All Purpose News and Politics Thread Part IV: The Center Cannot Hold

[Gray Lensman]

This is the antithesis of justice.

You are creating a modernn-day caste of untouchables.

It was even worse in Florida, where any hope of restoration depended upon the whims of those who might approve you getting back the right to vote. There was no set of guidelines, merely what 3 people felt like doing on that day. Even a system where people knew what they would have to do, despite difficulty, would be better than Florida's.

Personally, I think that after parole and probation it should just be a given, with perhaps a few crimes needing a longer period (or no chance at all depending on severity, but those crimes likely won't have a release anyways). And a no on 'after payment of fines and/or costs of prosecution/incarceration' since that is just another method if trying to make such losses permanent.

The end result, is that when you create a class of people who can't re-enter society completely (made even worse when many of them can't get a job because of that past) is that it increases the chances they return to crime since the legal options are closed.

[jetengine]

From a British perspective....

Dont Impeach Trump.

I get it. Trumps done alot of heinous **** and you guys want to show that your system works and the impeachment process is the way to remove corrupt presidents. The thing is though....its broken. Its a very broken system working off of a weird ideal that somehow politicians will ignore human nature and suddenly become sensible human beings and vote to remove a guy who benefits half of them....when said vote requires a majority. Nixon is quickly appearing to be a fluke or simply because he was simultaneously angering everyone AND championing a shitty war everyone hated.

Its a waste of everyones time, unless you can explicitly show something so obviously bad that Republicans HAVE to agree lest they lose their jobs (video of him murdering someone etc) and even then with how extreme the republican party is these days that might not be enough.

Better to focus efforts on undercutting him in every other way (hammer home his endless failures, wastes of money, promises unfulfilled, racism etc) so any swing voters can realise he's not worth their time.

[ZombieHavoc]

From a British perspective....

Dont Impeach Trump.

I get it. Trumps done alot of heinous **** and you guys want to show that your system works and the impeachment process is the way to remove corrupt presidents. The thing is though....its broken. Its a very broken system working off of a weird ideal that somehow politicians will ignore human nature and suddenly become sensible human beings and vote to remove a guy who benefits half of them....when said vote requires a majority. Nixon is quickly appearing to be a fluke or simply because he was simultaneously angering everyone AND championing a shitty war everyone hated.

Its a waste of everyones time, unless you can explicitly show something so obviously bad that Republicans HAVE to agree lest they lose their jobs (video of him murdering someone etc) and even then with how extreme the republican party is these days that might not be enough.

Better to focus efforts on undercutting him in every other way (hammer home his endless failures, wastes of money, promises unfulfilled, racism etc) so any swing voters can realise he's not worth their time.

Swing voters, heh. What a pre-2016 concept.

[jetengine]

Swing voters, heh. What a pre-2016 concept.

You have four basic voters.

Republicans - No point trying with them.
Democrats - As long as everyone sticks with "Any democrat" its all good.
Swing Voters- Undecided voters
Non Voters- Also useful to get to vote.

[PaulBullion]

You have four basic voters.

Republicans - No point trying with them.
Democrats - As long as everyone sticks with "Any democrat" its all good.
Swing Voters- Undecided voters
Non Voters- Also useful to get to vote.

You forgot the
Nihilist Voters - just want to watch the world burn.

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

Swing voters, heh. What a pre-2016 concept.

There are swing voters it’s just a debate over where they lie. Some think this group is in the middle of the country and comprised of middle ground folks deciding between moderate Republicans and Democrats. Some think they are more ideological people sitting out because they are disillusioned with the establishment of both parties

[PaulBullion]

There are swing voters it’s just a debate over where they lie. Some think this group is in the middle of the country and comprised of middle ground folks deciding between moderate Republicans and Democrats. Some think they are more ideological people sitting out because they are disillusioned with the establishment of both parties

Or maybe both exist plus much more.

[WestPhillyPunisher]

From a British perspective....

Dont Impeach Trump.

I get it. Trumps done alot of heinous **** and you guys want to show that your system works and the impeachment process is the way to remove corrupt presidents. The thing is though....its broken. Its a very broken system working off of a weird ideal that somehow politicians will ignore human nature and suddenly become sensible human beings and vote to remove a guy who benefits half of them....when said vote requires a majority. Nixon is quickly appearing to be a fluke or simply because he was simultaneously angering everyone AND championing a shitty war everyone hated.

Its a waste of everyones time, unless you can explicitly show something so obviously bad that Republicans HAVE to agree lest they lose their jobs (video of him murdering someone etc) and even then with how extreme the republican party is these days that might not be enough.

Better to focus efforts on undercutting him in every other way (hammer home his endless failures, wastes of money, promises unfulfilled, racism etc) so any swing voters can realise he's not worth their time.

In my opinion, that’s not just the best way to go but the ONLY way to go as impeachment is a dead end that will only fortify the resolve of Trumpanzees to support their god emperor for 2020. Death by a thousand cuts is a the strategy for taking down Trump.

[Tami]

In my opinion, that’s not just the best way to go but the ONLY way to go as impeachment is a dead end that will only fortify the resolve of Trumpanzees to support their god emperor for 2020. Death by a thousand cuts is a the strategy for taking down Trump.

Don't underestimate Trump's supernatural ability to survive just about anything. The guy is a walking talking advertisement for triple bypass surgery, yet there he is.

Not sure what his silver bullet is.

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

Or maybe both exist plus much more.

There’s so much over-representation in the middle that I find it very hard to believe people who are centrist haven’t found where they are leaning

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Don't underestimate Trump's supernatural ability to survive just about anything. The guy is a walking talking advertisement for triple bypass surgery, yet there he is.

Not sure what his silver bullet is.

Trump’s weakness would be losing the support of Turtle Boy McConnell. Without him and key leaders in the Republican controlled Senate, Dolt45 would be toast and abandoned overnight just like the GOP threw Nixon under the bus.

[Kevinroc]

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/st...06730793988096

Put another way: the reason Bernie fans mostly haven't migrated to Warren is because the distinguishing feature of Bernie fans is not leftist policy views per se but that they (figuratively) want to blow up the system, including the Democratic Party.

Which, more power to them? But if this is true, it severely limits Sanders's growth potential *in the Democratic primary*. Having independents who can vote in the D primaries helps a bit, but "Democratic primary voters who don't like the Democratic Party" is not a huge market.

No lies detected.

[numberthirty]

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/st...06730793988096

Put another way: the reason Bernie fans mostly haven't migrated to Warren is because the distinguishing feature of Bernie fans is not leftist policy views per se but that they (figuratively) want to blow up the system, including the Democratic Party.

Which, more power to them? But if this is true, it severely limits Sanders's growth potential *in the Democratic primary*. Having independents who can vote in the D primaries helps a bit, but "Democratic primary voters who don't like the Democratic Party" is not a huge market.

No lies detected.

Accounting for that everything in a social media "Comments" section is suspect at best, here are some jems from the "Comments" section.

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From "Some "Hands Off Venezuela" Dude: She doesn't back Medicare for All, but even if she did the simple fact is she's not as popular as Sanders. We're trying to win a primary, then a general election in 2020. What we're not trying to do is win a moral victory and try again in 2024.

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From "State Banjo": The way you twisted @sunraysunray's tweet without even realizing you misinterpreted it says a lot about your blind spots and political myopia. You could learn a lot about yourself by actually analyzing it.

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From "Waleed Shahid: Eh. I like Warren, but part of Bernie's appeal with his base is his authenticity. Bernie was advocating some of the contemporary Democratic Party's big policy ideas (free college + single-payer in particular) before Warren. Warren only co-sponsored those bills after 2016.

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From "Bryant Young": This is utterly false. We support Bernie over Warren for substantive reasons. (Warren weird on M4A, Warren voted for Trump’s military budget twice, Bernie has been WAY more consistent - Warren was a Republican in the 90s) Why are you so disingenuous, Nate?

[SUPERECWFAN1]

John Cornyn's campaign Twitter account is snapping at Patton Oswalt. Patton seems to be having fun with it though.

I wonder if the old idiot realizes he's just advertising Oswalt and the lady he's running against ? He can't be this fucking stupid can he ?

[The Overlord]

Nate Silver has a rather balanced piece on Bernard Sanders' poll numbers:

Bernie Sanders Can Win, But He Isn’t Polling Like A Favorite

He may not win the nomination, but ultimately I think the ideas are more important than the man. The third way failed in 2016, why would it succeed in 2020? To me, Bernie becoming the nominee is not as important as a general movement to move the Overton window to the left. Centrism has failed, because the center has drifted too much to the right, that being a centrist now means you give a bunch of ground to the right, the Republicans have become a far-right party, can centrism keep that in check? If you have another third-way centrist, ultimately things will get worse, even if you beat Trump, the third way can never beat Trumpism, because Trumpism arose due to its failures, third-way centerism will just give us another Trump in short order.