Is it time for Polaris to get a push in the X-books?

[salarta]

I liked most of what Gifted did with Lorna in season 1. Felt most of it was better than what Marvel's written of 616 Lorna basically ever.

There are certain things I didn't like in it. Pregnancy right out of the gate is probably the biggest. I felt it was way too soon and without having explored Lorna more beforehand, ran the risk of derailing her - which it did from what I've heard of season 2. Season 2 of Wynonna Earp turned out to be an excellent model of how to do pregnancy well on TV. Another thing is that while the show did a great job of capturing a darker, edgier and sassier side to Lorna, I think it missed much of her heroic side.

When I say heroic here, I don't mean "colors inside the lines and follows the letter of law." I mean being a force for good who seeks to help as many as she can. Mutant Underground came off to me as more "one at a time underground railroad" in nature while Lorna would've been a better fit for me as loud, proud and visible, something the Mutant Underground held her back from. One of my favorite things from Gifted was actually the viral campaign before the show launched. It had Lorna and the others hacking a website to speak out against the "mutant cure" goal of the site.

Keep in mind that I stopped watching Gifted after Dreamer's death in season 1 because of how poorly it was handled. I grappled with that decision for a couple days. My fandom for Lorna said to keep watching as I liked her treatment and platform a lot, but my principles regarding character death and treatment of characters in general said to stop. So I don't really have much to say on what Gifted did during season 2 except to say what I've seen other people say about it.

[Will Evans]

I liked most of what Gifted did with Lorna in season 1. Felt most of it was better than what Marvel's written of 616 Lorna basically ever.

There are certain things I didn't like in it. Pregnancy right out of the gate is probably the biggest. I felt it was way too soon and without having explored Lorna more beforehand, ran the risk of derailing her - which it did from what I've heard of season 2. Season 2 of Wynonna Earp turned out to be an excellent model of how to do pregnancy well on TV. Another thing is that while the show did a great job of capturing a darker, edgier and sassier side to Lorna, I think it missed much of her heroic side.

When I say heroic here, I don't mean "colors inside the lines and follows the letter of law." I mean being a force for good who seeks to help as many as she can. Mutant Underground came off to me as more "one at a time underground railroad" in nature while Lorna would've been a better fit for me as loud, proud and visible, something the Mutant Underground held her back from. One of my favorite things from Gifted was actually the viral campaign before the show launched. It had Lorna and the others hacking a website to speak out against the "mutant cure" goal of the site.

Keep in mind that I stopped watching Gifted after Dreamer's death in season 1 because of how poorly it was handled. I grappled with that decision for a couple days. My fandom for Lorna said to keep watching as I liked her treatment and platform a lot, but my principles regarding character death and treatment of characters in general said to stop. So I don't really have much to say on what Gifted did during season 2 except to say what I've seen other people say about it.

But Dreamer was always meant to die.

Despite the number of episodes she was in, the actress was only a guest star compared to others in the regular main cast.

And she was based on a seldom used Morlock from the comics.

She was like the Thunderbird of the All New All Different team.

Or the Morph for X-men: TAS.

[Celestialbodies]

Lorna is a badass and deserves her due, looking forward to X-Factor.

[salarta]

But Dreamer was always meant to die.

Despite the number of episodes she was in, the actress was only a guest star compared to others in the regular main cast.

And she was based on a seldom used Morlock from the comics.

She was like the Thunderbird of the All New All Different team.

Or the Morph for X-men: TAS.

I can accept character death if handled well. I watched and enjoyed Walking Dead for several years. When I used to watch it, that show acknowledged the value of its characters in the process of their deaths. They would even often spend whole episodes dedicated to a character to appreciate what was going away with their loss.

Gifted did the opposite. With Dreamer's death, the show had all the characters act incredibly stupid purely to put them in a position where she would die, then they rushed to the next plot point of the Cuckoos as their cliffhanger. One scene Dreamer stands on the wrong side of a door so she could be easily captured, as a "sacrifice" for the twins to escape... which they don't, cause one of them decides not to use their powers. Another scene, the twins refuse to do what the villain wants from them until right after Dreamer dies, then they immediately give in. Everything about it was absurdly insulting. I can't give that sort of thing a pass while decrying things that are less bad by comparison.

[bearman]

Yes. Polaris. Dazzler. Banshee.
The overlooked vets.

[JB]

The answers is absolutely yes. I look forward to her being a guiding light in X-Factor.

[MechaJeanix]

Polaris is a character that should get a push and she should be one of the top X-Men. I'm not always convinced she will reach the status of Jean Grey or Storm, but I think that she should. I hope the character gets a good run in X-factor. I think Leah has the ability to do well with her.

Though I like the idea of Northstar being a team leader, I do wish that Polaris, Storm, and Jean were leading teams in this modern era.

[Will Evans]

Polaris is a character that should get a push and she should be one of the top X-Men. I'm not always convinced she will reach the status of Jean Grey or Storm, but I think that she should. I hope the character gets a good run in X-factor. I think Leah has the ability to do well with her.

Though I like the idea of Northstar being a team leader, I do wish that Polaris, Storm, and Jean were leading teams in this modern era.

Ororo and Jean, at least, get to be on the Quiet Council.

[salarta]

Ororo and Jean, at least, get to be on the Quiet Council.

Not to mention that Storm gets to be outraged by the Genoshan genocide around other major Marvel players while Lorna, who actually lived through the genocide and suffered severe PTSD as a result, gets treated by Marvel like it never happened to her and probably doesn't even know what a Genosha is or if it tastes good on cereal.

Maybe, hopefully, Empyre will fix at least that longstanding problem.

[AbnormallyNormal]

I feel for Polaris fans. Other than X-Factor, what do they really have?

That said, Lorna just isn't that interesting. Magneto does her power first and better. Jean was the first X-Gal, Storm is the best. I just don't really see a place for her in the main X-Men team. She works better in the satellite books.

We have a lot more than XFactor..

Thanks for your sympathy but it appears to be somewhat insincere ?

Lorna is interesting because of her "can go either way" type characterization, she straddles the lines philosophically between XMen/Brotherhood type mentalities

Lorna can use the same mutation as Magneto in different ways. Lorna is not the only character to share roughly the same mutation with another character. This does not prevent her from being interesting but I'll admit it is probably her #1 hindrance to gaining wider exposure.

Jean being the first has nothing to do with whether Lorna is interesting, are you saying no other female mutant can be interesting because they weren't first?

Storm being best is highly subjective, I definitely don't agree. I think Storm is more or less a weight on books ever since Claremont left, other writers don't have a good vision for her and she is stuck in a relatively narrow range for me. I dread a book with Storm on it, although her solo series a few years ago was pretty solid

There is no single main team now in the first place so that's not an issue

I do agree Lorna isn't really plausibly going to ever become an A lister like Jean/Storm/Rogue and that's why I feel her fans ought to embrace a different role for her, but not the boring "satellite" role you ascribe , rather a more complicated one morally , more of an antihero type

[houndsofluv]

Totally agree, it seems to be a common conclusion among most of her fans that what's keeping her from "breaking out" is the insistence on modelling her after existing characters. The prominent X-Women like Storm, Rogue, Betsy, Kitty, even Jubilee despite being initially intended as a Kitty clone, thrive because they aren't "another Jean", another whoever... Tying Lorna to Havok for all those years and insisting on pushing them as Jean and Scott-lite was like fastening Lorna to a boulder and throwing he into a lake, she can only sink..Fans already had the original Jott to read about, rehashing their storylines with like 10 times less connection to the audience is destined to miss the mark. At least Alex had the tortured younger brother trying to live up to Scott's legacy thing going for him, Lorna was just proto-Jean without even the semblance of a character arc let alone an iconic one .

And dont even get me started on how her being "x-factor's Jean" or "Havok's Jean" don't even make sense considering her initial introduction . Lorna makes so much more sense as a character with an edge, a certain darkness to her, the unhingedness she's shown sporadically through the years feels much less manufactured. Her absurdly uneven characterization through the years makes her fun to examine as a fan but a nightmare to market and generate genuine interest from creators lol

One thing she has in her favour is her design - monochrome green is very distinctive, and even in the 90s she stood out in blue and yellow thanks to her hair (and stellar work from Stroman and predecessors) . Its a fun spin on the "legacy costume" in that it .. kind of isn't one. Her aesthetic is what drew me to her as a kid . I wonder what the new look in Williams' X-Factor will mean

[Will Evans]

That’s all true personality wise.

But powers wise, Lorna is still in Magento’s Shadow.


Even Magneto's considered Omega Level while Lorna isn’t.

Even when describing the new X-Factor, Rachel is described as the powerhouse of the team.

[houndsofluv]

imo power sets dont have much to do with a character's popularity, anyonecan argue until their face turns blue that their fave is objectively the strongest and there'll never be a consensus. I don't think a lot of fans like admitting how static these powers are loll , they seem to constantly be shifting or at least have the potential to based on the whims of writers and what editorial will allow

I'm fine with Lorna not being as powerful as her dad, they use their powers very differently and with less strength comes the need for whoever's writing her to be more creative which leads to more memorable sequences . Rachel being considered the powerhouse doesn't have to take away from Lorna , I mean really she's in a similar position - she is to Jean what Lorna is to Mags

Adding to this because it just hit me that X-23 is doing fine in terms of fanbase - "Magneto's Daughter" isn't terrible as a brand Lorna just needs to be given that driving core direction which pushes her out from the shadow for good. But a lot of other people have touched on that already in here and elsewhere

[Havok83]

Its funny that there are no less than 20 telepaths running around (even more so for the brutes with super strength), yet Lorna is kept down bc she is one of 2 X-men with magnetic powers

[salarta]

One thing she has in her favour is her design - monochrome green is very distinctive, and even in the 90s she stood out in blue and yellow thanks to her hair (and stellar work from Stroman and predecessors) . Its a fun spin on the "legacy costume" in that it .. kind of isn't one. Her aesthetic is what drew me to her as a kid . I wonder what the new look in Williams' X-Factor will mean

Green is a color people are very much interested in lately. Any character that has it is already in a good position.

Some people (not just Lorna fans) have been overeager to say various pictures of green-haired women are Lorna. I used to correct people when they mislabeled art as Lorna. I stopped bothering since I saw no reason to do it anymore. It spreads awareness of Lorna, which is more than Marvel's done for her. It's also fairly common to see people respond to others who dyed their hair green with "You look like Lorna Dane!"

Even Magneto's considered Omega Level whole Lorna isn’t.

Even when describing the new X-Factor, Rachel is described as the powerhouse of the team.

This is also a function of bias at Marvel, and held by Hickman in particular if he was the one to decide Magneto should be Omega without also making Lorna into such. Hickman's own definition of what qualifies as Omega, along with Lorna repeatedly described in past comics as either having the potential to surpass Magneto or already being his equal, basically means she has to be one if Magneto is. The only possible explanation that would work at this point is if Hickman's Omega list is from Xavier's in-universe POV, because then it can be said that it's merely a reflection of Xavier with all his limitations and biases, not a truly conclusive list.

Which could still work. I'm thinking of the show The Magicians, where Julia Wicker was rejected from Brakebills with the claim she couldn't do magic, only to find out later that she's really one of the best magicians out there and she was secretly rejected as part of a grander goal.

As for X-Factor, enough has certainly been said and done by Marvel and Leah to know what's coming. At this point it's just a matter of watching it unfold.

Adding to this because it just hit me that X-23 is doing fine in terms of fanbase - "Magneto's Daughter" isn't terrible as a brand Lorna just needs to be given that driving core direction which pushes her out from the shadow for good. But a lot of other people have touched on that already in here and elsewhere

"Magneto's daughter" is, taken on its own, a good calling card and goes back to her very first issues. The problem only comes in when Marvel tries to a) make that all she is, and b) treat her poorly and disregard her history and options just to promote him.

X-Men Blue had this problem. Headquarters gets attacked, and Lorna acts shocked just so Magneto can mansplain surprise attacks to her, ignoring that it'd be kinda hard for her to not know what they are after Genosha. X-Men Blue had a lot of potential for Lorna interacting with teen Jean and teen Iceman, but almost all her time got wasted on how she could benefit Havok and Magneto.

By contrast, Secret Wars: House of M did a terrific job of including Lorna as Magneto's daughter and still letting her look smart, strong and a tinge sassy. Likewise, we had New X-Men #132, Uncanny X-Men #431, and Uncanny X-Men #442-443 where her association with Magneto (fully as his daughter in the latter two) allowed her to move forward in her own ways while holding the role of Magneto's heir.