Ben Reilly: Spider-Man/Scarlet Spider Appreciation 2022

[Sr. Bungle]

I have had many favorites go through the same events. Keep in mind that the success stories like Wally West happened over a period of about 15 years. From Bart being Flash after Geoff’s crisis to Wally being the flash again in todays comics. Over those 15 years there where dark times and nothing ever stated everything would work out.

Cassandra Cain went evil in the most nonsense way I have seen. She got fixed in stages over the years but had at least 10 years of limbo.

Kyle Raynor is MIA. He has had it though since Hal got back(in my opinion) but most would say he’s been in bad shape since Green Lantern corps ended.

Captain Atom went evil in countdown to final crisis. He is yet fixed nor does he really appear.

Even if characters might get fixed and it’s all cyclical it takes decades. I think boots stated it in the review thread. Will we be here in 2042?

I'm 45, I might as well be dead by then

[Alex_Of_X]

I have had many favorites go through the same events. Keep in mind that the success stories like Wally West happened over a period of about 15 years. From Bart being Flash after Geoff’s crisis to Wally being the flash again in todays comics. Over those 15 years there where dark times and nothing ever stated everything would work out.

Cassandra Cain went evil in the most nonsense way I have seen. She got fixed in stages over the years but had at least 10 years of limbo.

Kyle Raynor is MIA. He has had it though since Hal got back(in my opinion) but most would say he’s been in bad shape since Green Lantern corps ended.

Captain Atom went evil in countdown to final crisis. He is yet fixed nor does he really appear.

Even if characters might get fixed and it’s all cyclical it takes decades. I think boots stated it in the review thread. Will we be here in 2042?

Most people should read Tom King's magnum opus "The Omega Men!" Up there with the best of his stuff.

[Pav]

They could, at any moment, have another Ben come swinging in like “Hey guys! I’m back! I just woke up in a basement of some demolished building called NewU. How’s the rest of 1996 been? Don’t suppose anyone taped the last few episodes of the X-Files?”

Yeah, if they ever wanted to do a hard reset for Ben, they could finally use the theory that most fans believed would eventually come to fruition: that Norman Osborn secretly kidnapped Ben and put him in stasis, and that all the stories since PP:SM75 have been clones of Ben, and their adventures would mean very little to him (other than him feeling bad that "he" hurt people while being in stasis). I know a lot of people would love to see this, and honestly, I wouldn't mind it either. It's a better "wipe away" than the Spider-Verse reset.

Still, it'd be nice to see a writer take what's been done to Ben and bring him back from the darkness better than ever rather than trying to ignore it all. But these are comics, so...!!!

-Pav, who still can't help but feel Ben would've been fine if he'd have been brought back during Spider-Island....

[Sr. Bungle]

Yeah, if they ever wanted to do a hard reset for Ben, they could finally use the theory that most fans believed would eventually come to fruition: that Norman Osborn secretly kidnapped Ben and put him in stasis, and that all the stories since PP:SM75 have been clones of Ben, and their adventures would mean very little to him (other than him feeling bad that "he" hurt people while being in stasis). I know a lot of people would love to see this, and honestly, I wouldn't mind it either. It's a better "wipe away" than the Spider-Verse reset.

Still, it'd be nice to see a writer take what's been done to Ben and bring him back from the darkness better than ever rather than trying to ignore it all. But these are comics, so...!!!

-Pav, who still can't help but feel Ben would've been fine if he'd have been brought back during Spider-Island....

JMD would be perfect for tht task, just saying...

[Refrax5]

I have had many favorites go through the same events. Keep in mind that the success stories like Wally West happened over a period of about 15 years. From Bart being Flash after Geoff’s crisis to Wally being the flash again in todays comics. Over those 15 years there where dark times and nothing ever stated everything would work out.

Cassandra Cain went evil in the most nonsense way I have seen. She got fixed in stages over the years but had at least 10 years of limbo.

Kyle Raynor is MIA. He has had it though since Hal got back(in my opinion) but most would say he’s been in bad shape since Green Lantern corps ended.

Captain Atom went evil in countdown to final crisis. He is yet fixed nor does he really appear.

Even if characters might get fixed and it’s all cyclical it takes decades. I think boots stated it in the review thread. Will we be here in 2042?

I think Ben has a bigger fanbase than Captain Atom at this point. I also think putting a character in limbo isn't the worst case scenario that you're painting it to be. Ben is never going to be an A list character again. He's my favorite character, but I accept that. I don't think Kyle Rayner is in bad shape just because he hasn't been used. The character is still GL, doing GL stuff. It sucks if you're a fan and don't have new material to read, but the character is alive and well. Ben being in limbo after Spider-Geddon might have spared us this Chasm stuff.

I'm not going to indulge in being miserable and bitter about this, because he's alive and has had multiple status changes in the past few years. Chasm has been met with a pretty negative response from fans and we have Scarlet Spider appearing in a big movie next year. The first Spider-Verse movie saved Noir and he was dead. Heel turns, death, resurrection, etc are all part of the neverending cycle of comics. Once upon a time it was inconceivable to me that Ben would ever come back, much less headline Amazing. I never thought I'd see him appear in a big movie franchise either. As long as he's around and in the public eye, there's every chance he'll bounce back.

He's alive and, as they say, where's there's life, there's hope. I get that people are mad, but to me its just one of those dumb comic book things that probably won't last.

[Malachi]

I think Ben has a bigger fanbase than Captain Atom at this point. I also think putting a character in limbo isn't the worst case scenario that you're painting it to be. Ben is never going to be an A list character again. He's my favorite character, but I accept that. I don't think Kyle Rayner is in bad shape just because he hasn't been used. The character is still GL, doing GL stuff. It sucks if you're a fan and don't have new material to read, but the character is alive and well. Ben being in limbo after Spider-Geddon might have spared us this Chasm stuff.

I'm not going to indulge in being miserable and bitter about this, because he's alive and has had multiple status changes in the past few years. Chasm has been met with a pretty negative response from fans and we have Scarlet Spider appearing in a big movie next year. The first Spider-Verse movie saved Noir and he was dead. Heel turns, death, resurrection, etc are all part of the neverending cycle of comics. Once upon a time it was inconceivable to me that Ben would ever come back, much less headline Amazing. I never thought I'd see him appear in a big movie franchise either. As long as he's around and in the public eye, there's every chance he'll bounce back.

He's alive and, as they say, where's there's life, there's hope. I get that people are mad, but to me its just one of those dumb comic book things that probably won't last.

I think you are missing parts of my point. I am not stating that limbo is bad. I am saying that the timespan for these cycles are rather large. So while people are arguing ways for Ben to return to pre-beyond shape they should factor in that, if it happens, it might take a couple of years. Or decades.

[Sr. Bungle]

I think you are missing parts of my point. I am not stating that limbo is bad. I am saying that the timespan for these cycles are rather large. So while people are arguing ways for Ben to return to pre-beyond shape they should factor in that, if it happens, it might take a couple of years. Or decades.

In this case, there's the upcoming movie factor. But we'll see if Marvel is good at synergy or not.

[Obsidian Spider]

[Sr. Bungle]

Love it!!!

[boots]

Love it!!!

made me smile

[Huntsman Spider]

This is not a bad idea. This is a perfect way to write them out and have them come back every once in a while for events or something

Thanks.

Him dying for good right now would be the worst thing that could happen. If he dies now, there's no redemption and he basically goes to Clone Hell with his legacy being Chasm.

I get that this sucks, but as long as he's alive and in use, there's every chance he'll eventually go back to who he was. Wally West went through an even worse character assassination and he's enjoying the best run he's had since Waid right now.

Pretty much this.

It started in that 5 issue series, there was a quick explanation of his behavior tossed in a random Flash issue and then a 6-ish issue story in Wally's Flash that retconned the rest and now he's totally back to normal and the bad times aren't really even mentioned.

There's a ton of ways to easily fix Ben and I think it'll happen inevitably. I've had so many characters I like become evil, die, get retconned, etc that I feel like I'm a little more calm about it than some other Ben fans. I strongly disagree with this direction for Ben, but I doubt it'll last.

If I recall right, that random issue of The Flash was the finale of Joshua Williamson's roughly hundred-issue run on the series since DC Rebirth started and had Eobard Thawne revealing that he used Negative Speed Force B.S. to f*** with all the Flashes' heads and make them race toward self-destruction, thus explaining Wally's counterproductive behavior in Heroes in Crisis. Then the (current) run where Wally formally returned as the Flash revealed that Savitar was actually behind the deadly Speed Force surge that Wally blamed himself for, trying to siphon off its power to make himself a literal god of motion like his namesake from Hindu mythology, a plot that Wally stopped cold, thus redeeming himself from Heroes in Crisis.

Adorable. Seriously.

[Refrax5]

I think you are missing parts of my point. I am not stating that limbo is bad. I am saying that the timespan for these cycles are rather large. So while people are arguing ways for Ben to return to pre-beyond shape they should factor in that, if it happens, it might take a couple of years. Or decades.

Years, maybe. But I don't think any of this crap has been popular and, again, there's a movie featuring Ben as Scarlet Spider next year. I doubt it'll take decades.

[Matt Rat]

In this case, there's the upcoming movie factor. But we'll see if Marvel is good at synergy or not.

Marvel's answer to synergy with the last Spider-Verse movie was to do another brainless shmoz with Spider-Geddon (though it was an improvement over the original). Had the new movie not been delayed 'till next year, then we'd have gotten another brainless shmoz with End of Spider-Verse, and Dark Web would have been a movie going comic reader's introduction to 616 Ben Reilly, and Peter and MJ would have been separated, where as the first movie at least ended with the indication Peter B Parker might have reconnected with his MJ at the end. That to me doesn't instil me with much confidence Peter B is all that successful.

[CaptainUniverse]

Marvel's answer to synergy with the last Spider-Verse movie was to do another brainless shmoz with Spider-Geddon (though it was an improvement over the original). Had the new movie not been delayed 'till next year, then we'd have gotten another brainless shmoz with End of Spider-Verse, and Dark Web would have been a movie going comic reader's introduction to 616 Ben Reilly, and Peter and MJ would have been separated, where as the first movie at least ended with the indication Peter B Parker might have reconnected with his MJ at the end. That to me doesn't instil me with much confidence Peter B is all that successful.

Well, since you are being the ever-pessimist, it is up to me to be the ever-optimist. Opposite forces and all that jazz. I think Peter B and MJ are too busy preparing for Mayday's arrival for him to go gallivanting around the Multiverse fighting Miguel O'Hara, hence why his role in the next film is not as large as it was in the first movie. It would be idiotic of them to throw away all of Peter B's character development from the first movie just to appease a company that...guess what? They don't work for! Everything is clearly gearing towards Peter B. and MJ having reconciled, if it wasn't...then Peter B. would be heading to face off against Miguel O'Hara with Miles in the next movie.

[Sr. Bungle]

Great thread by our very own (?) David Walton:

https://twitter.com/BenReilly149/sta...66254259503104