Marauders #11

[Havok83]

While they don't use the word dying, Scott says something like is it done? Or did we succeed? (Not quotting verbatim) So it is not categorically talking about death but it is tantamount to him talking about the mission which he knew was perilous.It is a logical question because he wanted to know if their mission on mothermold was a success even after their death.Besides to wake up from an egg is self explanatory.You cannot wake up and ask such a question with no clue that you died.

He said "Did it work?". The mission was a suicide mission. All the X-men went on it knowing that they were all likely not going to return alive. When Scott woke up from the egg, he was aware that he had died and was asking Xavier if that mission was a success. Like if you wake up from a resurrection egg, its obvious that you have died. There was no indication that he remembered dying. Even if you were confused when reading that issue, X-men #6 clarified what exactly happened





Theres nothing ambigous about this. The X-men dont recall what happened on the mission bc Xavier backed them up right before they left, when they were within the reach of Cerebro

[Slicknickshady]

I just don’t believe these are the real character. Can’t wait till Hickman’s stuff is Retconned away.

[Havok83]

I just don’t believe these are the real character. Can’t wait till Hickman’s stuff is Retconned away.

I mean they have to be or else it means a sh-t ton of characters were killed off between Rosenberg's run and now Hickman's. So far we've had him for one year but this will probably be the status quo for a few years and its hard to believe that they'd throw away all that character development for alot of characters by saying they werent the real deals

[Rev9]

He said "Did it work?". The mission was a suicide mission. All the X-men went on it knowing that they were all likely not going to return alive. When Scott woke up from the egg, he was aware that he had died and was asking Xavier if that mission was a success. Like if you wake up from a resurrection egg, its obvious that you have died. There was no indication that he remembered dying. Even if you were confused when reading that issue, X-men #6 clarified what exactly happened





Theres nothing ambigous about this. The X-men dont recall what happened on the mission bc Xavier backed them up right before they left, when they were within the reach of Cerebro

Even if in this one instance they were out of reach of Cerebro, that does not mean we haven't seen countless times other X-Men dying and remembering their last moments,Quentin keeps dying, Collosus didn't die the first time but implied that Domino after their train mission should be resurrected without the scars Domino had.So I don't see why Kitty should not have the memories. There is an inherent clue in why they don't copy someone unless they are absolutely sure the person is dead.One is not to waste the five's time,two perhaps not to create identity crises of resurrected mutants or overstuffing the database and three the creation of what I'd call blind spots
If say Gambit was mistakenly thought to have died at 9pm on August 19,2020 and is resurrected at 8am August 21,2020 he indeed will have memories of 8.59 pm of Aug 19,2020 but cannot have memories of 9.01pm of Aug 19th all the way to 7.59 am Aug 21,2020

Meaning 35 hours of logged life is missing from the clone,if imparting that missing time can only be done during resurrection then no matter what is done the clone will always be out of step with the prime subject

[DarkMagnus]

lol who cares what happened in the Resurxion era.

that was a thing?

XMEN GOLD is semi cannon

[Havok83]

Even if in this one instance they were out of reach of Cerebro, that does not mean we haven't seen countless times other X-Men dying and remembering their last moments,Quentin keeps dying, Collosus didn't die the first time but implied that Domino after their train mission should be resurrected without the scars Domino had.So I don't see why Kitty should not have the memories. There is an inherent clue in why they don't copy someone unless they are absolutely sure the person is dead.One is not to waste the five's time,two perhaps not to create identity crises of resurrected mutants or overstuffing the database and three the creation of what I'd call blind spots
If say Gambit was mistakenly thought to have died at 9pm on August 19,2020 and is resurrected at 8am August 21,2020 he indeed will have memories of 8.59 pm of Aug 19,2020 but cannot have memories of 9.01pm of Aug 19th all the way to 7.59 am Aug 21,2020

Meaning 35 hours of logged life is missing from the clone,if imparting that missing time can only be done during resurrection then no matter what is done the clone will always be out of step with the prime subject

What countless times? Post one example of an X-man actually remembering their death. This issue explicitly contradicts your statement when it comes to Kitty.

Xavier makes a backup of a mutant exactly once a week. Cerebro is not constantly backing everyone up simultaneously. Everything a mutant experience after that backup until death is lost. If he had a backup of Kitty's last moments, then he'd know about Shaw killing her. If all mutants were backed up up until death, then that would make X-factor moot as Xavier would have access to that info


Id suggest you go back and read HOX #5. It was fairly detailed in the data pages with how the process works

[Devaishwarya]

Those 35 hours between death and resurrection are not logged...because the character is dead...there is nothing to download.
Also...Xavier isn't downloading 24/7. He has to actually take time off/away to download the many mutant psyches. When he's walking about, talking with the QC and interacting with the X-Men he's not downloading anything.

[Steel Inquisitor]

that was a thing?

XMEN GOLD is semi cannon

Yes? If it's in 616 it's canon.

[superjosh]

Yes? If it's in 616 it's canon.

Canon, yes. Forgotten? Also yes lol.

[Anchorsify]

I mean they have to be or else it means a sh-t ton of characters were killed off between Rosenberg's run and now Hickman's. So far we've had him for one year but this will probably be the status quo for a few years and its hard to believe that they'd throw away all that character development for alot of characters by saying they werent the real deals

Not to mention the ending to all of this Krakoa stuff is semi-obvious. Moira was introduced as a reality-resetting mutant safeguarded in No-Place with Precogs disallowed and a phasing mutant inexplicably unable to use portals (when even humans can when guided). The answer to the reset post-Hickman isn't "Psyche they're skrulls all along", it's "the truth comes out and Moira dies". Whether the nation falls afterward, whether Moira's death resets the universe again or whether she is de-powered or simply runs out of self-rez's, whether the out-of-time future **** comes into play much at all or if they somehow deal with or avert the big bads shown in HoX/PoX, the particulars aren't known, but these are very clearly the real characters you know doing real things in the real 616.

[Rev9]

What countless times? Post one example of an X-man actually remembering their death. This issue explicitly contradicts your statement when it comes to Kitty.

Xavier makes a backup of a mutant exactly once a week. Cerebro is not constantly backing everyone up simultaneously. Everything a mutant experience after that backup until death is lost. If he had a backup of Kitty's last moments, then he'd know about Shaw killing her. If all mutants were backed up up until death, then that would make X-factor moot as Xavier would have access to that info


Id suggest you go back and read HOX #5. It was fairly detailed in the data pages with how the process works

Well to be honest X-Men 07 breaks the rules set in HoX 5. Melody Guthrie not only says 'I'm back ,I'm whole ..Thank you' to Apocalypse just minutes after dying and we know it is minutes because Cyclops continues his train of thought to Nightcrawler. There's also a problem in the regard that even if the five due to special circumstance set crucible participants up to have a ready husk minutes before the event

1.No one can be certain every crucible member will accept the challenge of dying. What happens when someone is a coward?
You shut down the husk?

2.Xavier has to back up that person's mind contemporaneously to the event,otherwise the whole crucible is moot.If you don't remember it what good is the spectacle of this rite of passage? Anyone on Krakoa can question you how it felt going through it and you won't have anything to say if your memory is a week old.

I agree HoX says roughly 200 resurrections take place per day,so Xavier may not be able to do back ups in real time due to exhaustion but it doesn't mean he absolutely cannot on a case by case.Also Jean was able to resurrect him with a different cerebro one he couldn't have possibly fed real time data into because only one is online at any one time, yet when he does come back he is fully aware on the attempt on his life enough to deny it in front of the media. Again some may say he may have set up his death so he had foreknowledge. Maybe so but that would imply Cerebro is a flawed system not being able to tell imagination from true recollection.Anyway Guthrie's example proves updates are instantaneous(even if in special circumstances) and Xavier's resurrection proves the other cerebros are linked to the main one.There is a problem if we are to presume they are not, it would mean all the backups on the damaged cerebro are completely lost or damaged. That's a big deal for all data collected on the mutants on that very cerebro.I don't think Xavier would not anticipate such a problem

Another clue is Domino she asked Colossus to be resurrected with memories of her pain ,whether Collosus didn't follow through or Domino changed her mind is irrelevant, she was resurrected with those memories absent! It means memories are not updated to keep in step with her death but again contemporaneously and only removed with her permission.We see they are part of her being when she dies and she is holding on to them, she probably knows they can be overwritten or erased and that makes sense of her pleading to keep them.It would be pointless to say that to Colossus if she knows that very plea will not be in the data logs anyway.

[Frobisher]

The “once a week” thing is Xavier copying the back-ups into the cradles for a disaster recovery situation, such as Cerebro being destroyed. It doesn’t cover how often Xavier takes a snapshot of each mutant mind, though you’d have to assume he can do it whenever in range of the subject, including at the moment of death. Most of the time though he wouldn’t be aware when someone is about to die as he’s far from omniscient, so for Kate her last “save point” was just before going to Madripoor.

[Rev9]

The “once a week” thing is Xavier copying the back-ups into the cradles for a disaster recovery situation, such as Cerebro being destroyed. It doesn’t cover how often Xavier takes a snapshot of each mutant mind, though you’d have to assume he can do it whenever in range of the subject, including at the moment of death. Most of the time though he wouldn’t be aware when someone is about to die as he’s far from omniscient, so for Kate her last “save point” was just before going to Madripoor.

That is why it would make sense that the cerebros are linked.One is taking snapshots and the others are getting those snapshots routed to them in real time.Or at least one of them for the 'soft back up' that takes 3 hours .Maybe Xavier had one of them synchronised in real time and only takes 3 hours to transfer the updated data to the other 3 (including the contingency one) once every week.It makes sense because Xavier was resurrected with a different cerebro.To be resurrected with an older self because of no direct update and not knowing contemporaneous facts is truly bizzare. Relying on others to fill in the blanks and not the technology you set up is a serious problem.. There's also the cognitive dissonance because you'd be claiming feelings and thoughts and ideas that are not your own.Xavier would not need to feel vindicated if he has no memory of being killed

[Rev9]

Those 35 hours between death and resurrection are not logged...because the character is dead...there is nothing to download.
Also...Xavier isn't downloading 24/7. He has to actually take time off/away to download the many mutant psyches. When he's walking about, talking with the QC and interacting with the X-Men he's not downloading anything.

'If say Gambit was mistakenly thought to have died' is a hypothetical as I said mistaken resurrection means real mutant will always have memories the clone cannot.That must be one of the reasons they cross check if any 'dead' mutant is indeed dead precisely to avoid this

[Havok83]

Well to be honest X-Men 07 breaks the rules set in HoX 5. Melody Guthrie not only says 'I'm back ,I'm whole ..Thank you' to Apocalypse just minutes after dying and we know it is minutes because Cyclops continues his train of thought to Nightcrawler. There's also a problem in the regard that even if the five due to special circumstance set crucible participants up to have a ready husk minutes before the event

1.No one can be certain every crucible member will accept the challenge of dying. What happens when someone is a coward?
You shut down the husk?

2.Xavier has to back up that person's mind contemporaneously to the event,otherwise the whole crucible is moot.If you don't remember it what good is the spectacle of this rite of passage? Anyone on Krakoa can question you how it felt going through it and you won't have anything to say if your memory is a week old.

I agree HoX says roughly 200 resurrections take place per day,so Xavier may not be able to do back ups in real time due to exhaustion but it doesn't mean he absolutely cannot on a case by case.Also Jean was able to resurrect him with a different cerebro one he couldn't have possibly fed real time data into because only one is online at any one time, yet when he does come back he is fully aware on the attempt on his life enough to deny it in front of the media. Again some may say he may have set up his death so he had foreknowledge. Maybe so but that would imply Cerebro is a flawed system not being able to tell imagination from true recollection.Anyway Guthrie's example proves updates are instantaneous(even if in special circumstances) and Xavier's resurrection proves the other cerebros are linked to the main one.There is a problem if we are to presume they are not, it would mean all the backups on the damaged cerebro are completely lost or damaged. That's a big deal for all data collected on the mutants on that very cerebro.I don't think Xavier would not anticipate such a problem

Another clue is Domino she asked Colossus to be resurrected with memories of her pain ,whether Collosus didn't follow through or Domino changed her mind is irrelevant, she was resurrected with those memories absent! It means memories are not updated to keep in step with her death but again contemporaneously and only removed with her permission.We see they are part of her being when she dies and she is holding on to them, she probably knows they can be overwritten or erased and that makes sense of her pleading to keep them.It would be pointless to say that to Colossus if she knows that very plea will not be in the data logs anyway.

Its not minutes. Kurt and Scott have two separate conversations. Melody saying "Im back" is not evidence that she remembers her death. Anyone going through the Crucible is going to be backed up right before that happens so their memories are going to be the most current bc Xavier knows they are about to die (assuming they complete it). The Crucible is a special case for that reason. No other mutant resurrection will have memories as recent as this bc deaths are largely random and can fall anywhere between the 1 week backup

Xavier's mind is constantly linked to Cerebro so if there is anyone that is going to have always recent memories, its going to be him. He doesnt have to go out of his way to back up an external person as he does with others bc his mind is already connected. We already knew there were multiple copies of the data bc the scan I posted says so. There's multiple cradles across the world where the copies are placed so destroying one Cerebro doesnt get rid of it