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  1. #961
    Mighty Member TriggerWarning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1 View Post
    And no way am I saying Colin Kaepernick is 1st string starting QB. He's a guy you have as a backup due to experience in playoffs and regular season. He's someone who starts in an emergency as a backup. A good 2nd string QB. And lets be frank again...he's a way , waaaaay better QB than Josh Johnson, Hell there are a lot of backup QB's that Kaepernick is better than right now in the NFL.
    But is it worth the headache and media distraction for a backup?

    Yesterday the Cardinals cut a defensive lineman after a domestic incident where he allegedly pointed a gun at a woman. The player though was a nobody and the team didn't feel waiting around for his case to actually be settled in criminal court was worth the distraction. I guarantee though that if the same thing happened with Aaron Donald that one of two things would happen: The Rams would wait to see how it played out in court and give platitudes like "he's sorry" or such. Donald is a superstar and fair or not like all superstars gets second and third chances. Just like Tyreek Hill's child abuse is being ignored because he's a superstar. The Chiefs are going to take heat for keeping Hill on the team but all will be forgiven by the fans if he has a season like last year and the Chiefs win which they probably will barring an injury to Mahomes. I'm not supporting this as fair, just being realistic.

    Thats my point. Once the days of the read option offense gimmick faded in the NFL Kaepernick's star faded because he's a below average QB in terms of reading a defense and accuracy. Other than Cam Newton he might have been the best at the read option where you want a mobile and fast QB but in a conventional offense he's not that good. Kaep is not going to bring wins, he's just going to bring distractions. Just like Tim Tebow.

  2. #962
    Mighty Member TriggerWarning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surf View Post
    Look. Every now and again a strikingly poignant and brutally salient point falls out of the message board sky onto the landscape and some thoughts and maybe even possibilities are opened that might not were not before. Laugh out loud (a little), the above is opposite of that but still, it happens and I've seen it and I'm not closed to it.

    Anywho, so you know little of sports in general OR maybe that's too harsh. At the very least, very little of NFL workings to drop a Tebow here. Cult of Tebow sounds like something your heard on a cable sports platform 8 years ago.

    Tim Tebow was cut, every time, because he was so bad at being a professional football player. Then he switched sports and then failed at that on a professional level as well. After that what is there?
    Tebow was a project QB with an intriguing set of skills that many hoped they could develop. Skill wise he was actually quite similar to Kaepernick in that he was very mobile but also very inaccurate. Both were ideally suited for the read option offense but that was largely being eliminated in the NFL

    The Cult of Tebow is how I refer to the fact that both fans and broadcaster were obsessed with him. Networks would cut away from the game in progress to show you a highlight on the Jets because Tebow had been put in on a play, usually on special teams as a punt protector. Every week the coach of the Jets was bombarded with questions about Tebow were they going to use him and how they were going to use him. All for a backup.

    Then consider how delusional his fan club was the year the Bronco's made the playoffs. All were screaming about Tebow brought them back to victory again, Tebow wills the Broncos to victory, etc, etc. Most of those games during the Broncos run were despite Tebow. Like a game against Chicago where Tebow and the offense SUCKED all game long but the Bronco defense kept the game low scoring. At the end of the game though Chicago was going to run the clock out and win when the Chicago running back screwed up and ran out of bounds stopping the clock (not Tebow). Denver got the ball back at midfield thanks to a great punt return (not Tebow). The offense then failed to do anything (this was Tebow). Matt Prater then kicked what at the time was the 4th longest field goal in NFL history (60 yards) to tie the game (not Tebow). In overtime the Bronco defense forced a turnover (not Tebow). The offense then as usual failed to do anything (this was Tebow). Matt Prater then kicked a 59 yard field goal to win the game (not Tebow).

    After the Chicago game it was like every week the Bronco's won "TEBOW DID IT AGAIN." Saturday Night Live even did a parody of it where Jesus visits the Broncos and points out that Tebow sucks and says to the Broncos something like "you should be thanking your kicker. He kicked a 59 yarder. I pray to you Matt Prater."

    Tebow would have lingered around the league for many more years with coaches trying to develop him given his massive popularity, his team first attitude, and intriguing abilities (other than accuracy) hoping to develop him if wasn't such a media distraction. But his talent wasn't there at the time to make it worth the distraction. As I keep saying, its essentially the same issue with Kaepernick even though the reasons for the distraction couldn't be more opposite.

  3. #963
    TEST YOUR MIGHT! The Big G's Avatar
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    I think its going to be a LONG season for the Cards
    Captain, in Order to build a better world, sometimes means tearing the old one down... And that makes enemies.

  4. #964
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big G View Post
    I think its going to be a LONG season for the Cards
    It's been a long century for the Cards...

    But hey they still got that 1947 championship to hang their hats on, no one can ever take that one away from them.

  5. #965
    Mighty Member TriggerWarning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1 View Post
    And no way am I saying Colin Kaepernick is 1st string starting QB. He's a guy you have as a backup due to experience in playoffs and regular season. He's someone who starts in an emergency as a backup. A good 2nd string QB. And lets be frank again...he's a way , waaaaay better QB than Josh Johnson, Hell there are a lot of backup QB's that Kaepernick is better than right now in the NFL.
    A lot? Lets go team by team. And lets be real too and accept that if a team recently invested a draft pick on a QB then that QB is automatically going to get the nod over Kaepernick due to hope they will be good vs a known quantity in Kaepernick. Basically I'm saying that Kaepernick might be better this season than say Daniel Jones, Drew Lock, Will Grier, etc but they will obviously be prioritized over someone like Kaep due to the investment of the picks and hope that they'll get better. If you actually look at the depth charts there aren't that many.

    Where Kaep would probably be an improvement: Arizona, Dallas, Green Bay. All three either have extremely unproven backups or in the case of Green Bay a backup (DeShone Kizer) who has looked bad on multiple teams now.

    Where he might be equally bad or best a very marginal improvement based on his ability after years out of the league and known weaknesses (struggles to read a defense and inaccuracy): Atlanta, Detroit, Kansas City, NY Jets, and Steelers. But in these cases is the at best marginal improvement worth the media circus?

    The Eagles apparently lost another backup QB tonight so include them as you will. But regardless you have 3-4 teams where he would be better and 5 where he'd be a wash. All for a guy who would cause a fan revolt and cause a media headache.

    Even a team like Miami, predicted to possibly be the worst team in the league, has QB's far better than Kaep. Rosen is basically a draft pick for them and still could turn into a superstar. Fitzpatrick meanwhile is a proven QB who occasionally flirts with greatness (basically what you want in a backup).

    And you kept bringing up Washington. They just drafted Dwayne Haskins with a 1st rd pick so he automatically gets a nod over Kaep. They also have Case Keenum who is a serviceable QB who just two seasons ago nearly took the Vikings to the superbowl. Plus they have Alex Smith under contract still and he might be back in a year. And there is Colt McCoy who has looked decent in spot starts. Barring injury to two out of the three of Haskins, McCoy, and Keenum why would they want to take on the media circus of Kaep? They only rolled with Josh Johnson last year because both Keenum and McCoy were hurt and it was a lost season by that point. Why bring on the Kaep headache in a lost season?
    Last edited by TriggerWarning; 08-15-2019 at 09:22 PM.

  6. #966
    Mighty Member TriggerWarning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big G View Post
    I think its going to be a LONG season for the Cards
    Maybe?

    The Cards aren't going to roll out their real offense til games count. Murray will likely struggle some just because he's a rookie but until the games count and they start running the real Air Raid offense I wouldn't worry too much.

  7. #967

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Big G View Post
    I think its going to be a LONG season for the Cards
    Quote Originally Posted by TriggerWarning View Post
    Maybe?

    The Cards aren't going to roll out their real offense til games count. Murray will likely struggle some just because he's a rookie but until the games count and they start running the real Air Raid offense I wouldn't worry too much.
    I don't know that it's the offense I'd worry about...

    They haven't been able to stop anyone from running the ball on the first string or any string defensive line yet. This could have something to do with them cutting DT Darius Philon right on the heels of them cutting DT Robert Nkemdiche. Also, they sound like they may have lost CB Robert Alford for an indeterminate amount of time to injury, who was their #2 corner. Their #1 corner is, of course, Patrick Peterson, who will suspended until Week #7. Thus, their starting corners going into the season are rookie Byron Murphy (pick #33 this year), and either Trumaine Brock or Brandon Williams. Brandon Williams can't cover leftovers if you gave him 1,000 feet of aluminum foil.

    So... yeah, they have Chandler Jones and Terrell Suggs on the pass rush, but not much else.
    Last edited by worstblogever; 08-15-2019 at 11:27 PM.
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    Unadjusted Human on CBR SUPERECWFAN1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriggerWarning View Post
    But is it worth the headache and media distraction for a backup?
    They again signed a LB who never started a game last year for them and he committed domestic assault. That exploded as a big deal and the Redskins tried to explain it away and it failed. Hell the article mocked them for what they tried to float.

    Yesterday the Cardinals cut a defensive lineman after a domestic incident where he allegedly pointed a gun at a woman. The player though was a nobody and the team didn't feel waiting around for his case to actually be settled in criminal court was worth the distraction.
    The player is this one. He wasn't a no name backup. He was actually a starting DE they had signed just recently to a 2 year deal. But his arrest was public and they cut him. Now I await the Redskins to go sign him and excuse it away ala the last guy they did.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...st/1978990001/


    I guarantee though that if the same thing happened with Aaron Donald that one of two things would happen: The Rams would wait to see how it played out in court and give platitudes like "he's sorry" or such. Donald is a superstar and fair or not like all superstars gets second and third chances. Just like Tyreek Hill's child abuse is being ignored because he's a superstar. The Chiefs are going to take heat for keeping Hill on the team but all will be forgiven by the fans if he has a season like last year and the Chiefs win which they probably will barring an injury to Mahomes. I'm not supporting this as fair, just being realistic.
    Honestly you never followed the Chiefs situation and it shows. This was the timeline and what happened.

    - KC was prepared to sign Hill to a $100 million extension. A fact the GM said the deal was done and that once the league year started he would likely sign it in a few days.

    - Hill's case became public as he was being investigated by CPS and Police. The Chiefs moved quick to yank the deal back as we saw.

    - The police dropped the investigation and Hill was ready to rejoin the team. Then right on draft day KC got told the investigation was back on.

    - KC told Hill to go home to not report to the team and the team changed plans on draft day. The idea originally seemed to draft defense fully (there was more needs) but with the potential loss of Hill coming as the team felt he would get suspended and FA loss of Conley the Chiefs had to trade up and draft Coleman to potentially replace Hill.

    - The Chiefs were told Hill would not face a suspension due to police not charging him . But as the team responded they are keeping a close eye on Hill and likely if he does ever get arrested or anything.

    Thats my point. Once the days of the read option offense gimmick faded in the NFL Kaepernick's star faded because he's a below average QB in terms of reading a defense and accuracy. Other than Cam Newton he might have been the best at the read option where you want a mobile and fast QB but in a conventional offense he's not that good. Kaep is not going to bring wins, he's just going to bring distractions. Just like Tim Tebow.
    Except a lot of what teams run now are Read Option. In Philadelphia they run that. KC runs it at times as well. Washington itself ran some as well at times. Kaepernick is not Tim Tebow. He can pass the ball. Again your pointing at Tebow as a comparison is a bit weak. By the end of Tebow's run in New England he wasn't much of a media attraction as he was in Denver. His time with the NY Jets seemed to kill that frenzy people had for him.
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  9. #969
    Unadjusted Human on CBR SUPERECWFAN1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriggerWarning View Post
    [A lot? Lets go team by team. And lets be real too and accept that if a team recently invested a draft pick on a QB then that QB is automatically going to get the nod over Kaepernick due to hope they will be good vs a known quantity in Kaepernick. Basically I'm saying that Kaepernick might be better this season than say Daniel Jones, Drew Lock, Will Grier, etc but they will obviously be prioritized over someone like Kaep due to the investment of the picks and hope that they'll get better. If you actually look at the depth charts there aren't that many.
    Lets go INDEPTH then and go TEAM by Team then since were on this. What teams would Colin Kaepernick be better as a backup for.

    - Philadelphia Eagles - Backup QB's Kody Kessler , Nate Sudfield and Clayton Thorson - Its clear that Kaepernick has more starting experience and could actually be a better backup than those listed. Kessler has been on 2-3 teams already and hasn't done anything. The other guys haven't started or done anything of note.

    - Washington Redskins - Are set at QB backups as they have Case Keenum and Haskins. Also McCoy if he's healthy. Alex Smith will be back hopefully as a backup in 2020.

    - NY Giants - Kyle Lauletta , Daniel Jones , and Alex Tanney . Its clear that Jones is the future. Eli has been healthy so no worry about needing an emergency #2 QB right now.

    - Dallas Cowboys - Cooper Rush , Dalton Sturm and Mike White - All 3 have recently joined this team 2 seasons ago through draft. Its clear Kaepernick is better than this right now.

    - Chicago Bears - Tyler Bray & Chase Daniel - Daniel is steady here and the clear #2.

    - Minnesota - Sean Mannion , Kyle Sloter , and Jake Browning : Browning is an undrafted FA from 2019. Sloter is new to Vikings after Denver's practice squad and Mannion has only threw 53 passes in his career. Yep its clear Kaepernick is better here.


    - Green Bay - Tim Boyle , DeShone Kizer & Manny Wilkins - The GM seems to believe Kizer (who struggled in Cleveland) can be a solid QB. Right now however he's not. Boyle and Wilkins joined Packers in 2018 and 2019 NFL Draft. Kaepernick right now is a better experienced backup than Kizer. Sorry thats the truth.


    - Detroit - David Fales , Tom Savage and Josh Johnson : I already mocked the GM claiming Johnson could be a good backup QB here. Yeah this is a complete dumpster fire of comedy. Kaepernick is needed here.

    - Tampa Bay - Blaine Gabbert & Ryan Griffin : Kaepernick ended up starting on a worse 49ers team than Gabbert who struggled in 2016. So there you go. He's better here.

    - Carolina - Will Grier , Kyle Allen , & Taylor Heinicke : Grier is just a rookie and yeah with Newton's injury from last year its pretty much a need to have an experienced QB here.

    - Atlanta - Matt Schaub , Matt Simms and Danny Etling : Schaub is the clear cut #2. A classic veteran QB who started longer. This is a no brainer that the Falcons don't need Kaepernick.

    - New Orleans Saints - Teddy Bridgewater and Tayson Hill : Hill is the project guy , but Bridgewater started 1 season and hasn't done much. Kaepernick would likely be a better experienced backup to have honestly.

    - Arizona : Brett Hundley , Chad Kanoff and Drew Anderson : This is another case where Kaepernick would be a good experienced QB to have on roster.

    - San Francisco : Nick Mullins , CJ Beathard and Wilton Speight : Mullins showed he's a capable backup .

    - Seattle : J.T Barrett , Paxton Lynch , & Geno Smith : Pretty clear Kaepernick is a better option as a backup here as he has more starting experienced combined than Geno Smith and Lynch.

    - L.A. Rams : Blake Bortles , John Wolford , and Brandon Allen : Bortles here is pretty funny considering he washed finally out in Jacksonville. Kaepernick is a better QB than Bortles .


    NFC Count : 11 Teams could have signed Kaepernick because he's a better option than what they have listed right now. This is just NFC....


    Where Kaep would probably be an improvement: Arizona, Dallas, Green Bay. All three either have extremely unproven backups or in the case of Green Bay a backup (DeShone Kizer) who has looked bad on multiple teams now.

    Where he might be equally bad or best a very marginal improvement based on his ability after years out of the league and known weaknesses (struggles to read a defense and inaccuracy): Atlanta, Detroit, Kansas City, NY Jets, and Steelers. But in these cases is the at best marginal improvement worth the media circus?

    The Eagles apparently lost another backup QB tonight so include them as you will. But regardless you have 3-4 teams where he would be better and 5 where he'd be a wash. All for a guy who would cause a fan revolt and cause a media headache.

    Even a team like Miami, predicted to possibly be the worst team in the league, has QB's far better than Kaep. Rosen is basically a draft pick for them and still could turn into a superstar. Fitzpatrick meanwhile is a proven QB who occasionally flirts with greatness (basically what you want in a backup).

    And you kept bringing up Washington. They just drafted Dwayne Haskins with a 1st rd pick so he automatically gets a nod over Kaep. They also have Case Keenum who is a serviceable QB who just two seasons ago nearly took the Vikings to the superbowl. Plus they have Alex Smith under contract still and he might be back in a year. And there is Colt McCoy who has looked decent in spot starts. Barring injury to two out of the three of Haskins, McCoy, and Keenum why would they want to take on the media circus of Kaep? They only rolled with Josh Johnson last year because both Keenum and McCoy were hurt and it was a lost season by that point. Why bring on the Kaep headache in a lost season?
    I think everyone here can tell I am discussing Washington last season. Hell I even made it a point to discuss that they signed someone who committed domestic battery and took heat the last year over it. And that guy never saw the field in 2018.
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  10. #970
    Old school comic book fan WestPhillyPunisher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1 View Post
    Lets go INDEPTH then and go TEAM by Team then since were on this. What teams would Colin Kaepernick be better as a backup for.

    - Philadelphia Eagles - Backup QB's Kody Kessler , Nate Sudfield and Clayton Thorson - Its clear that Kaepernick has more starting experience and could actually be a better backup than those listed. Kessler has been on 2-3 teams already and hasn't done anything. The other guys haven't started or done anything of note.
    By the by, Kessler was KO'd in the first quarter of last night's Eagles 24-10 win over Jacksonville with a possible concussion, forcing Thurston Howell III, er, Clayton Thorson, the FOURTH string to play the rest of the game. We won't know until today (perhaps) about the severity of Kessler's situation and if he'll be held out of next Thursday's game against Baltimore. At this point, the Birds will have no choice but to look for another passer, but I can assure you it WON'T be Kaepernick. I suspect the idea will be that passer will be nothing more than a warm body to get the team through the rest of the preseason and/or until Kessler is back on his feet, and I doubt Kaep would want to be in that sort of situation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestPhillyPunisher View Post
    By the by, Kessler was KO'd in the first quarter of last night's Eagles 24-10 win over Jacksonville with a possible concussion, forcing Thurston Howell III, er, Clayton Thorson, the FOURTH string to play the rest of the game. We won't know until today (perhaps) about the severity of Kessler's situation and if he'll be held out of next Thursday's game against Baltimore. At this point, the Birds will have no choice but to look for another passer, but I can assure you it WON'T be Kaepernick. I suspect the idea will be that passer will be nothing more than a warm body to get the team through the rest of the preseason and/or until Kessler is back on his feet, and I doubt Kaep would want to be in that sort of situation.

    Given Wentz's injury history they seriously should look at a veteran QB ala Kaepernick. Because they may need him.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1 View Post
    Given Wentz's injury history they seriously should look at a veteran QB ala Kaepernick. Because they may need him.
    I seriously doubt the Eagles feel that way. They're going to hold their breath and hope Wentz stays in one piece until Nate Sudfeld returns in week two or three of the regular season. Meanwhile, Kessler will probably be off concussion protocol by this time next week and will be cleared to play for the preseason finale. My guess is the front office sees no reason to bring in Kaepernick who, in their eyes, would be no better than the third string since they have high hopes for Sudfeld.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestPhillyPunisher View Post
    I seriously doubt the Eagles feel that way. They're going to hold their breath and hope Wentz stays in one piece until Nate Sudfeld returns in week two or three of the regular season. Meanwhile, Kessler will probably be off concussion protocol by this time next week and will be cleared to play for the preseason finale. My guess is the front office sees no reason to bring in Kaepernick who, in their eyes, would be no better than the third string since they have high hopes for Sudfeld.
    I'm sure they have high hopes , but its kinda ...a roll of the dice to hope a 2nd or 3rd year QB can suddenly deliver when called on when he hasn't started or threw many passes. What made Foles so good was he was used to that offense , started games for a few seasons and had been there. Kessler hasn't really impressed with 2-3 other teams.

    Hell I'm worried if Mahomes gets hurt because KC only has Chad Henne as a veteran QB (34) behind him. Henne hasn't set the world on fire with other teams and this is a scary deal with just him there. The other backups is 2 young QB's selected in 2018 and someone off the street in 2019. So yeah I'd say this about my favorite team , Colin Kaepernick would be a solid #2 for Kansas City right now given who is there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPERECWFAN1 View Post
    I'm sure they have high hopes , but its kinda ...a roll of the dice to hope a 2nd or 3rd year QB can suddenly deliver when called on when he hasn't started or threw many passes. What made Foles so good was he was used to that offense , started games for a few seasons and had been there. Kessler hasn't really impressed with 2-3 other teams.

    Hell I'm worried if Mahomes gets hurt because KC only has Chad Henne as a veteran QB (34) behind him. Henne hasn't set the world on fire with other teams and this is a scary deal with just him there. The other backups is 2 young QB's selected in 2018 and someone off the street in 2019. So yeah I'd say this about my favorite team , Colin Kaepernick would be a solid #2 for Kansas City right now given who is there.
    It could be argued Kaepernick might be a solid starter on a few teams right now. But, the simple truth is he remains radioactive as Chernobyl and NO team will touch him, regardless of how desperate their quarterback situation might be. The excuses are numerous:

    --he's too old
    --he's been out of the league too long
    --he doesn't fit the offensive scheme
    --he's too much of a distraction
    --he's not worth the hassle

    About the Eagles, it's clear they're going to ride or die with Sudfeld and Kessler. Heck, they might kick the tires on Mike Vick before they call Kaepernick. Like it or not, that's just the way it is.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WestPhillyPunisher View Post
    It could be argued Kaepernick might be a solid starter on a few teams right now. But, the simple truth is he remains radioactive as Chernobyl and NO team will touch him, regardless of how desperate their quarterback situation might be. The excuses are numerous:

    --he's too old
    --he's been out of the league too long
    --he doesn't fit the offensive scheme
    --he's too much of a distraction
    --he's not worth the hassle

    About the Eagles, it's clear they're going to ride or die with Sudfeld and Kessler. Heck, they might kick the tires on Mike Vick before they call Kaepernick. Like it or not, that's just the way it is.
    We sadly know its not age (Johnson is older than Kaepernick) , its not being out of NFL longer (He had been out of NFL since 2014), its not actual talent on field (Johnson last threw a pass in 2011 in a NFL gane). Hell its not even about scheme really (Kaepernick ran Chip Kelly's system with WRs that pretty much are gone now).

    Teams are afraid of media attention and someones reaction. In years from now they will admit they were wrong to do this.
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