[Spoilers] Batman issue #76

[Korath]

It is kind of hilarious that Bane's entire way of holding control revolves around keeping Alfred under the threat of death. Superman could take whoever is holding the trigger, save Alfred, punch Bane out, drink a cup of coffee, poop on Psycho Pirate's mask, kiss Lois Lane and clean up every piece of trash villain in the entire city and put them all safely back in Arkham before Dick could finish the sentence "how about if we call Superman?"

But nope. Instead the ultra-mastermind plan of Bane that he has been apparently working on for years is the oldest, stupidest villain trick in the book.

"I'll kidnap Alfred, haha, he'll never be able to overcome that!"

To be honest, it's actually an element that King had in mind for a long time : Gotham-Girl can trounce Superman and the whole League, if need be, as demonstrated in issue 5 of this run by her brother. And I doubt she would just incapacitate them if they tried to rescue Alfred or interfere in any way, shape or form.

[dietrich]

Selina can't contact the rest of the batfamily, what if they end up doing something useful? Only Selina is allowed to help Bruce!

I think I already talked about this in another threat, but King pushing this "Only Selina" thing isn't doing this ship any favours in my opinion. Pushing other characters down to prop up another one tends to sour people on the character you are trying to promote.

King already set up that the family didn't have as much faith in him. The last time they turned up it was to judge him and look at him like he was crazy. They didn't believe him and they can't take GG so Selina is the only one that can be trusted to believe, understand and help without judging. Plus she's better at nursing and is the one thing that can make him feel not sad. He has been missing her so at the very least she'll bring a smile to his face when he wakes up

Although not sure Selina is aware of the incident that happened when he asked for their help and they thought him crazy

[Ansa]

King already set up that the family didn't have as much faith in him. The last time they turned up it was to judge him and look at him like he was crazy. They didn't believe him and they can't take GG so Selina is the only one that can be trusted to believe, understand and help without judging. Plus she's better at nursing and is the one thing that can make him feel not sad. He has been missing her so at the very least she'll bring a smile to his face when he wakes up

Although not sure Selina is aware of the incident that happened when he asked for their help and they thought him crazy

They didn't come to judge him. They came, despite Bruce acting out lately (Brutally beating Jason, allowing Dick to run around as Ric without helping him, torturing criminals for information on Bane, destroying their cooperation with the GCPD) to help him save Gotham. He send a signal and they came. They followed him to Arkham only to see that what he told them would be there wasn't.

Barbara explains to him that she couldn't find any evidence for his claims about Bane and that she talked with Alfred, who also didn't know what Bruce was rambling on about. They have reasons to question Bruce and Tim is actually still pretty nice to him despite everything. He gets sucker punched for it.

That's what I'm talking about when I'm calling him an incompetent leader. Yeah, he is right about Bane, but because of his actions he lacks the ability to convince his family members that he's right. He has no evidence for them and he lost his authority over them a while a go without doing anything to stop it. He just expects them to believe and follow him because he's Batman. If he was competent in this run, that could have been enough. But he's not. I can't blame them for not following Bruce.

[Restingvoice]

Wait. Why am I suddenly the thread starter

[Korath]

I guess my post was deleted ? The title was also changed but I didn't have a notification yet, I guess it'll come up soon ?

[Zaresh]

Wait. Why am I suddenly the thread starter

You won the annual forum lottery .

[Scott Taylor]

To be honest, it's actually an element that King had in mind for a long time : Gotham-Girl can trounce Superman and the whole League, if need be, as demonstrated in issue 5 of this run by her brother. And I doubt she would just incapacitate them if they tried to rescue Alfred or interfere in any way, shape or form.

In my own head canon, the only way that works is if the league assumes she is being mind-controlled and are staying away because they don't want her to die. Not because of Alfred.

[Celgress]

It is kind of hilarious that Bane's entire way of holding control revolves around keeping Alfred under the threat of death. Superman could take whoever is holding the trigger, save Alfred, punch Bane out, drink a cup of coffee, poop on Psycho Pirate's mask, kiss Lois Lane and clean up every piece of trash villain in the entire city and put them all safely back in Arkham before Dick could finish the sentence "how about if we call Superman?"

But nope. Instead the ultra-mastermind plan of Bane that he has been apparently working on for years is the oldest, stupidest villain trick in the book.

"I'll kidnap Alfred, haha, he'll never be able to overcome that!"

Yup, Bane is a top-level (or should that be bottom level?) moron in this book but then again so is everyone else including Batman.

[Arctic Cyclist]

Just let the old man die. Dude sent kids to thier death, he made Damian basically live on the street because his father couldn’t remember him, it’s time Alfred takes a break.

Yeah, Alfred has crossed over into villain territory hasn't he? And let's not forget that right now TT and Tec has established that Damian at the ripe old age of 13 has completely moved out of the manor due to understanding that there's no place for him there.

Really if you start breaking down how Alfred has been treating Damian in universe since his return from the dead compared to everyone else including Selina, it makes sense that Damian doesn't care if Alfred lives or dies. The kid's smart enough to realize if the situation is abusive, more importantly, he can recognize emotional abuse which most people can't. Given that Ra's has continued in his own special effed up way to be more attentive and affectionate than Alfred throughout Rebirth, it's almost in character for Damian to just say screw it, let Alfred die.

Damian's spiraling down the deep end makes sense if you consider how emotionally abusive and neglectful Alfred and Bruce have been, especially since Selina entered the picture. At no point have either of them, or Selina, ever considered that a 13 year old child is being discarded over the course of this story. Although that ties back into the murder of the horse, another innocent destroyed by this ship...and all the kids in the orphanage murdered in order to incite Bruce's belief in Selina as a good and noble person again.

[Celgress]

Yeah, Alfred has crossed over into villain territory hasn't he? And let's not forget that right now TT and Tec has established that Damian at the ripe old age of 13 has completely moved out of the manor due to understanding that there's no place for him there.

Really if you start breaking down how Alfred has been treating Damian in universe since his return from the dead compared to everyone else including Selina, it makes sense that Damian doesn't care if Alfred lives or dies. The kid's smart enough to realize if the situation is abusive, more importantly, he can recognize emotional abuse which most people can't. Given that Ra's has continued in his own special effed up way to be more attentive and affectionate than Alfred throughout Rebirth, it's almost in character for Damian to just say screw it, let Alfred die.

Damian's spiraling down the deep end makes sense if you consider how emotionally abusive and neglectful Alfred and Bruce have been, especially since Selina entered the picture. At no point have either of them, or Selina, ever considered that a 13 year old child is being discarded over the course of this story. Although that ties back into the murder of the horse, another innocent destroyed by this ship...and all the kids in the orphanage murdered in order to incite Bruce's belief in Selina as a good and noble person again.

I'm not a Damian fan yet even I agree 100% with your assessment. I sometimes suspect that King doesn't want to write about Damian because he sees the character as an obstacle to his perfect BatCat-Family: Bruce & Selina as the loving couple with Alfred as the beloved supportive father figure. Damian the son of Bruce and the (possible) stepson of Selina is a part which does not fit into the picture of domestic tranquility King is trying to craft. Damian needs to be pushed aside so King's grand vision can become reality

[phonogram12]

It is kind of hilarious that Bane's entire way of holding control revolves around keeping Alfred under the threat of death. Superman could take whoever is holding the trigger, save Alfred, punch Bane out, drink a cup of coffee, poop on Psycho Pirate's mask, kiss Lois Lane and clean up every piece of trash villain in the entire city and put them all safely back in Arkham before Dick could finish the sentence "how about if we call Superman?"

But nope. Instead the ultra-mastermind plan of Bane that he has been apparently working on for years is the oldest, stupidest villain trick in the book.

"I'll kidnap Alfred, haha, he'll never be able to overcome that!"

TBF, Supes could pretty much solve most of the problems of other heroes have in the DCU. They don't do that, though, because then there would be no DCU - just Superman U.

[BatmanJones]

I'm not a Damian fan yet even I agree 100% with your assessment. I sometimes suspect that King doesn't want to write about Damian because he sees the character as an obstacle to his perfect BatCat-Family: Bruce & Selina as the loving couple with Alfred as the beloved supportive father figure. Damian the son of Bruce and the (possible) stepson of Selina is a part which does not fit into the picture of domestic tranquility King is trying to craft. Damian needs to be pushed aside so King's grand vision can become reality

I thought King wrote beautifully about Selina and Damian in the lead-up to #50.

[Restingvoice]

I thought King wrote beautifully about Selina and Damian in the lead-up to #50.

That's Seeley. He always does a good Damian Wayne.

[Pohzee]

That's Seeley. He always does a good Damian Wayne.

King wrote Damian in Rules of Engagement.

And I am not always a huge fan of how Seeley writes Damian.

[TravelerInTheDark]

I thought King wrote beautifully about Selina and Damian in the lead-up to #50.

I'm pretty sure King has only written them exchanging a single line off-handedly, but hey if that's what you consider to be beautiful, then to each their own.