Rhino(Amazing Spiderman 2) vs Juggernaut(X-Men 3)

[Jonathan]

Both start off 100 feet apart in downtown NY. Noone else will interfere.

[Guy1]

Both start off 100 feet apart in downtown NY. Noone else will interfere.

Rhino has virtually no feats. His missiles couldn't blow up a sewer lid. So it comes down to how well Juggernaut fairs against machine guns.

[Jonathan]

Rhino has virtually no feats. His missiles couldn't blow up a sewer lid. So it comes down to how well Juggernaut fairs against machine guns.

Keep in mind the missiles were already likely damaged, having been deflected by Spiderman, when they went off. Plus, given that they had decent blasts, I would say the not blowing up a sewer lid is more a mishap of the special effects for that scene than a true measurement of power. I don't want to stoop to the assuming power levels that weren't shown fallacy, but at the same time I have a hard time not accepting those rockets as at least equal to something like a bazooka.

Regardless, he was tossing or knocking cars around pretty good so I'm trying to remember Juggernaut's best feats; smashing through walls doesn't seem to measure up.

[Guy1]

Keep in mind the missiles were already likely damaged, having been deflected by Spiderman, when they went off. Plus, given that they had decent blasts, I would say the not blowing up a sewer lid is more a mishap of the special effects for that scene than a true measurement of power. I don't want to stoop to the assuming power levels that weren't shown fallacy, but at the same time I have a hard time not accepting those rockets as at least equal to something like a bazooka.

Regardless, he was tossing or knocking cars around pretty good so I'm trying to remember Juggernaut's best feats; smashing through walls doesn't seem to measure up.

He did pimp slap Logan around and ran down a bunch of normal human mooks. But, yeah, it was mostly running through walls and throwing Logan through them.

Good point about the rockets though. Yeah, it's a bit hard to tell how tough Rhino is supposed to be since he had such few feats.
I think this is coming down to fire power. If he can effect Juggy with them and take him down from range, he could win. But he doesn't have the durability feats to show he can survive Juggernaut ramming him, so if he gets in close...

[Hazard]

I am going to say Rhino. He was overall a little more impressive despite his short screen time.

[Jonathan]

I am going to say Rhino. He was overall a little more impressive despite his short screen time.

Yeah, its sad that Rhino's five or so minutes of screen time is at least as impressive and probably a slight bit more so than Juggernaut appearing off and on throughout X3. I wish Rhino had had more screen time. Maybe next movie?

[UFT]

juggs was hyped as immune to everything. theres no reason why theyd lie to us about his power.
unless rhino can shut off his mutation, how does he hurt juggernaut

[Jonathan]

juggs was hyped as immune to everything. theres no reason why theyd lie to us about his power.
unless rhino can shut off his mutation, how does he hurt juggernaut

Um, no, that's not how it works. For debate purposes, Juggernaut is only proof against up to the most powerful thing he was shown to be proof against in the movie.

[UFT]

so if someone says
"hey its this guy, he once ripped apart a black hole"
but in the issue we never see this, we should throw out the black hole feat?
this is nonsense.
your as strong as the story portrays you to be.
look at the rules

Non-canon sources are invalid for evidence. With rare exceptions, comics not in continuity such as Elseworlds, What Ifs, or alternate universes are not used for evidence in debates of a particular mainstream character.
Narrative hyperbole or speech hyperbole are also not considered valid evidence for a character's feats. As well, instances of PIS (plot induce stupidity - see below) and SvFL (Spiderman vs. Firelord - see below) are generally removed from consideration in standard versus debates.

Narrative hyperbole is when the narrator of a comic book says one thing while the action drawn on the pages clearly show something else. Sometimes, in the case of speech hyperbole, it is a character who says one thing, while the pages show differently. This does not mean the narrator or the character is always wrong.

do you see what they are saying here?
hyperbole is one thing, because its only hyperbole if the story has contradicted what we were told.
if gladiator is described as destroying a star by another character, but can't destroy a planet when going all out, then thats a hyperbole.

what i said was a soldier said no earthly object has stopped movie juggernaut when he gets going, and this was not contradicted. since when he was stopped, he was cured/powerless. which is obviously an exception.
the defence of movie juggernaut was never breached. he didnt have so much as a scratch on him.
so therefore the narrator or in this case the soldier must be assumed as telling the truth, that no military weapon he knows of can harm a moving juggernaut.
the only reason they got him locked up is because he was captured while not moving.

it makes no sense to throw out a non contradicted character statement when the rules dont say to do so. the actual scenes can overrule that soldier but they never did.

[big_adventure]

so if someone says
"hey its this guy, he once ripped apart a black hole"
but in the issue we never see this, we should throw out the black hole feat?
this is nonsense.
your as strong as the story portrays you to be.

Here is how it works on Rumbles:

You get the feats you have shown on-panel. Period.

Now, if you have shown a feat for smashing a planet with your fists, and swimming through the heart of a supergiant star, and basically being as strong as required in any situation, a narrative statement like "held a black hole in his hands" might have some weight. But only because it is totally supported by everything else we've seen - and even then, don't count on it passing without argument.

If you have someone saying "he's almost totally invulnerable" but the most he's been shown to do is no-sell bullets, sorry, he's not going to no-sell Superman in a fight in a Rumble.