So, if no Hickman, what should be done with the Titans?

[Badou]

What does unique ideas have to do with anything? An idea doesn't have to be unique to work. Stranger Things, for example, has been super successful. It's great, but nothing about it is particularly original. Any idea we come up with here doesn't mean anything. It's all about how it's implemented and whether people respond to it. And you not liking other people's ideas doesn't determine whether a franchise is dead. That's silly.

What a bizarre tangent to go on. Just say you don't know what to do then. Most people here don't know what to do.

[Badou]

No one here is in a position to get them out of the rut they are in. Its not our job to create for them not can we truly sell an idea beyond a small paragraph.

The problem here is that if this is a franchise dripping with potential you'd think the ideas would be flowing to come up with some unique takes to help revive the franchise. The people in this thread probably have read more comics than the people working at DC and know more about their history, so I don't think the posters here are completely out of line to come up with something potentially good and interesting.

[Sam]

What a bizarre tangent to go on. Just say you don't know what to do then. Most people here don't know what to do.

And what would be the point of sharing an idea with you? You'd just shoot it down and call further proof the franchise is dead. None of us are in a position to make these ideas happen, so why don't you just let people have their fun sharing ideas rather than choosing to be an ass about everyone's thoughts.

[Badou]

And what would be the point of sharing an idea with you? You'd just shoot it down and call further proof the franchise is dead. None of us are in a position to make these ideas happen, so why don't you just let people have their fun sharing ideas rather than choosing to be an ass about everyone's thoughts.

I have not shot down any ideas posted in this thread. I've only given my own opinion on the franchise and how I see it as things stand right now and then have replied to people that have replied to my posts. You are the one that is replying to me and complaining and then went after me with the "why they aren't asking you to relaunch it" post instead of offering your own ideas with what should be done with the franchise, which is the purpose of this thread.

[Frontier]

Didio who was the one who set up the family “hierarchies” wasn’t he? Used to be that if you were Batfamily you didn’t necessarily have to tie into what was going on in the main Batman books. That’s not really true anymore, now all the Batfamily books have to drop what they’re doing to match up to what is happening to Batman. It’s really hard to establish another team when it’s constantly reacting to what’s going on in other books.

To be honest I think that was more true pre-Didio.

I mean, barely any Bat-Books acknowledge stuff happening in King's run unless it involves "Rick," but even then that's pretty sequestered to it's own book.

[Bruce Wayne]

We're not professional writers who have been tasked by DC with reviving the franchise though.

Yes because the professional writer are doing such a great job of reviving the Titans and making them a Top 10 book again. /s

If anything the lack of progress on this front shows neither editorial or the writers have any clue what to do with the franchise. The overall lack of A-list writers on the book really indicates they have pretty much given up.

[Godlike13]

The problem here is that if this is a franchise dripping with potential you'd think the ideas would be flowing to come up with some unique takes to help revive the franchise. The people in this thread probably have read more comics than the people working at DC and know more about their history, so I don't think the posters here are completely out of line to come up with something potentially good and interesting.

How many come up with Titans ideas threads have there been, lots. There have been plenty of ideas that have been thrown out on these boards. Dead creatively is an oxymoron. The nature of creative is to create. Which is easier said then done, but at the same time let’s not pretend DC is even trying when it comes to Titans comics or even have tried in a long time. The problem Titans have right now when it comes to the comics is the people running that division aren’t interested to actually creating with the Titans, and don’t want to really support such an effort. So we can throw out ideas till we’re blue in the face, but until that’s changes it’s moot anyway. So even if someone had a great idea, we wouldn’t know. Cause their not interested in the Titans being great or supporting such an endeavor.

[Godlike13]

Yes because the professional writer are doing such a great job of reviving the Titans and making them a Top 10 book again. /s

If anything the lack of progress on this front shows neither editorial or the writers have any clue what to do with the franchise. The overall lack of A-list writers on the book really indicates they have pretty much given up.

This tread was inspired by Hickman saying how he’d like to write the Titans franchise. The issue is DC’s comic division isn’t interested in putting A-list writers on the Titans franchise and having them revive the franchise. So of course there is a lack of progress on that front. You get what you give. This isn’t a situation where they tried and failed, they are not even trying. Not really. At least when it comes to comic books. And they have more or less told us why even.

[SiegePerilous02]

Yes because the professional writer are doing such a great job of reviving the Titans and making them a Top 10 book again. /s

If anything the lack of progress on this front shows neither editorial or the writers have any clue what to do with the franchise. The overall lack of A-list writers on the book really indicates they have pretty much given up.

In general, some of the creatives at DC are pretty lousy at their job.
Doesn't mean they will always be in charge and that A-listers won't come along later. Hickman will likely be at DC some day, if not anytime soon, and he's already expressed interest. Someone else may make it big and tackle the franchise. The future is uncertain. it was a dead franchise before NTT after all. The X-Men have been "dead" numerous times and were taken out of their ruts by Claremont, Lee, Morrison and now Hickman.

All of these go in waves. The Titans are a particularly difficult one, as these threads can attest. But then, the creatives with the talent needed to fix this are likely not going to be shooting the **** on a nerd forum, so we can't use these threads as a "it's definitely dead" gauge either.

[king81992]

It is dead creatively. I just don't see what can be done with it to cause some massive revival. So far no one here has come up with some brilliant idea other than asking DC to stop being mean to them, but it doesn't stop them from being a lesser JL team that will never have importance over the JL characters, not having a central theme, or knowing which generation to focus on. Just too many readers want different things I think from the franchise and there isn't enough story to do anything like what Hickman is doing with the X-Men. Just having them be the "cool young hero team" like you've mentioned before doesn't erase any of the massive problems that are embedded into the franchise.

Here is the issue. People want to compare the Titans to the X-Men, but it doesn't work. The X-Men are too broad and deep in their stories and characters, and even when Marvel was trying to undermine them in the comics when they didn't have their movie rights they still were able to produce good stories that had weight. There had always been one or two books that stand out. The Titans are more like the New Mutants book rather than the X-Men in total. Were biggest in the 80s, were the young next generation of heroes, but then trailed off after they grew up and kind of lost their purpose. Marvel can launch a New Mutants book and it will sell okay, but like the Titans I don't know what can be done to revitalize that title and are better off moving the characters into new teams.

I've always felt that the Titans should be the 'Avengers' of the DC universe. DC doesn't have and never had an Avengers equivalent. Sure, people compare the JL to the Avengers and vice versa but outside of 'powerful heroes coming together to take on bigger threats' the teams are fundamentally different.

Outside of Cyborg, I don't want any members of the JL showing up in any future Titans runs.

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

It is dead creatively. I just don't see what can be done with it to cause some massive revival. So far no one here has come up with some brilliant idea other than asking DC to stop being mean to them, but it doesn't stop them from being a lesser JL team that will never have importance over the JL characters, not having a central theme, or knowing which generation to focus on. Just too many readers want different things I think from the franchise and there isn't enough story to do anything like what Hickman is doing with the X-Men. Just having them be the "cool young hero team" like you've mentioned before doesn't erase any of the massive problems that are embedded into the franchise.

It's actually funny that you're comparing the Titans to the X-Men since they were actually the X-Men's biggest competition at the peak of both franchises. But, in all seriousness, the attitude that they are just "lesser JL characters" is the reason that they're in this mess in the first place. That's not a problem embedded into the franchise. That's DC's presumption about the characters becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy. And the thing is, that is not even close to being true.

The reason why Wolfman and Perez's run was so successful was that they saw these characters as more than just younger versions of their proteges. They had their own histories, their own personalities, their own way of doing things, their own villains, their own everything. It's what made them into DC's most popular team at the time. Dick wasn't just Batman lite, he was Dick Grayson, his own man with his own life. The same thing applied to Donna and Wally.

Did you know that the X-Men were also close to being canceled before Claremont and Byrne's run revitalized them? They were seen as this fringe team on the corner of the Marvel Universe that nobody cared about. Then, those two guys came along and revived them, giving them their own identity outside of just being a knock-off Fantastic Four fighting a knock-off Dr. Doom in Magneto.

The only real difference between the Titans and X-Men as franchises now is that Marvel maintained that status of the X-Men as its own independent team. DC, on the other hand, started treating the Titans as a stopgap for legacy characters before they joined the League, instead of being its own thing. That is a mistake. The Titans were at their best when they were just the team that Dick, Donna, Garth, Roy, Wally, Starfire, Cyborg, Beast Boy, and Raven were a part of and not a moniker slapped onto every club that the current Robin was heading up.

Do you have some massive revival plan in mind then? So far I'm not seeing a lot of unique ideas here.

Me saying that the only way to revive the franchise into being anything close to a pillar of DC again would be if they rebooted all the way back to Dick as Robin is probably the closest, but DC is never going to do that.

Well, I actually have some ideas. And if DC doesn't do something to revitalize the Titans, then I'll pitch the direction to DC myself if I have to.

And I'm sorry, but the idea of rebooting it to Dick being Robin again is horrendous.

[Green Goblin of Sector 2814]

How many come up with Titans ideas threads have there been, lots. There have been plenty of ideas that have been thrown out on these boards. Dead creatively is an oxymoron. The nature of creative is to create. Which is easier said then done, but at the same time let’s not pretend DC is even trying when it comes to Titans comics or even have tried in a long time. The problem Titans have right now when it comes to the comics is the people running that division aren’t interested to actually creating with the Titans, and don’t want to really support such an effort. So we can throw out ideas till we’re blue in the face, but until that’s changes it’s moot anyway. So even if someone had a great idea, we wouldn’t know. Cause their not interested in the Titans being great or supporting such an endeavor.

Oh, its not that the writers don't have ideas for the Titans. I'm sure they do. It's more so that certain people in charge of the DC Universe at the moment just don't want the Titans ever reaching their heights again because they have some sort of vendetta against these characters. So, they relegate them to being the "JL lite."

[byrd156]

The Titans issues don't come from the stories, world, or "mission" statement, they come from the behind the scenes. Their mismanagement has been going on for decades with editors not letting writers tell the story they want, constantly shifting line-ups with half assed writers thrown in, or rebooting/relaunching the team with vague history and members. The team is always used as canon fodder, I posted a list a few months back with a massive body count.

When it comes to the Titans, DC feels like they always keep them at arms length no matter what regardless of quality. When the book is good, they don't care. When the book is garbage, they don't care.

[byrd156]

How many come up with Titans ideas threads have there been, lots. There have been plenty of ideas that have been thrown out on these boards. Dead creatively is an oxymoron. The nature of creative is to create. Which is easier said then done, but at the same time let’s not pretend DC is even trying when it comes to Titans comics or even have tried in a long time. The problem Titans have right now when it comes to the comics is the people running that division aren’t interested to actually creating with the Titans, and don’t want to really support such an effort. So we can throw out ideas till we’re blue in the face, but until that’s changes it’s moot anyway. So even if someone had a great idea, we wouldn’t know. Cause their not interested in the Titans being great or supporting such an endeavor.

I've been in so many pitching threads and it's so frustrating. I feel like I throw out some decent stuff and I read a ton of great stuff that I would want to read from other posters. This ideas are pretty much just in limbo while DC does nothing with these characters but kneecap them because.... I have no idea.

[king81992]

The Titans issues don't come from the stories, world, or "mission" statement, they come from the behind the scenes. Their mismanagement has been going on for decades with editors not letting writers tell the story they want, constantly shifting line-ups with half assed writers thrown in, or rebooting/relaunching the team with vague history and members. The team is always used as canon fodder, I posted a list a few months back with a massive body count.

When it comes to the Titans, DC feels like they always keep them at arms length no matter what regardless of quality. When the book is good, they don't care. When the book is garbage, they don't care.

I don't even think that the Titans need a mission statement right now. Mission statements are good when the franchise is established and stable, but currently the Titans are neither established nor stable. The focus should be on writing stories with them functioning as characters and a team again. Doesn't matter if the stories are isolated/contradictory with whatever is going on in the mainline DC comics or if there's no grand overarching plot.