Ororo Munroe: Storm Appreciation 2020

[Mah_Boons]

or Shuri showing up to save Sharon but ultilizing some mythical ability to re-youth sharon despite tchalla supposedly being the one who is suppose to be king of the dead and yet she is controlling souls now as well. But what really told me everything i needed to know is when they had that storyline where the people were being saved and Cap and Falcon were saving the rich people instead of the people being sold. I don't need those kind of storm stories in my life. it will be 84 years of prose and side characters before Storm can even fart wind let alone get an aqctual story. I find it absolutely shocking in over 2 series of BP coates has only told two stories and one is still going.

LOL you kill me. But very true.

Oh and I forgot to tell you this. You better get ready to eat that Hat because I’m telling you he’s going to write her solo. It’s not a coincidence that Storm is dealing with Space BS in Black Panther and then she decides to go to Space on behalf of the X-Men.

[butterflykyss]

I always thought Storm being called a goddess was more metaphorical than anything. Most fans and writers probably disagree that she's an actual goddess (in the conventional MU sense) but recognize the divine way she carries herself so they call her by her old title. But the mystic aspect to Ororo's character was always there, it just took Coates to dig into it and put it on it's biggest display in a few years.

The Wakandans call her Hadari Yao because they believe Storm is a literal goddess. In one of their ancient languages they have stories of a goddess who walks among the clouds and Storm is believed to be some kind of reincarnation, as she now walks among the people. Her godhead is definitely genetic as it's passed down from mother to daughter, but it's not tied explicitly to her X-gene, that's just how it manifests itself. I don't think the X-Office will retcon that character trait out, they probably won't reference it though lol.

yes it absolutely was metaphorical. in fact back in the earlier uncanny issues sometimes when she was referred to a goddess it was within quotations indicating not a literal one. there was an instant where she was shown being worshipped in her xmen uniform in before the storm mini and Claremont said she had not become a true goddess yet. there was also roguestorm so there are definitely instances of her potentially an actual goddess canonically speaking.

I like your explanation for why the xmen don't refer to her as that due to it being one of the Wakandans ancient language names for her. that is why it was odd in marauders 13 hadari yao wasn't mentioned. if the xoffices or at least if Duggan/vita wanted that to be referenced that issue would have made the most sense to do it.

[Marvell2100]

yes it absolutely was metaphorical. in fact back in the earlier uncanny issues sometimes when she was referred to a goddess it was within quotations indicating not a literal one. there was an instant where she was shown being worshipped in her xmen uniform in before the storm mini and Claremont said she had not become a true goddess yet. there was also roguestorm so there are definitely instances of her potentially an actual goddess canonically speaking.

I like your explanation for why the xmen don't refer to her as that due to it being one of the Wakandans ancient language names for her. that is why it was odd in marauders 13 hadari yao wasn't mentioned. if the xoffices or at least if Duggan/vita wanted that to be referenced that issue would have made the most sense to do it.

And there was the issue where Xavier told Storm that she wasn't a goddess.

So yes, while they talked about it they never really put a whole lot of effort behind it.

[yogaflame]

Xavier's western ideology prevented him from seeing her divinity. She registered on Cerebro as a mutant, so that is what he saw her as. That said, Claremont did tease at her supernatural abilities several times, first against the N'gari demons, later in Roguestorm, as a sorceress in Limbo, when she was depowered, against the Adversary, later still in X-Treme.

Coates had her draw on external worship to one-shot the Adversary, but he himself barely defined or explored this aspect. As far as I see, there really is no fundamental difference between what he did and where she started at under Wein and Cockrum. She's always been a goddess. From day one.

[chief12d]

yes it absolutely was metaphorical. in fact back in the earlier uncanny issues sometimes when she was referred to a goddess it was within quotations indicating not a literal one. there was an instant where she was shown being worshipped in her xmen uniform in before the storm mini and Claremont said she had not become a true goddess yet. there was also roguestorm so there are definitely instances of her potentially an actual goddess canonically speaking.

I like your explanation for why the xmen don't refer to her as that due to it being one of the Wakandans ancient language names for her. that is why it was odd in marauders 13 hadari yao wasn't mentioned. if the xoffices or at least if Duggan/vita wanted that to be referenced that issue would have made the most sense to do it.

Yea and judging by that one X-Desk official from Marauders, it's easy to understand why she's called goddess lol. In-universe Storm is constantly pointed out to have an otherworldly beauty and aura. So when you add in her insane omega-level powers and the occasional hint of mystical potential, it's easy to see why her friends and enemies call her goddess, even if they don't mean that in the same sense of Thor. Unfortunately Claremont was the only writer to really explore this concept with any depth up until Coates.

For the Wakandans they go above the metaphor because in their eyes there's good reason to believe she is a legitimate member of the Orisha. That would've been nice to roll into Vita's guest issue but it's the kind of idea that requires exposition that the book didn't really have an obligation to incorporate. Remember, most X-fans don't read BP or know what Storm's been up to in his book so with limited page time, explaining Storm's godhood isn't necessary. If anything it hurts the story because if people knew how Storm was revered as a goddess they'd be questioning why the Wakandans were being such hardasses about giving her the sword.

[Marvell2100]

Yea and judging by that one X-Desk official from Marauders, it's easy to understand why she's called goddess lol. In-universe Storm is constantly pointed out to have an otherworldly beauty and aura. So when you add in her insane omega-level powers and the occasional hint of mystical potential, it's easy to see why her friends and enemies call her goddess, even if they don't mean that in the same sense of Thor. Unfortunately Claremont was the only writer to really explore this concept with any depth up until Coates.

For the Wakandans they go above the metaphor because in their eyes there's good reason to believe she is a legitimate member of the Orisha. That would've been nice to roll into Vita's guest issue but it's the kind of idea that requires exposition that the book didn't really have an obligation to incorporate. Remember, most X-fans don't read BP or know what Storm's been up to in his book so with limited page time, explaining Storm's godhood isn't necessary. If anything it hurts the story because if people knew how Storm was revered as a goddess they'd be questioning why the Wakandans were being such hardasses about giving her the sword.

That would depend on if they consider her a minor or major god. You've got Bast running around who is considered the main deity in Wakanda.

[chief12d]

That would depend on if they consider her a minor or major god. You've got Bast running around who is considered the main deity in Wakanda.

That's true, I'm inclined to think she was seen as a major god because you had people all across Wakanda worshipping her in the fight against Adversary. She's definitely more prominent than say the White Gorilla God or the Leopard Goddess that empowers Killmonger, but who knows where that places her. Hell, what is she even the god of lol? Light, Balance, and the Sky?

And I guess one can also argue that Shuri and Ramonda don't see Storm as an all-powerful goddess, but instead as a sister and daughter respectively, so it's easier for them to turn Ororo down. I doubt they'd have rejected Bast if she requested Skybreaker.

[Mah_Boons]

Technically Speaking Storm is a DemiGod. I mean Storm is after all still human.......just sayin

[butterflykyss]

And there was the issue where Xavier told Storm that she wasn't a goddess.

So yes, while they talked about it they never really put a whole lot of effort behind it.

I agree there was very little effort in that narrative. in fact her solo book by pak emphasized that she was not a real goddess and was only "worshipped" because she was crazy or a silly child. Coates canonized what the X-offices meant to be seen as a metaphor. Coates did have aspects of her history such as her mystical heritage and hints at her being more than just a mutant to pull from in making her a real goddess however.

Yea and judging by that one X-Desk official from Marauders, it's easy to understand why she's called goddess lol. In-universe Storm is constantly pointed out to have an otherworldly beauty and aura. So when you add in her insane omega-level powers and the occasional hint of mystical potential, it's easy to see why her friends and enemies call her goddess, even if they don't mean that in the same sense of Thor. Unfortunately Claremont was the only writer to really explore this concept with any depth up until Coates.

For the Wakandans they go above the metaphor because in their eyes there's good reason to believe she is a legitimate member of the Orisha. That would've been nice to roll into Vita's guest issue but it's the kind of idea that requires exposition that the book didn't really have an obligation to incorporate. Remember, most X-fans don't read BP or know what Storm's been up to in his book so with limited page time, explaining Storm's godhood isn't necessary. If anything it hurts the story because if people knew how Storm was revered as a goddess they'd be questioning why the Wakandans were being such hardasses about giving her the sword.

Agreed. I dont think even with the hints dropped by Claremont she was ever intended to be a real goddess. as I mentioned her entire solo run meant to humanize her and make her relatable and one aspect of showing this was by changing her origin to where her village knew she wasn't a real god. Coates literally canonized this and some storm fans give him grief but praise the xwriters when they made her a glorified drunken lightning lass with a lighting sword. it makes zero sense to me but I guess readers have different ways they would like to see her written. I prefer a black goddess, wise, fighting for all life (mutant and human alike) versus what I've seen from the xbooks, a lying distrusting lightning lass. but whatever floats your boat tight?

Nevertheless I never said they needed to explain her godhead only mention it. referring to her as the Hadari yao or simply goddess as they frequently did in BP required zero explanation. and we all know the reason the story was written as it was. some readers knew her relationship as established by Coates and that is why some storm fans have been critical of the issue.

[chief12d]

Technically Speaking Storm is a DemiGod. I mean Storm is after all still human.......just sayin

Technically speaking we don't know what Storm is from what I've seen lol. She doesn't meet the conventional definition of god at all because she's not a direct child of Gaea. Both her parents are human. But apparently she can use powers similar to the Elder God Oshtur despite not being a child of her either (that's assuming that the godhead that let's her make magical weather is indeed divine white magic that she's used in the past)

I think Coates was going to explore this in greater detail in his Storm solo, but my theory is Storm has a fragment (godhead) of the Elder God Oshtur's power within her body. She can channel this power through her X-gene, but can operate independent of it, though this hasn't been shown on panel. The Hadari Yao is probably just the Wakandan name for Oshtur, as we know they worshipped the Elder Gods before the rise of Bast.

And similar to how Bast usurped Gaea's role as the main earth/protection goddess of the Wakandans, Storm was fated to assume the role of Oshtur as the patron of light and balance. The godhead is just the divine blessing passed from mother to daughter that gives her the powers, a god-gene of sorts. Storm is less a god, and more a godling, but the effect is the same (divine magic), so we might as well cut the semantics and call her goddess lol. I'm not sure demigod is the most accurate term but that could work too if you use it loosely.

[butterflykyss]

Technically speaking we don't know what Storm is from what I've seen lol. She doesn't meet the conventional definition of god at all because she's not a direct child of Gaea. Both her parents are human. But apparently she can use powers similar to the Elder God Oshtur despite not being a child of her either (that's assuming that the godhead that let's her make magical weather is indeed divine white magic that she's used in the past)

I think Coates was going to explore this in greater detail in his Storm solo, but I think Storm has a fragment of the Elder God Oshtur's power within her body. She can channel this power through her X-gene, but can operate independent of it, though this hasn't been shown on panel. The Hadari Yao is probably just the Wakandan name for Oshtur, as we know they worshipped the Elder Gods before the rise of Bast.

And similar to how Bast usurped Gaea's role as the main earth/protection goddess of the Wakandans, Storm was fated to assume the role of Oshtur as the patron of light and balance. The godhead is just the divine blessing passed from mother to daughter that gives her the powers, a god-gene of sorts. Storm is less a god, and more a godling, but the effect is the same (divine magic), so we might as well cut the semantics and call her goddess lol. I'm not sure demigod is the most accurate term but that could work too if you use it loosely.

I dont think you can say at this point she does or doesn't have direct line to Gaea. her ancestors can be traced back to the dawn of humanity and she is favored by Oshtur. and is Hercules a direct child of gaea? he's a demigod and pretty sure he's not a direct child of gaea. all in all I think from her ancestral past her being a god could be explained. I think costes was intending to dig deeper with this in the solo he wanted to write.

[yogaflame]

Wein and Cockrum did intend for her to actually be an ancient, timeless African goddess. It was Claremont who made her from Harlem. Who added the claustrophobia and Cairo street thief background. Even still, Claremont considered her a '3-dimensional goddess', and always hinted at something more.

You have to realize making Storm an immortal, all-powerful goddess makes her unwieldy in a team setting. Even Thor, paragon of white male power, gets nerfed all the time in Avengers stories. With a whole roster to attend to, you can't just let him do the thing in a swing of his magic hammer. At least he usually has his own book to stretch those godly legs, and it's been that way since his inception. Wanting a team mutant team book to focus on Omega goddess Ororo just isn't very reasonable. She would really need her own book for that. Or at the very least a writer who wants to drape the team around her. We were blessed to get those Claremont stories. Without the combination of editorial/corporate push and a passionate creative team, that might be the best we get out of Storm.

[chief12d]

I dont think you can say at this point she does or doesn't have direct line to Gaea. her ancestors can be traced back to the dawn of humanity and she is favored by Oshtur. and is Hercules a direct child of gaea? he's a demigod and pretty sure he's not a direct child of gaea. all in all I think from her ancestral past her being a god could be explained. I think costes was intending to dig deeper with this in the solo he wanted to write.

I feel like there's not enough evidence (from Coates at least) to support Storm having distant ancestry to Gaea. All the imagery with her character is light, white, the sky, and balance, which are all traits of Oshtur. I'm more likely to believe she's is the progenitor of Storm's bloodline than Gaea, and even that seems iffy. The godhead being called a "gift" and "blessing" at one point hint Storm's matrilineal line was blessed with godly powers rather than them being actual descendants of any Elder God. I could be absolutely wrong on that but I think Storm is 100% human/mutant but accesses divine magic in a roundabout way. Hence why technically she's still a goddess.

Hercules isn't a child of Gaea but he claims godhood via a Skyfather, who were all created from the godstuff of dead Elder Gods (siblings of Gaea). So he's a close nephew lol. But you got me, gods are generally those descended from Gaea or a Skyfather (in the case of demi-gods)

[yogaflame]

Technically speaking we don't know what Storm is from what I've seen lol. She doesn't meet the conventional definition of god at all because she's not a direct child of Gaea. Both her parents are human. But apparently she can use powers similar to the Elder God Oshtur despite not being a child of her either (that's assuming that the godhead that let's her make magical weather is indeed divine white magic that she's used in the past)

I think Coates was going to explore this in greater detail in his Storm solo, but my theory is Storm has a fragment (godhead) of the Elder God Oshtur's power within her body. She can channel this power through her X-gene, but can operate independent of it, though this hasn't been shown on panel. The Hadari Yao is probably just the Wakandan name for Oshtur, as we know they worshipped the Elder Gods before the rise of Bast.

And similar to how Bast usurped Gaea's role as the main earth/protection goddess of the Wakandans, Storm was fated to assume the role of Oshtur as the patron of light and balance. The godhead is just the divine blessing passed from mother to daughter that gives her the powers, a god-gene of sorts. Storm is less a god, and more a godling, but the effect is the same (divine magic), so we might as well cut the semantics and call her goddess lol. I'm not sure demigod is the most accurate term but that could work too if you use it loosely.

In old Marvel cosmology, it was the worship and imagination of the people channeling the 'atmospheric divinity' left over from Atum that created and gave power to all the worlds pantheons.

Anyone or anything can become a god, since all of creation is godstuff. It's ultimately a matter of the divinity being observed/recognized/celebrated by human consciousness.

[Mah_Boons]

Technically speaking we don't know what Storm is from what I've seen lol. She doesn't meet the conventional definition of god at all because she's not a direct child of Gaea. Both her parents are human. But apparently she can use powers similar to the Elder God Oshtur despite not being a child of her either (that's assuming that the godhead that let's her make magical weather is indeed divine white magic that she's used in the past)

I think Coates was going to explore this in greater detail in his Storm solo, but my theory is Storm has a fragment (godhead) of the Elder God Oshtur's power within her body. She can channel this power through her X-gene, but can operate independent of it, though this hasn't been shown on panel. The Hadari Yao is probably just the Wakandan name for Oshtur, as we know they worshipped the Elder Gods before the rise of Bast.

And similar to how Bast usurped Gaea's role as the main earth/protection goddess of the Wakandans, Storm was fated to assume the role of Oshtur as the patron of light and balance. The godhead is just the divine blessing passed from mother to daughter that gives her the powers, a god-gene of sorts. Storm is less a god, and more a godling, but the effect is the same (divine magic), so we might as well cut the semantics and call her goddess lol. I'm not sure demigod is the most accurate term but that could work too if you use it loosely.

1. You make a great point. Although I’d say her divine power is coming from the latent potential of White Magic. All her Ancestors have used White Magic and none of them have ever been referred to as Goddess.
2. That is a very interesting perspective. I can agree to that. Storm could at the very least be a reincarnation of Oshtur since apparently they look alike. Probably why the Wakandans worship Storm. I think Coates explanation needs to go more in depth Because we are still guessing where is this Godhood coming from. I mean we know Storms Bloodline to be that of powerful Sorcerers that use White Magic. Now her bloodline is that of Gods? Since when....that’s probably certain fans of Storm or people who like Storm don’t really like for Storm to go down this path.
3. I get what you mean. But we can’t call her a full fledge God if her parents are actually human. Which is why I would call her a Demigod and if others did they wouldn’t be wrong.
3.