T'Challa: The Black Panther Appreciation 2021

[Dariel81]

No, it's hated because it makes absolutely zero sense. T'Challa and Eden prior to to Coates era, never worked together let alone even talked to each other. And then Coates has Eden not only on Wakanda working with him out of nowhere, but then makes eden integral to saving Wakanda and dating Shuri. And Incase you forgot Shuri did have a Existing LI.

It's a hamfisted add-on that Coates didn't bother to put in any effort into or explanation

Ok now they work together and it's no big deal.

[Micabe]

No, it's hated because it makes absolutely zero sense. T'Challa and Eden prior to to Coates era, never worked together let alone even talked to each other. And then Coates has Eden not only on Wakanda working with him out of nowhere, but then makes eden integral to saving Wakanda and dating Shuri. And Incase you forgot Shuri did have a Existing LI.

It's a hamfisted add-on that Coates didn't bother to put in any effort into or explanation

What's "LI" stand for?

And, who's the white dude suppose to be?

[Frontier]

What's LI stand for?

Love interest.

[butterflykyss]

Ok now they work together and it's no big deal.

its absolutely not a big deal. the issue was really good and it was nice seeing wakanda sending the mindless ones packing when even the shiar imperial guard could not.

[taozen]

Is it me or does Black Panther comic need a bit of a reboot or streamlining? Has there been any truly interesting stories with the character in the past few years? I say nope unless you enjoyed Coates take, which I did not. I want a writer to dive into the character of T'Challa. I want to see his early training and education. I want him to be put into difficult situations that require him make choices with dire consequences. I want a BP that shows his skills and goes beyond his kinetic energy absorbing suit. I want to see interesting characters from Wakanda that go beyond the Dora that shows us how Wakandan society operates. I thought that after the BP film, we would get more interesting stories but for me, sadly that has not been the case.

[XJlock]

And, who's the white dude suppose to be?

Michael Jackson.

[chief12d]

No, it's hated because it makes absolutely zero sense. T'Challa and Eden prior to to Coates era, never worked together let alone even talked to each other. And then Coates has Eden not only on Wakanda working with him out of nowhere, but then makes eden integral to saving Wakanda and dating Shuri. And Incase you forgot Shuri did have a Existing LI.

It's a hamfisted add-on that Coates didn't bother to put in any effort into or explanation

Coates isn't an idiot, putting Manifold with Shuri sustains his legacy on the franchise because really how many writers are gonna care enough to break them up lol. I think it'll be one of those things that gets brought up now and then but never actually developed hence why like 3 years after this relationship debuted they still haven't had an actual date. It's just more empty representation and importance.

Only massive Coates fans care about Shuri and Eden, you could've been reading the main title and never known it was a thing lol. Completely irrelevant to both characters unless Ewing has big plans for it. Which is possible but not likely, I do think he has plans for the Intergalactic Empire of Wakanda in SWORD and naturally Shuri will have a role to play but I don't think it'll be anything substantial. There's absolutely nothing stopping a writer from coming in and having Shuri date someone else, her and Manifold are barely a couple as is and will probably remain that way for the foreseeable future.

Manifold's inclusion in the franchise as a whole is just blatantly bad writing. There was never a single attempt made to explain why he was in Wakanda in the first place and he didn't have any subplot or evolution over like half a decade. His interactions with T'Challa were completely interchangeable with any redshirt and the whole romance with Shuri is underdeveloped to the point of looking stupid. Just a weird character to bring into the IP despite the possibilities.

[MindofShadow]

Eh, wasn't a BP story as expected.

Eh, evan still can't get out of his own way to tell a story because he is so obsessed with forcing in every little bit of contiuity. It worked ok in Rise because he had 6 issues to do it. It doesn't work well here becuase he has one. Just tell a story man.

THAT is why, despite liking Rise, I haven't advocated for him to get the solo job. He's still a rookie and his writing is still raw.

Ugh, that relationship still came out of freaking nowhere for me.

It is typical coates.

Just say it, give no depth, give no detail, give no story reason. Just put it on panel and hoefully someone else will flesh it out later.

See: Midnight Angels, Zenzi, nuBaku as examples.

Is it me or does Black Panther comic need a bit of a reboot or streamlining?

The problem is every freaking writer keeps doing this. THere is no consistency... someone comes in and just redoes everything with their own ideas and own characters. And they don't even give good reasons why the previous characters are gone.

So we can never get a situation where a supporting character means anything.


The franchise si screwed and done TBH. It had a chance to streamline because of the MCU and then chadwick died so now who the **** knows what they are going to do.

I'm just hoping Ridley can tell a solid 12 issue story about T'challa. My grand dreams of T'challa the A list character with a deep world are long dead. Just give me one more story about TCHALLA that doesn't suck for the love of Bast.

[MindofShadow]

Coates isn't an idiot, putting Manifold with Shuri sustains his legacy on the franchise because really how many writers are gonna care enough to break them up lol. I think it'll be one of those things that gets brought up now and then but never actually developed hence why like 3 years after this relationship debuted they still haven't had an actual date. It's just more empty representation and importance.

Only massive Coates fans care about Shuri and Eden, you could've been reading the main title and never known it was a thing lol. Completely irrelevant to both characters unless Ewing has big plans for it. Which is possible but not likely, I do think he has plans for the Intergalactic Empire of Wakanda in SWORD and naturally Shuri will have a role to play but I don't think it'll be anything substantial. There's absolutely nothing stopping a writer from coming in and having Shuri date someone else, her and Manifold are barely a couple as is and will probably remain that way for the foreseeable future.

Manifold's inclusion in the franchise as a whole is just blatantly bad writing. There was never a single attempt made to explain why he was in Wakanda in the first place and he didn't have any subplot or evolution over like half a decade. His interactions with T'Challa were completely interchangeable with any redshirt and the whole romance with Shuri is underdeveloped to the point of looking stupid. Just a weird character to bring into the IP despite the possibilities.

Coates wanted T'challa to have a "side kick"

So, he got T'challa an uber that never speaks.

Coates just can't write stories. All his characters are like this.

He only wrote 3 characters...

- Storm

- Characters who are interchangeable that do nothing

- Character who bitch at T'challa


That is it.

[BlackClaw]

So I got around to reading the issue and it’s pretty decent. It’s clear that this was written so that T’Challa won’t have to worry about the empire that much though it will still be there, which frees Ridley up to do his own thing without having to feel tied to Coates’ run. Let’s all hope he has something good in store because we need it. Lol.

[chief12d]

Eh, wasn't a BP story as expected.

Eh, evan still can't get out of his own way to tell a story because he is so obsessed with forcing in every little bit of contiuity. It worked ok in Rise because he had 6 issues to do it. It doesn't work well here becuase he has one. Just tell a story man.

THAT is why, despite liking Rise, I haven't advocated for him to get the solo job. He's still a rookie and his writing is still raw.



It is typical coates.

Just say it, give no depth, give no detail, give no story reason. Just put it on panel and hoefully someone else will flesh it out later.

See: Midnight Angels, Zenzi, nuBaku as examples.



The problem is every freaking writer keeps doing this. THere is no consistency... someone comes in and just redoes everything with their own ideas and own characters. And they don't even give good reasons why the previous characters are gone.

So we can never get a situation where a supporting character means anything.


The franchise si screwed and done TBH. It had a chance to streamline because of the MCU and then chadwick died so now who the **** knows what they are going to do.

I'm just hoping Ridley can tell a solid 12 issue story about T'challa. My grand dreams of T'challa the A list character with a deep world are long dead. Just give me one more story about TCHALLA that doesn't suck for the love of Bast.

I think part of it is the IGEW is such a new and unknown concept to most fans. The story it debuted in sold extremely poorly and I'd say most casual comic fans have a general awareness that Wakanda has a space empire now but no idea how complicated it is.

Trying to pack like 24 issues worth of worldbuilding (most of it very empty and repetitive) into a single issue was never gonna work. Especially with a lead who comes from that world because then you gotta constantly reference back to that story. I guess that was the point, to give M'Baku a spotlight that paid homage to his past but set up a new status quo. But it was so much continuity dumps and forced references the story couldn't breath, Narcisse needs to tighten that up if he's ever gonna be ready for the main book.

The time to streamline would've been 2019 up til now tbh. The comics had plenty of time to recalibrate so they had MCU influences on the supporting cast and aesthetic of the franchise while still leaving room for comic originality. And I say that as someone who doesn't need the MCU influences everywhere, but the standardization of T'Challa's supporting cast was one of the top things the books should've been trying to do and they completely failed. T'Challa was in deep space at the time and the book had no great sense of direction or relevance.

And that's not even getting into how T'Challa's stock as a solo character has fallen under Coates and most of the heavy lifting for the IP is done in team books. Is there any recovering? Without the MCU to prop up T'Challa's place in the Marvel hierarchy I kinda wanna say no but I still think we can be getting better stories than we are now. Not every BP project has to be disgusting to average.

[chief12d]

So I got around to reading the issue and it’s pretty decent. It’s clear that this was written so that T’Challa won’t have to worry about the empire that much though it will still be there, which frees Ridley up to do his own thing without having to feel tied to Coates’ run. Let’s all hope he has something good in store because we need it. Lol.

I think if the tie-in had any bearing on the upcoming relaunch Ridley would've written it himself or at least hyped up the story.

This seems like house cleaning, get rid of nu'M'Baku and the empire until Ridley decides to revisit them in the solo, assuming he does. It feels right to have Narcisse close out Coates' era and it raises my hope Ridley won't be doing too much with it outside issue #3 of his run. The story was decent for what it was so hopefully Narcisse can do some BP stuff that ties into what the relaunch is up to, I think he'd shine much better doing that.

[Vanguard]

Eh, wasn't a BP story as expected.

Eh, evan still can't get out of his own way to tell a story because he is so obsessed with forcing in every little bit of contiuity. It worked ok in Rise because he had 6 issues to do it. It doesn't work well here becuase he has one. Just tell a story man.
t.

Speaking of Rise of the Black Panther. I was reading and I missed that he can amplify his strength by at least a factor of 10X using Kimoyo. I had missed this note the first time I read it. Just wanted to throw this out there.

[MindofShadow]

Is there any recovering? Without the MCU to prop up T'Challa's place in the Marvel hierarchy I kinda wanna say no but I still think we can be getting better stories than we are now. Not every BP project has to be disgusting to average.

I don't think there is anyway to save it.

I think it would be possible with the MCU push motivating marvel to "find a way" but without that, Coates botched 5 years worth a world building and it seems like everything is in no mans land. We have a space empire because... reasons? The second most popular character (shuri) has no concrete "thing." Okoye is the leader ofhte doras and T'chalals sidekick but is the dora order the same? Who knows... it was destoryed and showed back up at the last second?

What is even going on in the jabari lands anyway?

5 years under as single writer should mean the status quo is well established and yet everything is up in the air.

I think there is still chances at quality stories (Come on ridley) but I think It has to be now. If Ridley botches it and sales tank, what motivation does Marvel have to push T'challa really? They will pivot and see what they can do with the new "movie" cast.

[Vanguard]

I don't think there is anyway to save it.

I think it would be possible with the MCU push motivating marvel to "find a way" but without that, Coates botched 5 years worth a world building and it seems like everything is in no mans land. We have a space empire because... reasons? The second most popular character (shuri) has no concrete "thing." Okoye is the leader ofhte doras and T'chalals sidekick but is the dora order the same? Who knows... it was destoryed and showed back up at the last second?

What is even going on in the jabari lands anyway?

5 years under as single writer should mean the status quo is well established and yet everything is up in the air.

I think there is still chances at quality stories (Come on ridley) but I think It has to be now. If Ridley botches it and sales tank, what motivation does Marvel have to push T'challa really? They will pivot and see what they can do with the new "movie" cast.

I think TChalla has too rich of a pedigree to just disappear. I have faith that he’ll always be relevant in some way. He is a Jack Kirby Stan Lee creation. Characters like that don’t go away.