Nubia Appreciation 2021

[Psy-lock]

Nubia is defined by being Diana's sister and also the first champion. Do variations of that, like how Nubia: Real One used the former to craft a different story for Nubia while still retaining her as Diana's sister. Though you claim that Nubia's backstory as it is is problematic, I say her story has potential to be really powerful. You have a young black girl who was kidnapped from her own culture by a malevolent entity, raised in a culture other than her own and then manipulated as a weapon against her birth culture. Yet, she manages to break out of her curse, reconnect with both her birth culture and adopted culture and stand as equals with her blood sister. I think this has potential to resonate with people the same way Killmonger resonated with so many except without villanization.

I just realized that She-ra is basically white Nubia.

[Alpha]

Nubia is defined by being Diana's sister and also the first champion. Do variations of that, like how Nubia: Real One used the former to craft a different story for Nubia while still retaining her as Diana's sister. Though you claim that Nubia's backstory as it is is problematic, I say her story has potential to be really powerful. You have a young black girl who was kidnapped from her own culture by a malevolent entity, raised in a culture other than her own and then manipulated as a weapon against her birth culture. Yet, she manages to break out of her curse, reconnect with both her birth culture and adopted culture and stand as equals with her blood sister. I think this has potential to resonate with people the same way Killmonger resonated with so many except without villanization.

I don't get that at all. Killmonger was the counterpart to a whole country of incredible african characters. Nubia is literally Diana except with brown skin, and she is the one that didn't get any of the things Diana did. I don't see why she needs this story.

The idea that Hippolyta made two children on the same day, one with clear skin and the other with brown skin, and that the white skin was loved and nurtured and the brown skinned was taken away from Paradise and never mentioned by her family, to be one of the weirdest and most unecessarily racially charged elements of Diana's mythos.

In a world of wish fulfillment, the black version of Diana is the one that doesn't get that wish fulfillment.

[Agent Z]

Speaking as a black man, wish fulfillment is not a high priority for me when it comes to characters, superheroes or otherwise. There are some issues with Nubia's original backstories but the supposed lack of wish fulfillment isn't one of them (and the number of black fans she has clearly shows it isn't that big a deal).

In my take, Diana and Nubia are created by Hippolyta and Philippus respectively (who don't get married just yet). Nubia is seemingly killed in a war with demons from another realm but is revealed to have been mind controlled by them. She is freed by Diana and Donna, and her story is about reconnecting with her home and her family and dealing with the experiences of being mind controlled.

[Alpha]

For one thing, I don't think those fans actually know much about Nubia's backstories through the years. And I didn't say that every character has to be wish fulfillment, but the black version of Diana being the only one that doesn't get to live in Paradise seems like a reall dumb thing to do.

[Agent Z]

For one thing, I don't think those fans actually know much about Nubia's backstories through the years.

Nubia is known mostly by comic book fans. Her origin is referenced every time she's brought up, so I think it's safe to say they are familiar with her backstory.

And I didn't say that every character has to be wish fulfillment, but the black version of Diana being the only one that doesn't get to live in Paradise seems like a reall dumb thing to do.

Not inherently so. Nubia: Real One had this backstory and that was written by a black woman.

Nubia not growing up on Themyscira isn't bad or racist unless you go out of your way to make it so. And it isn't like her not being on Themyscira means there are no black Amazons on the island.

[Alpha]

I never said it was racist.


Look, I'm not interested in filling the pages trying to convince people to hate something. But I still don't see why people are so interested in that particular backstory. It's not creative or intelligent, or meaningful. There are so many better ways to approach the character, and you are sticking to one of the weakest ideas.

[Agent Z]

I never said it was racist.

Your comments at least seem to imply you think it is.

If she wasn't there then you know what she was? The black twin that didn't get to grow up in paradise. Any way you put it, her being Diana's sister is not only weird, but also bad representation.

Either Nubia was hidden away, or she was just as strong as Diana but not as eager to be the first to save the world, nor as strong to win the contest. Neither origin makes Nubia feel as blessed and appreciated.

Everyone can accept the idea that Devastation is just as strong as Wonder Woman. Why can't Nubia also be an equal while having a distinct origin that doesn't create these weird and problematic implications?

I don't get that at all. Killmonger was the counterpart to a whole country of incredible african characters. Nubia is literally Diana except with brown skin, and she is the one that didn't get any of the things Diana did. I don't see why she needs this story.

The idea that Hippolyta made two children on the same day, one with clear skin and the other with brown skin, and that the white skin was loved and nurtured and the brown skinned was taken away from Paradise and never mentioned by her family, to be one of the weirdest and most unecessarily racially charged elements of Diana's mythos.

In a world of wish fulfillment, the black version of Diana is the one that doesn't get that wish fulfillment.

I also find it telling you keep referring to her as the "black version of Diana" as if she isn't her own person.

Look, I'm not interested in filling the pages trying to convince people to hate something. But I still don't see why people are so interested in that particular backstory. It's not creative or intelligent, or meaningful. There are so many better ways to approach the character, and you are sticking to one of the weakest ideas.

I don't find your ideas interesting either (the first one you proposed is pretty much Donna Troy's original backstory and if anything makes Nubia lesser than you claim her usual story does). Frankly, the support for the one you dislike lends credence to it being much more interesting.

[Alpha]

Your comments at least seem to imply you think it is.

Let's not go down this avenue ok. I didn't say it was racist so please don't twist my words. Let's be fair to each other.

I also find it telling you keep referring to her as the "black version of Diana" as if she isn't her own person.

I'm trying to point out the weirdness of the 70s version. Nubia is a black version of Diana. Almost like a race bended clone of her. Except one that was discarded away. It's not just the idea that Diana has a brown skinned clone (or "sister"), it's the fact that this "sister" was taken away from Paradise and never talked about again by her family. This character doesn't even have a distinct personality from Diana (who herself is always changing). Nubia has a lot of potential, and I just think that take on her isn't helpful.

I don't find your ideas interesting either (the first one you proposed is pretty much Donna Troy's original backstory and if anything makes Nubia lesser than you claim her usual story does). Frankly, the support for the one you dislike lends credence to it being much more interesting.

Harsh, but ok. It's totally cool for you not to like my ideas. I wish you would, but I get it.

It's nothing like Donna Troy's original backstory though. And since that character has had like 12 different origins it really makes no difference.

You are right bout people here apparently supporting the discarded black clone of Diana origin story. I don't get why, but you are right.

[John Venus]

Let's not go down this avenue ok. I didn't say it was racist so please don't twist my words. Let's be fair to each other.

I'm trying to point out the weirdness of the 70s version. Nubia is a black version of Diana. Almost like a race bended clone of her. Except one that was discarded away. It's not just the idea that Diana has a brown skinned clone (or "sister"), it's the fact that this "sister" was taken away from Paradise and never talked about again by her family. This character doesn't even have a distinct personality from Diana (who herself is always changing). Nubia has a lot of potential, and I just think that take on her isn't helpful.

Harsh, but ok. It's totally cool for you not to like my ideas. I wish you would, but I get it.

It's nothing like Donna Troy's original backstory though. And since that character has had like 12 different origins it really makes no difference.

You are right bout people here apparently supporting the discarded black clone of Diana origin story. I don't get why, but you are right.

I don't get that at all. Killmonger was the counterpart to a whole country of incredible african characters. Nubia is literally Diana except with brown skin, and she is the one that didn't get any of the things Diana did. I don't see why she needs this story.

The idea that Hippolyta made two children on the same day, one with clear skin and the other with brown skin, and that the white skin was loved and nurtured and the brown skinned was taken away from Paradise and never mentioned by her family, to be one of the weirdest and most unecessarily racially charged elements of Diana's mythos.

In a world of wish fulfillment, the black version of Diana is the one that doesn't get that wish fulfillment.

She isn't a clone of Diana. She is literally an entirely different person who also happened to be sculpted from clay. She also wasn't discarded, she was kidnapped from her birth nation by a malevolent entity. She also isn't 'black Diana', she hasn't made enough appearances for us to get a good grasp of her personality but I don't think even in the original story she came across as just a copy of Diana.

Just because there were flaws in the way they told her original story doesn't mean it can't be improved.

[Alpha]

I mean, when I child disappears, and her parents never talk about her ever again, including not telling her "sister" about it, what would you call that?

[I'm a Fish]

I mean, when I child disappears, and her parents never talk about her ever again, including not telling her "sister" about it, what would you call that?

They could easily retcon it so the Amazon’s think Nubia was killed.

[Alpha]

They could easily retcon it so the Amazon’s think Nubia was killed.

Still not a reason to never mention her to Diana. My point is, why get so caught up in the 70s origin? Diana and Nubia don't have a sisterly relationship, and as far as I can see, any origin where they are raised together means that Nubia isn't Diana's equal, either in strength or in courage (since they can't both win the contest).

And any origin where they aren't raised together will tarnish Nubia if they are actual sisters. Because it means she was forgotten and / or abandoned.

Someone here said that the reason why they need to be sisters is so that they are equals. But I gave the example of Devastation as someone born the same way as Diana and just as strong as her, without the need for this secret sister stuff.

And to me, the best reason why Diana doesn't grow up with Nubia, is because Nubia was born after Diana left the Island. There's no need for the secret retcon. The story could even embrace the idea that Nubia was born for the autumn of the amazons, when Paradise Island is transformed into something new. Maybe Nubia's birth could even be tied into the amazons rediscovering bio technology and opening up to the world. Maybe Nubia is the champion born to protect them, while Diana was born to save the rest of the world. Or maybe for something else entirely.

[Koriand'r]

Still not a reason to never mention her to Diana. My point is, why get so caught up in the 70s origin? Diana and Nubia don't have a sisterly relationship, and as far as I can see, any origin where they are raised together means that Nubia isn't Diana's equal, either in strength or in courage (since they can't both win the contest).

And any origin where they aren't raised together will tarnish Nubia if they are actual sisters. Because it means she was forgotten and / or abandoned.

Someone here said that the reason why they need to be sisters is so that they are equals. But I gave the example of Devastation as someone born the same way as Diana and just as strong as her, without the need for this secret sister stuff.

And to me, the best reason why Diana doesn't grow up with Nubia, is because Nubia was born after Diana left the Island. There's no need for the secret retcon. The story could even embrace the idea that Nubia was born for the autumn of the amazons, when Paradise Island is transformed into something new. Maybe Nubia's birth could even be tied into the amazons rediscovering bio technology and opening up to the world. Maybe Nubia is the champion born to protect them, while Diana was born to save the rest of the world. Or maybe for something else entirely.

You just don't get the appeal Alpha and it's fine, everything isn't for everybody. However there's palpable drama inherent in Nubia's original story and it propelled her into having the following she does.

[Alpha]

ok

10 charac

[Agent Z]

Okay, as much as I normally disagree with Alpha, I do think the part about Diana not knowing about Nubia should be left out.