Controversial Superman Opinions

[phonogram12]

Interesting that Byrne even made note of the concern in the afterward of the very first issue of Man of Steel.

[phonogram12]

I don't think people really like the idea that Superman is "human". They just like the idea of Superman touting the human race as this great thing and bending the knee to it. It's an ego trip for the reader to see Supes attribute everything in his life The Kents, Lois, Perry, etc because they're human like the reader.

I've always thought this, too. In fact, I find it mildly ridiculous that so many superhero/scifi comics make Earth the pinnacle of existence throughout the cosmos. If that's true, the rest of the universe must be in really awful shape.

Prior to Byrne's MOS, Superman was someone to aspire to. With Byrne's characterization, he was someone you could relate to, which is the complete antithesis of what he was meant to be. But relating is easier because trying to be a better person is hard.

[Kaitou D. Kid]

I don't think people really like the idea that Superman is "human". They just like the idea of Superman touting the human race as this great thing and bending the knee to it. It's an ego trip for the reader to see Supes attribute everything in his life The Kents, Lois, Perry, etc because they're human like the reader.

The "Superman is human" thing is commentary on Clark's status as an immigrant. It was Byrne's way of critiquing the myth that immigrants can't/don't want to integrate or see themselves as American.

[Jim Kelly]

I think I'm the only one here that says Superman is human. Every time this subject comes up, I'm the one saying he's human and everyone else is telling me I'm wrong.

The whole point of the story that Siegel and Shuster created is to show an example of a human being that is more powerful than the rest of us. That only works if you see Superman as a man who is super. The kids back in 1938 were amazed to see a human being doing impossible things. It would be different if he was an elephant or a dinosaur. The 'from another planet' origin was just the way to explain how he could be so powerful. They were going to have him come from Earth's distant future--but opted for a futuristic world, probably because it was simpler. But the whole point of Superman is that he's us if our regular abilities were super-advanced.

[Ascended]

I think I'm the only one here that says Superman is human. Every time this subject comes up, I'm the one saying he's human and everyone else is telling me I'm wrong.

The whole point of the story that Siegel and Shuster created is to show an example of a human being that is more powerful than the rest of us. That only works if you see Superman as a man who is super. The kids back in 1938 were amazed to see a human being doing impossible things. It would be different if he was an elephant or a dinosaur. The 'from another planet' origin was just the way to explain how he could be so powerful. They were going to have him come from Earth's distant future--but opted for a futuristic world, probably because it was simpler. But the whole point of Superman is that he's us if our regular abilities were super-advanced.

I never tell you you're *wrong* I just have a different opinion than you do. And that's perfectly cool, this isn't politics and we're allowed to disagree without one of us being a fascist and the other being a socialist.

Clark is *human* in the ways that really matter; he's got the soul of a man. So sure, in the abstract I agree that Superman is "human." And while the original idea and stories don't delve into Clark's Otherness beyond providing an explanation for his powers, it didn't take long for Krypton and Clark's heritage to become bigger drivers in his narrative either. I'm kinda-sorta certain that happened before Siegel even left the character (?)

Clark is "us" at our absolute best as a species, thematically, but I think it does him a disservice to discount his biology, neurology, and all the ways he's different. Not only does this help speak to his status as an immigration allegory but I think it helps make him more relatable; everyone feels like they're alone in how they see the world, everyone feels that Otherness (at least sometimes). For Clark, this is expressed in his sensory perceptions, his powers, his thought processes, and while most of us don't have brains that can out-perform super computers and see music in math, we still connect to Clark through the idea of being The Other.

Say what you will about Max Landis, but his using the phrase "American Alien" really hits perfectly; those two words fully encapsulate everything Clark is; on one hand a guy no more different from you than I am, and on the other someone that none of us can fully comprehend or understand.

And I think (just some real rough guesswork here that might not be true) when we look at the history, the periods where DC has tried to make Clark into an Everyman are usually the same periods when the sales and interest start to collapse, and the periods when Clark's allowed to be a little weird and strange are the periods when sales and interest start to rise.

[PCN24454]

I think I'm the only one here that says Superman is human. Every time this subject comes up, I'm the one saying he's human and everyone else is telling me I'm wrong.

The whole point of the story that Siegel and Shuster created is to show an example of a human being that is more powerful than the rest of us. That only works if you see Superman as a man who is super. The kids back in 1938 were amazed to see a human being doing impossible things. It would be different if he was an elephant or a dinosaur. The 'from another planet' origin was just the way to explain how he could be so powerful. They were going to have him come from Earth's distant future--but opted for a futuristic world, probably because it was simpler. But the whole point of Superman is that he's us if our regular abilities were super-advanced.

It depends on how they're define "human". Obviously, he's not human, but you can argue whether or not he's conceptually human as well.

A lot of people think that it's unrealistic for person as powerful as him to be a good guy. That's what makes him "inhuman".

[manwhohaseverything]

I think I'm the only one here that says Superman is human. Every time this subject comes up, I'm the one saying he's human and everyone else is telling me I'm wrong.

Even gods are human. Many even have families . That's very human societal structure.Even One punch man is human. My problem is mundanity becoming the main flavour. Superman ain't fake clark kent with glasses.

While, american alien was great. I am just burned out by stories centered around clark kent and kal el. I want something truly centered around superman for once like in goldenage and some issues of morrison's action. It's like nobody likes superman for superman. Everybody wants clark or kal. Well, i say Superman and the big S on his chest matter. What's so bad about a kickass action hero?

[Agent Z]

I've always thought this, too. In fact, I find it mildly ridiculous that so many superhero/scifi comics make Earth the pinnacle of existence throughout the cosmos. If that's true, the rest of the universe must be in really awful shape.

Prior to Byrne's MOS, Superman was someone to aspire to. With Byrne's characterization, he was someone you could relate to, which is the complete antithesis of what he was meant to be. But relating is easier because trying to be a better person is hard.

Admiring and relating to someone are not mutually exclusive. In fact, the latter is necessary for the former. If nothing about Superman as a character speaks to you personally - his ideals, his upbringing - what reason is there to admire him? He might as well be some Cthulu-like eldritch abomination from another realm.

[Stanlos]

Even gods are human. Many even have families . That's very human societal structure.Even One punch man is human. My problem is mundanity becoming the main flavour. Superman ain't fake clark kent with glasses.

While, american alien was great. I am just burned out by stories centered around clark kent and kal el. I want something truly centered around superman for once like in goldenage and some issues of morrison's action. It's like nobody likes superman for superman. Everybody wants clark or kal. Well, i say Superman and the big S on his chest matter. What's so bad about a kickass action hero?

Are Clark, Kal, and Superman not one complete thing anymore?

[manwhohaseverything]

Are Clark, Kal, and Superman not one complete thing anymore?

Emphesis on identities results in different stories.these are 3 different distinct identities of a person.Superman has become a mere faculty.
Superman is a vigilante strongman.the champion of the oppressed.that's his domain.in goldenage,clark kent was fake.kal el was passive and dormant.superman was the only thing that mattered.

[9th.]

I think I'm the only one here that says Superman is human. Every time this subject comes up, I'm the one saying he's human and everyone else is telling me I'm wrong.

The whole point of the story that Siegel and Shuster created is to show an example of a human being that is more powerful than the rest of us. That only works if you see Superman as a man who is super. The kids back in 1938 were amazed to see a human being doing impossible things. It would be different if he was an elephant or a dinosaur. The 'from another planet' origin was just the way to explain how he could be so powerful. They were going to have him come from Earth's distant future--but opted for a futuristic world, probably because it was simpler. But the whole point of Superman is that he's us if our regular abilities were super-advanced.

I wouldn't say you were wrong Clark is definitely exceptional in many ways, he never felt alien to me outside of his powers and linage. The only thing he can be is human because that's how he was raised and those are his peers (most of them anyway).

[Vordan]

I’m playing through the Fallout series and it suddenly hit me: Metropolis should straight up be an adaption of the Fallout pre-War status quo.

I’ve used this pic as an example for how I’d like Metropolis to look, but holy **** I never realized how perfect the entire setting of Fallout is for Superman. It lets you keep the 50s retrofuturism people love to give Metropolis while still explaining why this supposedly perfect city needs Superman. A smiling happy 50s Americana aesthetic covering for a gleefully amoral underbelly where corrupt jingoistic politicians sell out their constituents to ruthless corporations whose only desire is profit.

[Jim Kelly]

I think in the early days of the reboot the pseudo-science theory was he couldn't mate with Earth women and therefore wasn't human. Then it turned to he could mate but it would kill the woman. Now he can mate and produce offspring--so he must be human, right? Genetic science says so.

Of course, in comics weird-looking aliens mate with Earth people and have kids. And metahumans should be so far beyond the normal--look at what Barry Allen can do--that their genetics must be alien. Comics torture logic.

[Vordan]

I think in the early days of the reboot the pseudo-science theory was he couldn't mate with Earth women and therefore wasn't human. Then it turned to he could mate but it would kill the woman. Now he can mate and produce offspring--so he must be human, right? Genetic science says so.

Of course, in comics weird-looking aliens mate with Earth people and have kids. And metahumans should be so far beyond the normal--look at what Barry Allen can do--that their genetics must be alien. Comics torture logic.

Could always retcon Earth to be a Kryptonian colony lost to time like Daxam lol. But “Kryptonian science” is enough of a hand wave for me.

[Agent Z]

Could always retcon Earth to be a Kryptonian colony lost to time like Daxam lol. But “Kryptonian science” is enough of a hand wave for me.

Wasn't one of the original ideas for Krypton being Earth from the future?