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  1. #1561

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    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    Forge is often times just a color-swapped Tony Stark; I just can't enjoy the concept of a Native American denying his mystical heritage in favor of technology, and actively working with the [American] military industrial complex. I'm sure Claremont thought he was being clever, but it just rings offensive to me. In Storm's story, he's really more of a plot device to spur her character development through her period of depowerment. Not even Claremont really developed them as a loving couple to any great extent, and later writers never did much with them either. Add on to that his retraction of his proposal and dipping out with Mystique after crushing her heart in his hand, and it just doesn't work for me.
    Equating Indigeity with mysticism is offensive too, though. Not every Indigenous characters needs to be a shaman. The things Claremont had Forge grappling with are really interesting elements of Indigenous Futurism. Everything Claremont wrote needs updating for the 21st century and I'm not saying that Forge is perfect, but I do think he has a lot to offer.

  2. #1562
    Mighty Member Stormrocks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    T'Challa and Forge are both not right for Storm. BP has too many obligations beyond her, as did Forge in the 90's(with X-Factor). Storm really needs her own solo book, and any man(or woman) she decides to engage with should have all eyes on her.
    I agree with this, 100%

  3. #1563
    Extraordinary Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    lololol right??? yea forge was savage af. I would never want her to be with a man who was abusive as he was. For all of tchalla's faults that eventually led to their annulled marriage he at least sought to make right all the mistakes he made.
    Professor X said it was her fault. Lol. In reality it was a hit job by Marvel. With nobody there to protect the brand it was inevitable.

  4. #1564
    Extraordinary Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    tchalla put all those obligations on the side for her. that was partially what coates demonstrated in the first season of his BP book.
    For her? I dont remember that. He stopped being an absolute monarch and the most that happened is they've been in a few dates. Eden still has to Uber her in. Lol.

  5. #1565
    Extraordinary Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    T'Challa and Forge are both not right for Storm. BP has too many obligations beyond her, as did Forge in the 90's(with X-Factor). Storm really needs her own solo book, and any man(or woman) she decides to engage with should have all eyes on her.
    When she married him she took on those responsibilities too. The only one on the X side who tried to make it look good was Pak if I remember correctly.

  6. #1566
    Spectacular Member stormstan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    T'Challa and Forge are both not right for Storm. BP has too many obligations beyond her, as did Forge in the 90's(with X-Factor). Storm really needs her own solo book, and any man(or woman) she decides to engage with should have all eyes on her.
    Hmmm good point but I like fictional relationship to be realistic. I want someone to be devoted to her but they’re superheroes with obligations, which strains that.

  7. #1567
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    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    T'Challa and Forge are both not right for Storm. BP has too many obligations beyond her, as did Forge in the 90's(with X-Factor). Storm really needs her own solo book, and any man(or woman) she decides to engage with should have all eyes on her.
    Nothing, but Truth here.

  8. #1568
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    Ok, sure...

    Where is he now, somewhere in space with NuNakia? Not exactly helpful for Ororo.

    he doesnt have his memories as he was mindwiped but even with that his love and memories of ororo still prevailed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    Professor X said it was her fault. Lol. In reality it was a hit job by Marvel. With nobody there to protect the brand it was inevitable.
    when did Xavier say this?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    For her? I dont remember that. He stopped being an absolute monarch and the most that happened is they've been in a few dates. Eden still has to Uber her in. Lol.
    yes for her. tchalla recognized that in order to.be free he couldnt be what the past black Panthers were; he realized that no one man should have that type of power and be tyrant.


    Attachment 80567


    after this epiphany his mother commented that he seemed free:

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/VzOXRpruiS...DOtgNOGA=s1600


    with this freedom his first thing he chose to do was see his one true love:

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/0h_o-sgB71...M-QZuF2w=s1600



    Tchalla now was free and able to live the life he wanted to, as well as pursue and love the woman he wanted to. This was one of the plots to the no one man storyline.
    Last edited by butterflykyss; 03-30-2019 at 03:31 PM.
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO, THE OMEGA'S OMEGA, BEYOND OMEGA, THE VOICE OF SOL!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  9. #1569

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    Quote Originally Posted by Strong Girl Daken View Post
    Equating Indigeity with mysticism is offensive too, though. Not every Indigenous characters needs to be a shaman. The things Claremont had Forge grappling with are really interesting elements of Indigenous Futurism. Everything Claremont wrote needs updating for the 21st century and I'm not saying that Forge is perfect, but I do think he has a lot to offer.
    I would update/redo Forge from top to bottom, and in that scenario, make him suitable for Ororo. But as it stands, Forge having been presented as firmly against his native/ancestral heritage(which includes mysticism) reads as more offensive to me. No, not every Native American character has to be mystical/magical, but to bring that up in the character's history, and then have him reject it, and side with the military industrial complex, is ridiculous[and is a literal manifestation of colonization].
    Let the flames destroy all but that which is pure and true!

  10. #1570

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    When she married him she took on those responsibilities too. The only one on the X side who tried to make it look good was Pak if I remember correctly.
    ???

    Pak never wrote Storm and BP?
    Let the flames destroy all but that which is pure and true!

  11. #1571
    Extraordinary Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    he doesnt have his memories as he was mindwiped but even with that his love and memories of ororo still prevailed.



    when did Xavier say this?



    yes for her. tchalla recognized that in order to.be free he couldnt be what the past black Panthers were; he realized that no one man should have that type of power and be tyrant.


    Attachment 80567


    after this epiphany his mother commented that he seemed free:

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/VzOXRpruiS...DOtgNOGA=s1600


    with this freedom his first thing he chose to do was see his one true love:

    https://2.bp.blogspot.com/0h_o-sgB71...M-QZuF2w=s1600



    Tchalla now was free and able to live the life he wanted to, as well as pursue and love the woman he wanted to. This was one of the plots to the no one man storyline.
    No. Just no. Storm had no influence on that decision. The story would have ended that way if Storm was dead or alive. You could tell that from the first issue.

  12. #1572
    Extraordinary Member Cville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yogaflame View Post
    ???

    Pak never wrote Storm and BP?
    My fault. Confused him with Yost.

  13. #1573
    Everything Fades Away... butterflykyss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    No. Just no. Storm had no influence on that decision. The story would have ended that way if Storm was dead or alive. You could tell that from the first issue.

    your objections dont align to canon. if she had no influence on the decision why was she the first one he chose to visit?
    ALL HAIL THE HADARI YAO, THE OMEGA'S OMEGA, BEYOND OMEGA, THE VOICE OF SOL!!!! NOW AGAIN THE ONE TRUE AND ONLY GODDESS OF THE X-MEN AS CLAREMONT INTENDED!!!!!

  14. #1574

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    Quote Originally Posted by butterflykyss View Post
    Tchalla now was free and able to live the life he wanted to, as well as pursue and love the woman he wanted to. This was one of the plots to the no one man storyline.
    Free to run off into space without her.



    I'm sorry; they tried it, it didn't work.

    They have spent literally decades on opposite sides of the MU. Their narrative ties are paper thin.

    T'Challa works best as the king of Wakanda, and as an Avenger. Ororo works best as a leader of the X-Men. Their fandoms have never quite aligned, nor really their stories. At the end of the day, T'Challa's an inventor/h2h fighter, Ororo is a high end energy manipulator. They just don't really work together. Even when they were married or even in Coates first run, one has to pwn to the other. It's like trying to put Wonder Woman and Batman together. Sure there are those who think it is an interesting idea, but they just can't really work together. They are best doing their own separate things, with perhaps occasional team-ups, not as a romantic couple.
    Let the flames destroy all but that which is pure and true!

  15. #1575

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cville View Post
    My fault. Confused him with Yost.
    Yost's Worlds Apart was the 'best' the pairing was written from an X perspective, but even there, Storm ran over Wakanda, BP, the Dora, and the X-Men, which perfectly illustrates by point above. They just operate on completely different frequencies.
    Let the flames destroy all but that which is pure and true!

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