New Avengers #29 - Spoilers

[XPac]

I've been curious about the Beyonders since that Secret Wars 3 arc in Fantastic Four, so I'm glad they're finally coming into play.

I do wonder if they will retcon the Beyonder to be more than just an incomplete cosmic cube. Because it doesn't seem like an incomplete cube is really gonna do much.

[XPac]

I haven't been following these threads much, so forgive me if this has been addressed already. Where is Future Franklin in all this? We saw in Fantastic Four that he's willing to travel back in time to fix things. And it's not like Hickman wants us to forget him; Cap met him on his future foray. I can understand young Franklin not being able to hack it, but his future self is nearly omnipotent, isn't he?

From Future Franklins perspective the matter was already resolved past tense so he's probably not sweating over it too much.

[just another user]

Did they kill Franklin?!

Not outright stated but strongly implied

[just another user]

I can't unsee that with Carol now. Thanks.

But with Walker's art it does give everyone an aged and worn kind of look. Which works with the problem they are facing.

Yeah Carol looked kinda silly but pretty much everyone else was hot.

[Strangefan]

Strange still behind the scenes, sigh. The problem with Hickman's kind of storytelling is he is telling things in retrospect. NOW we see all the other things that the Illuminati tried before allowing a world to be destroyed. So you are left wondering did he put this in to placate people who were saying "why can't Franklin do something" or "why don't they just make another world" or if it had been his intention all along to write things in this order, so the Illuminati would look just awful to everyone.

Well, I guess if Beyonders want to look like someone, they can, so supposedly our traditional "Beyonder" looked human. Or he was simply using the title to describe his power set, and is still his retcon Inhuman self. We finally have our Ivory Kings, but we need to see who Rabum Alal is, but from what Strange indicated a couple issues back it seems that both sides are working on death of everything. The fact that there are less than 2 dozen universes left shows they have been highly successful. Will be interesting to see why they are hanging with Hank Pym.

I wonder if everyone will shave in Secret Wars. Except for the rest of the heroes knowing about Strange and the Black Priests it seems all secrets are finally out in the open. If we are missing all the incursions until the final one I guess the next two issues will be exposition leading up to the final incursion and then Secret Wars.

[XPac]

Did they kill Franklin?!

Also interesting that the Beyonders are a race, not just one person.

That was sort of the retcon from back in the day. The Beyonders were the people responsible for the cosmic cubes, and the Secret Wars Beyonder was just an incomplete cube. Personally I always hated that retcon (really I've pretty much hated every Beyonder retcon since the end of secret wars 2).

[ArmsHeldOut]

Sad about Franklin, but I guess the reboot can fix that.

Did they kill Franklin?!

Franklin didn't perish. You'll recall that, in an earlier issue, Sue told Reed that "Franklin thinks he failed you." Reed was just ashamed that he was forced to resort to using his own son in an effort to save everyone.

[Username taken]

Franklin is alive in the future.

He's not dead.

[KOSLOX]

Haven't made it to the store yet... so, is that less than two dozen Earths, or less than two dozen universes, period? And if it's the latter, does Reed mention what's been happening to the universes whose Earths were destroyed and therefore weren't supposed to be subject to Incursions? Because you'd think the latter point would be of interest in deciding how you want to respond to that last Incursion.

If Earthless universes are getting destroyed/eaten by a secondary process of elimination anyway, and ones that have been blowing up the other Earth get the whole dying stars thing, then I can see the argument that there's no point in even considering blowing the other Earth as the Cabal has been doing when all it will do is slightly delay the destruction of both universes.

He says there are two dozen universes left. Full stop, no other info.

[XPac]

Franklin didn't perish. You'll recall that, in an earlier issue, Sue told Reed that "Franklin thinks he failed you." Reed was just ashamed that he was forced to resort to using his own son in an effort to save everyone.

Given that the Infinity Gems and the Cube apparently all ended up destroyed after they tried using them, I suppose Reed wanting to use Frankly as plan z was understandable.

[xcoijoi]

"And if it's the latter, does Reed mention what's been happening to the universes whose Earths were destroyed and therefore weren't supposed to be subject to Incursions?"

It's one of the mysteries. They don't know why, yet.

[Scarlet-Spider]

He says there are two dozen universes left. Full stop, no other info.

But Spider-Verse is going on at the same time and there are characters from way more than two dozen universes shown.

[celeherald]

My favorite part was appealing to the universal abstracts, I always thought it should be one of the high priority solutions.

[ArmsHeldOut]

Franklin is alive in the future.

He's not dead.

Yeah, he's alive. In Avengers #37, Sue met up with Reed in secret, and he asked about the kids.
Sue said the following (I just checked the issue):

"Franklin is.. well.. he still thinks he disappointed you." Reed replies, "I should never have done that. I should never have asked.. I..." Then Sue says, "I know. We all know. He's just hurting."

The current issue finally revealed what that conversation was all about.

[Scarlet-Spider]

That was sort of the retcon from back in the day. The Beyonders were the people responsible for the cosmic cubes, and the Secret Wars Beyonder was just an incomplete cube. Personally I always hated that retcon (really I've pretty much hated every Beyonder retcon since the end of secret wars 2).

Bendis retconed that so the Beyonder is now just a mutant inhuman which is a horrible retcon in my opinion and the Beyonder being a incomplete cosmic cube was gold compared that.