Dick Grayson: Robin, Nightwing, Agent of Spyral - Appreciation

[Aahz]

I mean. That's kind of the problem. Romani people have been kinda screwed for centuries because "people didn't care." Maybe people should care? I don't understand why it's so harmful for marginalized people to get a slice of the pie that is big budget, positive portrayals in cinema that they've been sorely lacking...

To behonest I think they have (at least in eastern Europe) much bigger problems than representation in block buster movies.

[The Darknight Detective]

I mean, there are Romani actors all over the world that they can look at.

Should actors only play roles that mirror their own ancestry? I'm not talking about taking Caucasian actors and transforming them into Asians as was the case years ago, but Irish playing Irish, Italians playing Italians, etc.. BTW, in the case of Dick, shouldn't the actor be only half Romani?

[nightbird]

This is 2018, not 1940. It doesn't make as much sense for Dick to be white. White, straight, and male was the default in 1940, but not anymore. I think most Iron Fist fans were upset that the show turned out to be pretty damn bad, not that he wasn't Asian (that was probably a vocal minority, much like fans championing Dick's Romani heritage).

I only just read this tweet, but: He's working on a rip-o-matic, which is, from what I understand, a clip show reel pulling from other movies and shows that is supposed to sell the movie to execs and stuff. So the poll is a simple way to gauge what he could put into the ripomatic, i.e. "how much action do I need? should I include anything about his mother?"



I hope you're not implying his heritage matters less just because he's only part Romani... It'd be a different story if he was like 12.5% or less Romani and had no idea, but...

I mean, there are Romani actors all over the world that they can look at. The only reason I never really brought up Jésus Castro was because he's no martial artist. He's handsome, of Romani descent, and hey, is light-skinned like Dick traditionally is. So if having a background in martial arts or gymnastics doesn't matter to you, then there you go.

We already know this is going to be a big and wide search, so I just don't get what the harm is in looking for Romani actors in addition to others is what I'm saying. It's just so odd seeing people act like wanting Dick to be Romani is terrible or something.

Iron Fist wasn’t an issue in “minority vocal fans” community. From actors, to big bloggers and sites everyone talked about that.

I don’t think you actually understanding what I’m saying. I’m sorry if my terrible English the main reason why.
Fist of all, I didn’t focus only on Romani part. I just equally highlighted that I don’t think think martial arts background or star power important. So no one is acting that “wanting Dick to be Romani is terrible or something”. I don’t care if they incorporate his “Romani heritage” into the story. I don’t care if they make him half-Romani, quarter or even full, if they will be able to find a guy who looks and acts like Dick Grayson. What I’m saying, it’s not important to find entically correct person to play him because he doesn’t look like typical Romani person (that some fans wants him to look like (also it’s possible to find fair skinned or light eyed Romani people)) due to him being a mixed blood. They should not focus just on actors’ heritage or martial abilities. It should be secondary thought for actor’s talent as an actor. If Jesus Castro good actor, ready to work hard to bring Dick Grayson to life and overall a right person, why not. But him being part Romani should not be “the most important” quality. They can search, if they want, for Romani actors, martial artists or big stars, but all that should be bonuses, not focal points. I don’t like almost all casting choices for Dick Grayson, including popular Finn Whitlock and Zack Efron, so it’s hardly me wanting Dick to be just “a white guy”. I want an accurate adaptation of the character to the big screen.

[nightbird]

Dick and Dami
https://www.instagram.com/p/BNbufY7htWw/

[yash]

"Dick should be romani" is a useless checkbox, it's addition to the lore at best was useless and at worse it was ignorant, and it has not been relevant to the character

Fact is if there was a cass cain movie then asian is checkbox that needs to be ticked regardless if there is a white chick that knows the character better and is a great actor and a great martial artist, with dick there is no reason for "romani" being a checkbox it just limits the casting options for no good reasons

[Godlike13]

I hope you're not implying his heritage matters less just because he's only part Romani... It'd be a different story if he was like 12.5% or less Romani and had no idea, but...

That is basically Dick's Romani story though.

[Badou]

Dick isn't a person of color. Him being part Romani doesn't change that. He shouldn't be looked at as one. I'm fine with Dick being part Romani, but it shouldn't be something that takes precedence over his identity. He just isn't that kind of character and doing it makes it feel completely out of character like the way Devin Grayson wrote it. He shouldn't care at all that he is Romani just like he doesn't care that he is part English. It is all irrelevant to him. He should care about Haley's Circus as being where he is from and that is what he identifies as being his history.

I mean that is the way I look at it at least. It just feels off to have him suddenly care about it when he spent the vast majority of his history not being Romani. It was never something that was a foundational part of the character.

[nightbird]

[nightbird]

... (imo) most of his appearances just quantity over quality. Sometimes they don’t even bother to flesh out Nightwing as a character.

[Rac7d*]

Dick isn't a person of color. Him being part Romani doesn't change that. He shouldn't be looked at as one. I'm fine with Dick being part Romani, but it shouldn't be something that takes precedence over his identity. He just isn't that kind of character and doing it makes it feel completely out of character like the way Devin Grayson wrote it. He shouldn't care at all that he is Romani just like he doesn't care that he is part English. It is all irrelevant to him. He should care about Haley's Circus as being where he is from and that is what he identifies as being his history.

I mean that is the way I look at it at least. It just feels off to have him suddenly care about it when he spent the vast majority of his history not being Romani. It was never something that was a foundational part of the character.

Does his heritage only count if he is dark skinned? They are opening alot cans of worms with this. To all the mixed people in the world where do they stand, becasue that is what Dick grayson is mixed, so him being white passing is not unusal.

If people care about Super hero of color there is Vast number of them who could use this kind of attention and fight Dick grayson is not one of them, he white passing boy who was raised by a wealthy billionare, he is privaledged white man and has never had the experience of a POC in his entire history.

[oasis1313]

Does his heritage only count if he is dark skinned? They are opening alot cans of worms with this. To all the mixed people in the world where do they stand, becasue that is what Dick grayson is mixed, so him being white passing is not unusal.

If people care about Super hero of color there is Vast number of them who could use this kind of attention and fight Dick grayson is not one of them, he white passing boy who was raised by a wealthy billionare, he is privaledged white man and has never had the experience of a POC in his entire history.

Then why should people try to shoehorn racial angst into the character? It's never been there. I'd like my celluloid Dick (no matter race he's turned into or not) to be a happy warrior, loving being a hero and kicking bad-guy azz, having adventures , dating pretty girls, and loving his life.

[Rac7d*]

Then why should people try to shoehorn racial angst into the character? It's never been there. I'd like my celluloid Dick (no matter race he's turned into or not) to be a happy warrior, loving being a hero and kicking bad-guy azz, having adventures , dating pretty girls, and loving his life.

They shoulndt
its a waste on him when there are real POC heroes who need such attention

[Ascended]

As I said, fans are worst advisers (especially when it comes to adapting heroes for movies). And I bet the Romani part of his poll will create in the future same controversy around Nighwting’s casting as “cast an Asian guy” created controversy around Iron Fist. Also, fans bombarded him with “#keepnightwingromani” thing since announcement. So it’s not surprising he knows about that. I just hope his vision will not be clouded by unnecessary stuff when it actually comes to casting Dick Grayson.

You know, that really annoyed me.

I get the whole cultural appropriation thing, but jesus, Danny was a blonde white guy from the start, and casting someone of Asian descent just because the character knows martial arts? Isn't *that* racism? Oh, the guy is a kung fu master, he *must* be Asian!

Dick being Romani is such a non-issue.....he's still "white" and he's still from a travelling circus and spent most of his life in a rich man's house in America. Finding out he is Romani is like me finding out I'm actually German instead of Irish. It changes nothing. At most, Dick would perhaps find a bit more interest in his culture.....and that didn't happen, just like I barely know anything about my Irish (or perhaps German?) ancestors.

[Grayson - The Dark Heir]

Should actors only play roles that mirror their own ancestry? I'm not talking about taking Caucasian actors and transforming them into Asians as was the case years ago, but Irish playing Irish, Italians playing Italians, etc.. BTW, in the case of Dick, shouldn't the actor be only half Romani?

See... we have British and New Zealanders playing American characters. But on the other hand, I don't think we really should have a direct say on that unless we were Romani? As for Dick's actor having to be half-Romani to portray the character, I don't believe that. I mean, as it is, you can't actually find anyone of some, like, "pure" Romani descent. Everyone's mixed. Like Dick. It'd be fine if they managed to find someone.

That is basically Dick's Romani story though.

I mean that's part of why Raptor was always shitting on him. Part of the appeal of Raptor is that he's basically never wrong, lol.

Dick isn't a person of color. Him being part Romani doesn't change that. He shouldn't be looked at as one. I'm fine with Dick being part Romani, but it shouldn't be something that takes precedence over his identity. He just isn't that kind of character and doing it makes it feel completely out of character like the way Devin Grayson wrote it. He shouldn't care at all that he is Romani just like he doesn't care that he is part English. It is all irrelevant to him. He should care about Haley's Circus as being where he is from and that is what he identifies as being his history.

I mean that is the way I look at it at least. It just feels off to have him suddenly care about it when he spent the vast majority of his history not being Romani. It was never something that was a foundational part of the character.

I've never said Dick needs to care? I said the director should care. And it seems like some of you guys have some fairly harmful views, or at least you make it sound like you do, so maybe reconsider some of that, or at least your wording, lol.

All I want is a good Dick and a good Raptor. Whether we get Raptor or not, I'm hoping for his inclusion. And if you want a good Raptor, you need a good Mary. Which then affects Dick.

Then why should people try to shoehorn racial angst into the character? It's never been there. I'd like my celluloid Dick (no matter race he's turned into or not) to be a happy warrior, loving being a hero and kicking bad-guy azz, having adventures , dating pretty girls, and loving his life.

The actor being Romani doesn't instantly mean we'd get a movie about racial angst, so don't worry about that yet. I don't know about other people, but part of the reason it would be nice for Dick's actor to be Romani would be because we'd get a regular, positive portrayal of the culture. I think most people just want a good Nightwing movie but with his mother's heritage kept in tact.

Does his heritage only count if he is dark skinned? They are opening alot cans of worms with this. To all the mixed people in the world where do they stand, becasue that is what Dick grayson is mixed, so him being white passing is not unusal.

If people care about Super hero of color there is Vast number of them who could use this kind of attention and fight Dick grayson is not one of them, he white passing boy who was raised by a wealthy billionare, he is privaledged white man and has never had the experience of a POC in his entire history.

Yeah, his heritage definitely doesn't only count if he's dark skinned.

And also, you basically mentioned the entire reason Raptor even exists as a character. And why we need him on screen.

]

I get the whole cultural appropriation thing, but jesus, Danny was a blonde white guy from the start, and casting someone of Asian descent just because the character knows martial arts? Isn't *that* racism? Oh, the guy is a kung fu master, he *must* be Asian!

Dick being Romani is such a non-issue.....he's still "white" and he's still from a travelling circus and spent most of his life in a rich man's house in America. Finding out he is Romani is like me finding out I'm actually German instead of Irish. It changes nothing. At most, Dick would perhaps find a bit more interest in his culture.....and that didn't happen, just like I barely know anything about my Irish (or perhaps German?) ancestors.

It doesn't change much for Dick (and again, when all you have are super white writers, why would it?)... I don't get why everyone is talking about this? Again, Raptor. I need to hear him yelling "Sidekick! Sellout! The lost son of Mary!" at least once.

And this is off-topic now, but the Iron Fist thing: I mean, you can't just brush off cultural appropriation as a minor issue and pretend you have the moral high ground here. It's a complicated topic... Asians practicing an age-old, traditional part of their culture has nothing to do with racism. I mean, that's their culture. I think Asians have a problem with a white guy with no martial arts background portraying a martial arts master, and after seeing how it turned out, I can see why, lol. It was 2016, not whenever IF was created, so there's no real reason we didn't have an Asian-American actor/character. Or a black one. or Indian. It just goes on. And before you say "source material!" recognize that this Danny Rand wasn't even a proper Iron Fist yet, mans couldn't even use both hands yet. They already deviated from what people expected, they could've deviated even further if they wanted.

My biggest problem with IF was that the fight choreography made me physically ill at times, and I just hope for so much better than that in Nightwing and the Titans tv series.

[Badou]

I've never said Dick needs to care? I said the director should care. And it seems like some of you guys have some fairly harmful views, or at least you make it sound like you do, so maybe reconsider some of that, or at least your wording, lol.

All I want is a good Dick and a good Raptor. Whether we get Raptor or not, I'm hoping for his inclusion. And if you want a good Raptor, you need a good Mary. Which then affects Dick

And I think the director should care about other things instead of some minor retcon that in no way defines the character he is trying to bring to the big screen. I just don't get why people think that him being Romani is the #1 most important thing about who should play the character over anything else. I mean Mary has only been shown to be Romani for a year and a half as before it was Dick's dad that was Romani. That could no longer be the case because of the William Cobb story.

Also I don't think I've said anything harmful. People acting like Dick being Romani is some integral part of his character just isn't true. He isn't a person of color and treating him as such I think is disrespectful to actual people of color.

Edit: Now I'm not saying he shouldn't be played by someone who is part Romani if they are the best actor for the part, but I don't think that should be a priority in the casting. I mean they cast an Israeli actress in Gadot to play a Greek Amazon character in Wonder Woman. They didn't get a Greek actress to play her and instead got someone who they thought would be best for the role. That is what should take priority.