Let's try this again: Legion of Super-Heroes: Five Years Later Omnibus

[caj]

More than a Vertigo Legion, it was a Dark Knight Returns Legion. 5YL had all the tropes from post TDKR era, applied to the Legion myths: older heroes, lost idealism, decadent society, broken friendships, corruption of older characters, cynism, gratuitous deaths. It was a representative of the dark age of comics. If it would had been an history with his own timeline or reality, an elseworld or an independent graphic novel, it would had worked better. This changed the concept of the Legion and the context they supposedly repressents.

I don't say it was bad. It had its strengs, specially on some sci-fi aspects of the society. But this iteration it was a product of its time, one of many with heroes becoming darker and burned out. I'm glad there are people who liked, but I think this era is when everything started to go wrong with the Legion.

Agree on all points.

I always said to my friends that if this had been a book about unknown heroes, it would've been a masterpiece. But the Legion just didn't fit IMO in this dark, hopeless world.

[Comic-Reader Lad]

Well, according to the May 2020 DC solicits, the Legion 5 Years Later Omnibus is indeed still scheduled for August this year -- August 12, 2020 to be exact.

It'll weigh in at over 1400 pages, so you can read the entire 5YL story and judge for yourself.

I think now that the Legion has been rebooted and retconned several times since then, people can just read it for the story instead of being upset that it replaced their existing Legion. That's what prevented me from truly loving this series. Beyond the often-confusing storytelling techniques, what 5YL gave us was NOT better than what it replaced. That's the wrong way to do a reboot. In contrast, John Byrne's Superman and George Perez's Wonder Woman were light years better than what had just come before for those characters.

Anyway, here's the current version of the solicit:

LEGION OF SUPER-HEROES: FIVE YEARS LATER OMNIBUS VOL. 1 HC
written by KEITH GIFFEN, TOM BIERBAUM, MARY BIERBAUM, DAN JURGENS, and AL GORDON
art by KEITH GIFFEN, JASON PEARSON, COLLEEN DORAN, CURT SWAN, STUART IMMONEN, DAN JURGENS, and others
cover by DUSTY ABELL and BOB SMITH

It’s the Legion of Super-Heroes like you’ve never seen them before, as the United Planets becomes a darker place, with familiar characters changed and the Earth overtaken by alien invaders—prompting the Legion to take on these dangerous new threats. Now this bold era of DC history is collected in an omnibus edition! Collects Legion of Super-Heroes #1-39, Timber Wolf #1-5, Legion of Super-Heroes Annual #1-3, and Adventures of Superman #478.

ON SALE 08.12.20
$150.00 US | 7.0625” x 10.875” | 1,424 PAGES
FC | ISBN: 978-1-77950-313-8

[caj]

Hopefully, it does come out.

You know, I criticized the creative team awhile back for undoing the Rond Vidar is Green Lantern storyline. However, after reading an interview with Mark Waid, who was editor of the 5-year-gap Legion for a short period (and later became the writer of the Threeboot Legion), I must apologize. Here's what he said:

"Already the Legion continuity had been plagued with revisions in mainstream DC continuity. We'd been told we could no longer make reference to Rond Vidar as a Green Lantern. We'd been told, thanks to Hawkworld rebooting Hawkman, that Thanagarians could no longer be in continuity. There were other instances of similar madness. But what killed us and killed any chance Legion Volume 4 had for a linear narrative that might have actually brought readers in was the Superman Ripple Effect. Because of interoffice politics and machinations that make no sense to me to this day, it was decided that not only was there no Superboy, but we weren't even allowed to reference him or to make reference to the Pocket Universe that he came from. Even Mon-El could no longer be called that because the 'El' name belonged exclusively to Superman."

Also interesting was this:

I'm the one who let Keith (Giffen) kill Blok, so we all have our crosses to bear. At the time of the Giffen relaunch, Keith wanted to pick a Legionnaire to kill - pick one by LITERALLY pulling a name out of a hat. That name was 'Blok'.

[Zero Hunter]

I'm the one who let Keith (Giffen) kill Blok, so we all have our crosses to bear. At the time of the Giffen relaunch, Keith wanted to pick a Legionnaire to kill - pick one by LITERALLY pulling a name out of a hat. That name was 'Blok'.

I doubt that mattered much to Waid. He seemed to not like or even hate any Legion member created past the Silver Age. You look at all his Legion work in both the reboot and threeboot and he didn't use almost any of late 70's/80's characters even though they were some of the most most popular.

[Timothy Hunter]

Those Kieth Giffen drawn issues of 5yl might be my favorite issues ever in an ongoing series published by the big two*

People like Moore, Chaykin, and Miller had revolutionized what could be done with comic panels, but none had the audacity to do everything in 9 panel grids. Even more insane is that this was a monthly comic, but upheld the same amount of quality and conducted the same risks as DC's prestige format mini series at the time like The Shadow, Gilgamesh ll, and DKR.

[caj]

I doubt that mattered much to Waid. He seemed to not like or even hate any Legion member created past the Silver Age. You look at all his Legion work in both the reboot and threeboot and he didn't use almost any of late 70's/80's characters even though they were some of the most most popular.

I agree. There are some writers who are snobs when it comes to modern-day Legion characters. They believe that only the Adventure Comics legion members are true legionnaires. Characters like Timberwolf, Wildfire, Dawnstar, Blok, etc... just don't exist for them.

Giffen liked even less members, which is why it was a mystery that he wanted to write the book in the first place. He just didn't seem to have a connection to very many of them. The fact that he decided who he would kill by drawing a name out of a hat is hilarious - and typical.

[caj]

Those Kieth Giffen drawn issues of 5yl might be my favorite issues ever in an ongoing series published by the big two*

I have mixed emotions about that period of time. I can say that the book is fascinating, well-written, and had more information in one page than most books had in an entire issue. I was constantly having to go back to earlier days and research Legion history, which I loved.

But I must say it was difficult to see some of the damage that happened to my favorite characters. It remains the only comic I ever read where I would be sick at my stomach each month before I read it because I never knew what was going to happen to someone I cared about.

[Timothy Hunter]

I have mixed emotions about that period of time. I can say that the book is fascinating, well-written, and had more information in one page than most books had in an entire issue. I was constantly having to go back to earlier days and research Legion history, which I loved.

But I must say it was difficult to see some of the damage that happened to my favorite characters. It remains the only comic I ever read where I would be sick at my stomach each month before I read it because I never knew what was going to happen to someone I cared about.

Yeah, it seemed like a poor buisness decision on DC's part to allow Giffen and company to be able to do the time skip, abide by a 9 panel grid, and radically alter the tone from what Legion comics had been at that point. With Paul Levitz, the Legion of Superheroes were at their height of their popularity. Perhaps if 5 Years Later didn't happen LoSH could have continued to be one of DC's most popular franchises to this day, not the niche cult brand that it is today.

[Scott Taylor]

The FYL story perhaps did relegate the Legion to a secondary place compared to the past, but getting to that point likely had more to do with Crisis than anything else. DC flat out failed to revive Legion after Crisis, opting for multiple JL titles instead as team books, and Crisis also effectively ended Superboy.

The original LoSH was born in the 1950s and reflected the "Golden Age Society" of the post-war era, when America was living high on the hog. Culture has changed so much since that time - generation after generation has dealt with huge social changes, economic changes and creeping cynicism. The time seems ripe now for a new, more diverse LoSH, that reflects culture's quest for socio-economic justice, and I am liking what Bendis is doing so far.

[ultradav]

More than a Vertigo Legion, it was a Dark Knight Returns Legion. 5YL had all the tropes from post TDKR era, applied to the Legion myths: older heroes, lost idealism, decadent society, broken friendships, corruption of older characters, cynism, gratuitous deaths. It was a representative of the dark age of comics. If it would had been an history with his own timeline or reality, an elseworld or an independent graphic novel, it would had worked better. This changed the concept of the Legion and the context they supposedly repressents.

I don't say it was bad. It had its strengs, specially on some sci-fi aspects of the society. But this iteration it was a product of its time, one of many with heroes becoming darker and burned out. I'm glad there are people who liked, but I think this era is when everything started to go wrong with the Legion.

Yes and no... the context was dark but there was an optimistic undertone, the Legion rising from the ashes to bring heroism back to the galaxy. One of the overall themes of the series was the triumph of the "human" spirit, even through the darkest of times. It was an interesting contrast: Giffen's run ended with the destruction of earth which is as grim as it gets but they also made a point to showcase the resilience of earth's population and their collective will being the catalyst for the end of Dominion rule.

[justinslot]

I have this omnibus! And I am going to start reading it at some point...I've never actually read the whole 5YL story before, just encountered random issues of it in the quarter bins as a wee lad.

But I have a general 5YL question that I don't want to start a whole new thread for: where does 5YL fit in with the various Legion continuities? You know, like pre-Zero Hour, Threeboot, and so on...like at the time 5YL was not presented as some sort of possible future, right? It was the actual adventures of the Legion, the same Legion people had been reading since the 50s. When DC brings back the original Legion (in Lightning Saga) it's pretty much the same group as it existed right before 5YL--there's Sensor Girl, not Projectra, so you know her various 80s pre-5YL storylines happened. So...what is 5YL now? Just a divergent Legion timeline? The Legion who shows up in Lightning Saga are the pre-5YL Legion...I suppose 5YL could still be in their future. Or there are two sets of original Legion universes--one with 5YL, one with the pre-5YL stories unwritten other than Lightning Saga, Three Worlds, Starman, etc. Basically I'm wondering why the DC wiki does not treat 5YL/SW6 as a separate continuity, instead counting it as part of the original Legion timeline but a part that no longer exists (even though everything exists now.)

By the way, I remain baffled that after all the work DC did to restore the Legion in the 00s they still thought it was a good idea to do YET ANOTHER REBOOT with Bendis.

[Thor-Ul]

I have this omnibus! And I am going to start reading it at some point...I've never actually read the whole 5YL story before, just encountered random issues of it in the quarter bins as a wee lad.

Congratulations.

But I have a general 5YL question that I don't want to start a whole new thread for: where does 5YL fit in with the various Legion continuities? You know, like pre-Zero Hour, Threeboot, and so on...like at the time 5YL was not presented as some sort of possible future, right? It was the actual adventures of the Legion, the same Legion people had been reading since the 50s. When DC brings back the original Legion (in Lightning Saga) it's pretty much the same group as it existed right before 5YL--there's Sensor Girl, not Projectra, so you know her various 80s pre-5YL storylines happened. So...what is 5YL now? Just a divergent Legion timeline? The Legion who shows up in Lightning Saga are the pre-5YL Legion...I suppose 5YL could still be in their future. Or there are two sets of original Legion universes--one with 5YL, one with the pre-5YL stories unwritten other than Lightning Saga, Three Worlds, Starman, etc. Basically I'm wondering why the DC wiki does not treat 5YL/SW6 as a separate continuity, instead counting it as part of the original Legion timeline but a part that no longer exists (even though everything exists now.)

Short answer: there is no offcial mention to the status of 5YL, but it can I think than it can be unofficially considered as alternate timeline from the original Legion.

Long answer: In the moment of its publication, the 5YL continuity was not a reboot, but a continuation of the Legion after the Magic Wars. Yes, basically, it was the (relative) present of the same characters from before the 5YL officially, that it was something than Giffen was proud: real changes in the official continuity. But in the time of the Lightning saga, there were already Two reboots for the Legion and the story needed a Legion which had history with Superman, which both mentioned reboots lacked of. And that was the stepping stone to stablish the retroboot, with a Legion divergent history previous to the Magic Wars.
Also, consider than there were some internal but brief micro-reboots in the story (the Glorith-Mordru bussiness), so we could say than that Legion history is an alternate timeline now.

5YL It could be perfectly an alternate earth, if some writer wanted to define it as such, but for the moment can be considered as alternate timeline. There are a lot of different elements between 5YL and retroboot to the first be considered the future of the last. Maybe some dark timeline could add elements from 5YL, but it would not be 5YL properly.

By the way, I remain baffled that after all the work DC did to restore the Legion in the 00s they still thought it was a good idea to do YET ANOTHER REBOOT with Bendis.

Not only you. And it doesn't seems like that worked that well, isn't?

[Thor-Ul]

Yes and no... the context was dark but there was an optimistic undertone, the Legion rising from the ashes to bring heroism back to the galaxy. One of the overall themes of the series was the triumph of the "human" spirit, even through the darkest of times. It was an interesting contrast: Giffen's run ended with the destruction of earth which is as grim as it gets but they also made a point to showcase the resilience of earth's population and their collective will being the catalyst for the end of Dominion rule.

Maybe under Giffen pen there still there was that tone, but I didn't percived it. The idea of destroying earth (or start a run with a destroyed earth) it is not exactly hopeful.

[justinslot]

Thank you for the reply and the explanation, Thor-Ul.

[Thor-Ul]

You are welcome, justinslot. Enjoy your reading.