew who Ness was, or what Earthbound was until '99. If you looked at a comic or video game magazine back then you probably were aware of the game and its main character because of the advertising, (of which there was a lot) even if you never played the game. And the sales in 1995 don't tell you how many people played it later on an emulator. The game was very well known with gamers before Super Smash Bros., and there were ways to play it for free before the release Smash.

And just how do you know exactly how many people did play Earthbound on a emulator before Smash? What proof do have even have to a lot of people did this?

F-Zero is a Nintendo game that started on a way bigger system than the N64, and Captain Falcon was the main character in it. There was also an F-Zero game on the N64 before Smash Bros. came out, it was one of the few really good games on a system without a lot of good games.
They'll remember that Captain Falcon is a Nintendo character from a game called F-Zero, and that the F-Zero games were good. It's basically all they have to remember when the whole idea behind Super Smash Bros. is that characters from different Nintendo games are fighting each other.

None of this changes what I said. As I said before you couldn't even see Captain Falcon anywhere besides the manual in the original F-Zero. F-Zero X was the first time he actually appeared in-game and still you barely saw him. His popularity is definitely mostly Smash.

Your whole point, originally, was that people wouldn't be able to handle the obscure nobodies that weren't in cartoons and whatever. Well, the point is BS. One only needs to look at Capcom's past Marvel games to see that. There wasn't outrage at Blackheart and Shuma-Gorath, in fact , there was the opposite. There was no outrage that the cast of characters in Children of the Atom wasn't made up mostly of the biggest X-Men characters at that time. Nobody was mad about Jin Saotome, SonSon, Hayato Kanzaki, and Strider Hiryu being put into the Capcom side in those games.

The internet was god damn huge before '99. It was huge back when basically everyone was using AOL and talking in their many many chat rooms. Video game sites like IGN had already been around for a few years by 1999. Sites like Smashboards were around in '99, they just weren't there for a game released that exact same year...actually, that's not true, No Mutants Allowed has been around since '97. Games that could be played online had huge boards before '99 too.

Okay then explain why there were people complaining about characters like Rocket Raccoon, Nova, Iron Fist, Dormammu, X-23, Taskmaster, Spencer and hell even Arthur and Hawkeye had a good number of complaints when they were revealed as well. People were pretty much saying "Who are these guys?! I don't know them! They suck! It should have been Gambit and Venom instead!"

The internet is a lot more common now that is was back then and has allowed "freedom of speech" for those who were once speechless. Especially now that we have sites like Youtube.