Zack Snyder's JUSTICE LEAGUE on HBOmax in 2021!

[Nate Grey]

When you realise the very foundation of the criticism against Snyder was he did not make a marvel kind of movie. we have to keep explaining to MCU fans why he does not need to.

But I responded to you DIRECTLY about something involving the upcoming Snyder cut and you still said f that need to keep arguing.

[Castle]

But I responded to you DIRECTLY about something involving the upcoming Snyder cut and you still said f that need to keep arguing.

I missed your response, please ask away again.

[Nate Grey]

I missed your response, please ask away again.

Not sure if I can/should copy and post it so I'll just link the original post #.

[ComicJunkie21]

When you realise the very foundation of the criticism against Snyder was he did not make a marvel kind of movie. we have to keep explaining to MCU fans why he does not need to.

I think that is the main criticism of all dc films since the MCU became established. Imo the main criticism of Snyder should be his screenplays, they don't flow very well not for the lack of comedic one liners. Unfortunately for dc films as a whole they are stuck between being compared to the MCU and being compared to their own past successes. We've seen that if a dc film is made and its not the biggest box office hit of the year and up for 10 academy awards its considered to be mediocre or be considered an underperformer. Another issue that goes against dc is how popular they have been in the comics. Even though Marvel characters are popular now, the majority of people still know more dc characters inside and out in comparison which plays a major part in expectations and reviews when these characters are portrayed. People internally don't want to see dc characters drift too far from their comic counterparts and instead people look more at the story and acting aspects to judge dc films.

[Castle]

Not sure if I can/should copy and post it so I'll just link the original post #.

There was news this week from Snyder himself that he is finishing up on the CGI and VFX. I don't think that awful picture of SW is going to be just that in the film, ITS BAD.

I see HBO giving SW a more Nightking VFX/CGI from Game of thrones budget

You raised an interesting theory about PA Kent but if it is Clark's subconsciousness then it is also PA Kent. PA Kent raised Clark, any ideals, Clark has comes from him. Clark's own subconsciousness will always be influenced by PA Kent. So it is both.

I don't care about green lantern. HBO is making a tv series about the character or characters. Snyder will end up with a small cameo of GL.

[SiegePerilous02]

When you realise the very foundation of the criticism against Snyder was he did not make a marvel kind of movie. we have to keep explaining to MCU fans why he does not need to.

You bring up the MCU movies more than any of the people criticizing Snyder's films, who find things within the films themselves to criticize without bringing in unrelated projects.

[Nate Grey]

There was news this week from Snyder himself that he is finishing up on the CGI and VFX. I don't think that awful picture of SW is going to be just that in the film, ITS BAD.

It looked like a humanoid armadillo with horns.

I see HBO giving SW a more Nightking VFX/CGI from Game of thrones budget

I can see that. But I also wonder what's wrong with his Super Powers look?



Humanoid...with an axe attached to a backpack! Like he was going to school but decided to play hookie and get some mother boxes instead.

You raised an interesting theory about PA Kent but if it is Clark's subconsciousness then it is also PA Kent. PA Kent raised Clark, any ideals, Clark has comes from him. Clark's own subconsciousness will always be influenced by PA Kent. So it is both.

Well Costner is filming more scenes so I'm wondering if it'll be some sort of, de facto..."thumbs up" to Clark being Superman. I'm guessing the cameo is post resurrection. Heck might be during...

I don't care about green lantern. HBO is making a tv series about the character or characters. Snyder will end up with a small cameo of GL.

But if everything is back in, so if Sam Benjamin's "15-20 minute military subplot". I really feel like the GL cameo is actually Abin Sur, and that we won't see Hal GL'd up but he might get the ring at the end of this suplot.

[WebLurker]

When you realise the very foundation of the criticism against Snyder was he did not make a marvel kind of movie. we have to keep explaining to MCU fans why he does not need to.

I think Synder's "failure" was in the execution of the kind of movie he wanted to make, not that it was that kind of movie in the first place. Surely we can debate the merits (or lack thereof, as the case may be) without invoking other movies. I mean, very little of Logan's praise came from it being or not being like other superhero movies.

[Castle]

I think Synder's "failure" was in the execution of the kind of movie he wanted to make, not that it was that kind of movie in the first place. Surely we can debate the merits (or lack thereof, as the case may be) without invoking other movies.

We have debated the merits.

The problem with Snyder's ''failure'' is that it is too based with what a competitor did a year before. 98% of Snyder's criticism was the movie was too dark, moody and broody. Those were the main criticisms. A moody angst superman. Snyder made a movie some may not have liked because it did not remind them of another movie. These are not failures.

I mean, very little of Logan's praise came from it being or not being like other superhero movies.

I think Logan was lucky. There had been other X-Men films similar to Logan so its not like Logan created what it did first. If you had seen Days of Future Past, logan should not come as a shock to you. Snyder was a DCEU first timer trying to establish what he wanted with Superman. Man of steel came as a shock to some because they are still to wrapped out with Reeves Superman or the Avengers 2012.

Sndyer says it here that man of steel was meant to be like nothing we have ever seen with Superman before. he also spoke about how the tone was meant to different from avengers in other interviews.

[WebLurker]

We have debated the merits.

The problem with Snyder's ''failure'' is that it is too based with what a competitor did a year before. 98% of Snyder's criticism was the movie was too dark, moody and broody. Those were the main criticisms. A moody angst superman. Snyder made a movie some may not have liked because it did not remind them of another movie. These are not failures.

As I recall, the point was that there was dissonance between the character and the themes (remember everyone coming out of the woodwork to point out that Superman doesn't kill and is a symbol of hope and all that jazz?). I mean, no one was arguing that Birds of Prey should've been a deadly serious drama instead of having a laugh a minute (to the point that the villain's defeat is a joke in and of itself).

I think Logan was lucky. There had been other X-Men films similar to Logan so its not like Logan created what it did first. If you had seen Days of Future Past, logan should not come as a shock to you.

As I recall, Days of Future Past had a lot more in common with Marvel Studios' work then not. (Once again, remember matching theme to character.)

Snyder was a DCEU first timer trying to establish what he wanted with Superman. Man of steel came as a shock to some because they are still to wrapped out with Reeves Superman or the Avengers 2012.

To be fair, everyone is compared to Reeves. He is to Superman what the '80s cartoon is to TMNT.

Sndyer says it here that man of steel was meant to be like nothing we have ever seen with Superman before. he also spoke about how the tone was meant to different from avengers in other interviews.

Well, good for him, but that still doesn't address the actual problems in the writing and pacing, the very ones that all evidence about his JL cut show that he's doubling down on rather then learning from.

[Midvillian1322]

I dont know why people cling on to conspiracy. Its really simple if you make a movie with the Tone of MoS or BvS you better make something great story wise. If you make something that's fun to watch for people, it's gonna get away with more. Snyder wasn't interested in fun but also doesnt have the chops to making something like Logan. Iono if its intentional but 300 is fun. Nobody's praising that movies drama outside of Butlers acting maybe. His DCEU movies wanna tell something more self serious, that would be great if he could pull it off. But his movies are way too easy to pick apart. Especially his mishandling of themes.

[WebLurker]

I dont know why people cling on to conspiracy.

Maybe it's easier to believe that Snyder's "vision" for the DCEU was denied its chance by people who couldn't understand his greatness and/or only wanted the brain candy of the MCU then accept that he wasn't suited for this job and made a couple of bad movies as a result.

All that said, I'm not sure what the angst is at this point, either. I mean, the Snyder Cut people are getting what they wanted. For better or worse, his "vision" is getting realized in some form.

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

Okay so back to the “Joss Whedon doesn’t have a history of being problematic on set”

https://metro.co.uk/2020/07/12/egoma...uble-12942160/

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

I dont know why people cling on to conspiracy. Its really simple if you make a movie with the Tone of MoS or BvS you better make something great story wise. If you make something that's fun to watch for people, it's gonna get away with more. Snyder wasn't interested in fun but also doesnt have the chops to making something like Logan. Iono if its intentional but 300 is fun. Nobody's praising that movies drama outside of Butlers acting maybe. His DCEU movies wanna tell something more self serious, that would be great if he could pull it off. But his movies are way too easy to pick apart. Especially his mishandling of themes.

Pretty much this. I’ve always described it as DC films aimed to be more serious so they had less leeway to screw up. Marvel films pepper themselves with jokes every 3 seconds so you know not to take it too seriously so you give it more leeway.

[Steel Inquisitor]

Okay so back to the “Joss Whedon doesn’t have a history of being problematic on set”

https://metro.co.uk/2020/07/12/egoma...uble-12942160/

That's not the issue, clearly he does - the question is was he abusing his power on the Justice League set? The allegations that we do know is about him being unprofessional dismissing Snyder's films, if this is what Fisher is complaining about it's not in the same ballpark as what happened on Buffy.