DC Cuts Ties with Diamond

[Comic-Reader Lad]

The retailers still have to pay for the books (25c i think?) and the expense of hosting the day (artists in store, gaming events, writers, decorating the store and advertising the event etc)

I cant see many people going to be keen to take up dcs offer especially when most of their dc customers will have been in on the tuesday while everyone else comes in on Wednesday

Well, for Free Comic Book Day, Midtown and DCBS and distribute DC's free comic with the rest of that week's DC's, but simply tell the retailers to wait until Free Comic Book Day to display them.

Remember, Free Comic Book Day is NOT on a Wednesday anyway. It's on the first SATURDAY in May, so ALL FCBD stuff is in the retailers back room before it gets displayed.

DC is leaving Diamond, but it's not leaving the comics industry or the direct sales channel. I am sure DC will continue to participate in FCBD. I also suspect that DC will continue to organize bookstore related events (like their previous Batman Day or Wonder Woman Day) and maybe distribute free stuff there as well.

Anyway, I agree that perhaps DC could have implemented this in a way that wasn't so shocking for retailers, but remember, DC and Marvel may be owned by multi billion dollar companies, but the publishing is NOT a billion dollar business for either DC or Marvel. As I posted above, DC's Gross Revenue for 2019's comics and GNs was about $60 million. That's gross revenue, not profit.

Diamond's announcement that they would be stopping payments to the publishers was likely just as shocking and unexpected as DC's recent announcement to Diamond was. Could DC have held out even if their profit were "only," say, $10 million? Sure, but I can see it being a real wake up call to DC that they can't continue to put all their eggs in that one Diamond basket. It's just not good business.

Now, why did they drop Diamond altogether instead of using Diamond as a third distribution company? That would seem to indicate that the relationship between DC and Diamond soured irrevocably as far as DC was concerned -- or maybe Diamond was trying to put pressure on DC to play ball and go back to being a Diamond exclusive. That's what I would want Rich Johnston to find out. There's lots more juicy stuff going on here than we know about right now.

[Digifiend]

FCBD is organised by Diamond itself though. So yeah, they'll be out. You're right though that it doesn't stop them doing their own giveaways, even on the same date.

The retailers still have to pay for the books (25c i think?) and the expense of hosting the day (artists in store, gaming events, writers, decorating the store and advertising the event etc)

I cant see many people going to be keen to take up dcs offer especially when most of their dc customers will have been in on the tuesday while everyone else comes in on Wednesday

Do your research, dude. FCBD is always a Saturday, so the Tues/Wed split is irrelevant.

[Lonewolf36]

While i am 100 percent for DC's break from Diamond i am not for DC using a Diamond Event to promote their books. Make it a different day and call it something else and i'm behind it.

[superduperman]

Setting up alternative distribution channel that is going to distribute your monthly comics doesn't sound like something you'd do if you wanted to get out of monthly comics. So I don't get where people saying that DC doesn't care about monthlies are coming from.

If they wanted to move out of monthly comics they could have just done that. And its not like they did this because they needed money, while Diamond was offline. This is an investment, they'll likely get back what they lost/invested only months (if not years) later even if it ends up working out.

They can't just say "OK, we're pulling all our monthly books." They have back orders to fulfill. The smart thing to do is slowly ease into it by pulling low selling books and severely reducing their inventory. But the infrastructure they are setting up suggests they are looking to be less monthly book centric.

[iron chimp]

FCBD is organised by Diamond itself though. So yeah, they'll be out. You're right though that it doesn't stop them doing their own giveaways, even on the same date.

Do your research, dude. FCBD is always a Saturday, so the Tues/Wed split is irrelevant.

Yes I didn't explain myself well. Youve created two separate streams of customers - the hardcore dc only tuesday customer and the everyone else wednesday customer. Good for shops in a way as it keeps the traffic flowing on what would be otherwiseva quiet day but youve also taken a jump on everyone else so that you dominate the news a day early and get maximum publicity.

i cant see why the shops and diamond and everyone else should pay to reintergrate dc for one day. Everyone else is a united front, yr an entirely separate entity now. Different day, different account.

Extra man hours to administer dcs account, more expensive to stock, worse payment terms (according to brian hibbs), rumours you are going to move to trades (which shops struggle to compete against Amazon and instocktrades which is your own distributor) and thinking shops are going to say oh yeah we will hype your books on our dime for fcbd. I cant see that being attractive

[Ascended]

Setting up alternative distribution channel that is going to distribute your monthly comics doesn't sound like something you'd do if you wanted to get out of monthly comics. So I don't get where people saying that DC doesn't care about monthlies are coming from.

If they wanted to move out of monthly comics they could have just done that. And its not like they did this because they needed money, while Diamond was offline. This is an investment, they'll likely get back what they lost/invested only months (if not years) later even if it ends up working out.

If DC planned on maintaining their regular production, they wouldn't have bothered leaving Diamond in the first place. If "business as usual" was the post-covid19 goal, there's no point in setting up with new distributors and upsetting the status quo. As we've seen with this thread, there's a lot of potential fallout from this; shops not being able to afford DC's orders and losing money from Diamond discounts, boycotting DC, extra work put on the retailers, etc etc. This isn't what you do if you plan on staying in the same market, doing the same things you've done in the past. Or at least that's the conventional business wisdom I'm seeing, but I don't work in print or for DC.

They can't just say "OK, we're pulling all our monthly books." They have back orders to fulfill. The smart thing to do is slowly ease into it by pulling low selling books and severely reducing their inventory. But the infrastructure they are setting up suggests they are looking to be less monthly book centric.

This.

DC can't just drop their floppy model all at once, out of the blue. That's still the largest chunk of their print revenue and where most of their consumers are.

What DC can do is slowly shift their focus. Meet their current obligations and keep churning out floppies while building up a sizable selection of alternative products for alternative market release. That keeps money coming in while they prepare for whatever market/formats they're looking to get into. And getting out of the Diamond deal means Diamond can no longer pressure them and force them to stay in the direct market.

We've got a quote a page or two back, from I think someone at AT&T (?) talking about the growth of trades and OGN's. I'd be surprised right now if DC didn't intend on putting the majority of their focus outside the direct market, and offered a smaller selection of floppies through their new distributors just to ride the direct market into the ground and get those last few pennies. But it's DC, and AT&T aren't in print publishing, so maybe it really is nothing more than DC throwing a fit over Diamond not paying their bill. But I wouldn't bet on it. I think this is a shift away from the direct market with an eye towards formats that are selling better and growing more, and I think it's been in the works since AT&T took over.

[iron chimp]

This.

DC can't just drop their floppy model all at once, out of the blue. That's still the largest chunk of their print revenue and where most of their consumers are.

What DC can do is slowly shift their focus. Meet their current obligations and keep churning out floppies while building up a sizable selection of alternative products for alternative market release. That keeps money coming in while they prepare for whatever market/formats they're looking to get into. And getting out of the Diamond deal means Diamond can no longer pressure them and force them to stay in the direct market.

We've got a quote a page or two back, from I think someone at AT&T (?) talking about the growth of trades and OGN's. I'd be surprised right now if DC didn't intend on putting the majority of their focus outside the direct market, and offered a smaller selection of floppies through their new distributors just to ride the direct market into the ground and get those last few pennies. But it's DC, and AT&T aren't in print publishing, so maybe it really is nothing more than DC throwing a fit over Diamond not paying their bill. But I wouldn't bet on it. I think this is a shift away from the direct market with an eye towards formats that are selling better and growing more, and I think it's been in the works since AT&T took over.

That idea is theoretically a good one. I still think you need continuous floppies to develop and evolve the environment for your characters to live in for your ogns. But... wheres the product to back it up. If this was any coherent plan theyd have a load of new material lined up to get retailers enthused.. ok its a hassle but this looks cool.

Theyve brought absolutely zero to the party apart from rumours about their big relaunch being shelved (5g if that was ever a thing) and rumours that they want to get out of the shops. Again that might all be rubbish but nature loves a vacuum and if youve got nothing new to show it just looks like another half arsed bodge job with zero reason to invest in some nebulous vision.

If they'd been organised they would have had product line ready and turned it into a big deal. Instead it just looks an ad hoc decision and a kick in the nuts to some retailers in usa and all readers outside usa.

[Comic-Reader Lad]

This coming week is gonna be interesting.

Now that we and the retailers have spent all weekend stewing over this and picking it apart with everyone on pins and needles, DC will start releasing new announcements (hopefully) this week that will lower the collective stress level in the industry (hopefully).

I think this is just a canny move on DC's part to get everyone focused on them and wait with baited breath for any future communication from them.

They are dominating the news cycle right now, and that's probably how they like it. Anything that Marvel announces right now -- "Look! A new Wolverine comic!!!" -- is gonna get drowned out until DC clears the air, and I'm sure they'll do it in pieces to keep all eyes focused on them for as long as possible.

[Kevin Street]

I'm starting to understand the Joker's point of view.

THR: DC Cuts Ties with Diamond Comic Distributors

We recognize that, to many of you, this may seem like a momentous decision. However, we can assure you that this change in DC's distribution plans has not been made lightly and follows a long period of thought and consideration. The change of direction is in line with DC's overall strategic vision intended to improve the health of, and strengthen, the Direct Market as well as grow the number of fans who read comics worldwide.

Pardon me, anonymous email writer (who's definitely not Jim Lee), but I don't believe you. Maybe you've been thinking about this for a while, but I think you've reached the wrong conclusions. It's impossible to see how Lunar and UCS can stay in business with just one publisher, and for that matter it's not even clear that they can distribute DC comics to places like Canada and England. This is bad news for DC comics.

And it's not great for the Direct Market either. Can Diamond survive this on top of the Virus? I really, really hope so, because if Diamond goes down the direct market will go down with it. And if the direct market goes down, the comics industry will go down. Comixology is fine and all, but those lost sales from the Direct Market won't shift to digital, they'll just go away. And suddenly it won't be profitable for companies to pay anyone a living wage to make comics. DC and Marvel and most of the other companies will go away, and all that will be left will be a hundred or so writers and artists using Patreon or whatever to make digital comics.

I hope you realize this current plan is a mistake, and reverse course before Lunar and UCS go broke and take you with them.

Edited to add: You know what? I hope I'm wrong. Maybe you know things about The Industry and the long term health of Diamond that ordinary fans like me don't know, and maybe you've got some kind of plan to help Lunar and UCS stay afloat until other publishers join you. I don't want anything to happen to Diamond, but maybe you know things we don't know. I'll acknowledge right now that maybe you're right. But from the outside, to someone with no extra knowledge, this looks like a terrible mistake.

[Ascended]

That idea is theoretically a good one. I still think you need continuous floppies to develop and evolve the environment for your characters to live in for your ogns.

Not necessarily. Assuming anything like what we're talking about happens, the first volume of the new, floppy-less OGN structure could just pick up where the comics leave off.

If it were me, I'd consider doing a bunch of stand-alone books like that Raven OGN or the "teen Bruce Wayne builds the car" book, and then have books that continue the main continuity. Doing just OGN's would change the structure and the shared universe and continuity wouldn't be handled or built like we're used to, but I don't think there's any reason it would have to die off, either. Change is the name of the game, not extinction.

But... wheres the product to back it up. If this was any coherent plan they'd have a load of new material lined up to get retailers enthused.. ok its a hassle but this looks cool.

Well I don't think they're really worried about keeping retailers happy. Most shops won't be able to survive without DC on the shelf, and if DC is working its way out of the direct market then they won't care if they put someone over a barrel.

As for where the product announcements are? I don't know. Maybe they don't actually have anything ready to reveal yet, or maybe they're waiting and doing a staggered marketing strategy (it's what I'd do). Maybe some factor or another caused by the pandemic has made them show their hand early. Maybe they're just really bad at marketing. If this were just DC then I'd assume they're just bad at their jobs, but I don't know enough about AT&T to be able to guess whether this is just the first step in a legit plan or just more of DC running around and making it up as they go.

Theyve brought absolutely zero to the party apart from rumours about their big relaunch being shelved (5g if that was ever a thing) and rumours that they want to get out of the shops. Again that might all be rubbish but nature loves a vacuum and if youve got nothing new to show it just looks like another half arsed bodge job with zero reason to invest in some nebulous vision.

Abhors. Nature *abhors* a vacuum. But yeah, right now it's not great optics. And maybe all this is a pile of unplanned chaos. It's DC so it wouldn't surprise me. Or maybe DC has a legit plan (anything's possible!) and no longer cares about pissing off the direct market. We won't know until we know.

[skyvolt2000]

it won't be profitable for companies to pay anyone a living wage to make comics.

Most folks have other jobs besides comics.

Alex Simmons and Sanford Greene work for colleges as does Khary Randolph.

Noelle Stevenson might be known to comic book fans for Lumberjanes but the rest of the world knows her for Netflix's She Ra.

Dwayne McDuffie-Ben 10, Static Shock and many other cartoons come up before folks realize he started in comics.

Bryan Hill left Marvel because he has to work on Titans tv show.

Shuri's writer left because she had a tv show to work on.

There is a reason so many are running to do creator own work. They want to sell their ideas and get tv shows or movies.

David Walker has a college class to teach, a Bitter Root movie deal and other non DC books to do.

The retailers still have to pay for the books (25c i think?) and the expense of hosting the day (artists in store, gaming events, writers, decorating the store and advertising the event etc)

It's 25 cents.

Most stores just have those books for anyone.

One I go to FINALLY decided to have a sale that day buy 2 get 1 free of any combination of stuff. The owner was against it until it became very profitable for him. Stuff he couldn't sell finally got sold.

Another one does an event. Because most of the folks they get are from the area. Last one they had-Tee Franklin, the guys behind Image's Lark & IDW's TMNT and one of WW's artists (she did the covers in the early Rebirth run. I want to say she did Wonder Woman 16 cover).

And he did 25 cent books (to the tune of 50 long boxes). No it was not packed with Ms Marvel and the books hated by gators (the few copies there did not last long). It was Batman, Doomsday Clock, Superman (WAY TOO MUCH and no it was Bendis's run), Flash, Hal Jordan and some others. Lets just say there was enough to where it saw some books get on pull lists to get the remaining issues of an arc. Except Shazam-those delays did not help it.

[captchuck]

I've been reading DC Comics since the 1960's. I buy issues every week from the same comics shop. I don't care that much about who distributes them. I'll continue buying my favorite characters until they stop printing DC Comics. (The same for Marvel) None of us has any control over these million dollar deals, but I hope the comics continue being printed. When that stops, I'll stop. I won't switch to digital.

[Kevin Street]

There is a reason so many are running to do creator own work. They want to sell their ideas and get tv shows or movies.

That's like winning the lottery, though. Very few comic book creators get their ideas turned into TV shows and movies. It's just not a viable reason to pour your heart and soul and limited time into a creative work.

And as for other ideas I've seen in this thread and elsewhere, OGNs wouldn't save the comics industry. They're a different form of publishing that mostly appeals to a different group of fans. But the good news is that OGNs aren't a threat to the industry, either. Both can make a profit without cannibalizing the other.

And digital only... I've already said what I think about that. It would only support a small group of hobbyists, with a much smaller group within that group earning enough to do it full time.

The thing that monthly comics have that no other publishing system has is a built-in market. These days there's so many different ways to spend one's time, it makes it nearly impossible to rise above the sea of entertainment options and find a fanbase. If someone's only buying one or two books or games each month there's almost no chance to catch their attention. Theatrical movies have to do it by spending billions of dollars on publicity. But direct market comic fans have been conditioned to look for new comic books every week. That means you have 52 chances every year to catch their attention, and they want to keep buying from you because their appetite for new stories is voracious. The monthly pace trains consumers to build a loyalty to their favorite characters or creators or companies in a way that non-serialized formats never could. It isn't like an OGN that comes and goes and is quickly forgotten.

It's a little like the difference between streaming movies and TV shows. On streaming new movies come out, are quickly forgotten and fade away. TV shows do better because they have more episodes and feel like more of an investment for the viewer. When the viewer has to watch at least ten episodes of a show there's a greater chance they'll become a fan and want to watch the next season. Monthly comics are like that, but the potential investment is even greater, because the number of "episodes" (issues) is unlimited.

[superduperman]

I'm gonna throw a not so controversial idea out there. People don't need comic books to get their super-hero fix anymore. Want Marvel characters? You've got the MCU. Want Superman? He's getting his own show next year. Want Batman? He's got a new movie coming out along with god knows how many cartoons. Wonder Woman? Most popular movie hero right now. Spiderman? Ditto. None of which requires knowing decades of backstories. Flash? His own show. Green Lantern? Getting one. Stargirl is a huge hit and she's not even that well known. We're in an era where if you like a character, odds are you can find some kind of other media that has them.

DC sees this. They know that the world doesn't need them. They may have fallen into accepting their role as a supplement to other media. Disney may see Marvel as just an IP farmhouse and with over 75% of the marketshare they don't need to worry about losing money right now. Down the road? Who knows. DC may be looking into the future and realize that, with a much smaller market share than Marvel, they don't really have a future in it and have decided to gamble on something else.

[Vampire Savior]

That's like winning the lottery, though. Very few comic book creators get their ideas turned into TV shows and movies. It's just not a viable reason to pour your heart and soul and limited time into a creative work.

Somewhat true...but not quite as true as you may think. See, the way it works is like this...

Companies are hungry for specifically comic content now more than ever. However, WB and Disney have locked up all of Marvel and DC. So, for...I don't know, I'm going to pull a studio out of a hat...Lionsgate, they cannot touch any of those properties. They are completely off the table for Lionsgate, but I'm sure Lionsgate would love some comic stuff to adapt, because that's really hot right now, and has been for decades. That's how Bloodshot wound up getting a movie, and Locke and Key a show. You don't have to have a comic selling on the level of Batman (or any DC comic, for that matter) to get someone's attention, because they cannot adapt Batman.

So, it's always going to be a crap shoot. There are always very many factors a writer can't control, but if someone wants to get big in this field, there has never been a better time than now to attempt it.

But hey, don't listen to me. Don't ever try this, and stay out of this field, because there is absolutely no hope for any of you in it. That's just less competition.