I'm not asking for happy. I'd be hard pressed to describe Omega Men or Vision as happy endings. But they did say true and beautiful things about love, loss, war, religion, and politics.
Mister Miracle is saying...what? "Running away is good?" That doesn't seem true or beautiful to me.
"We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
"All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
"There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord
of course it's subjective and I was pointing out how the ending felt to me
Or I should say, how it left me feeling
and I didn't knock the series I did knock the ending
I have said it started well, but I felt the ending was hugely disapointing for me
if you liked it, that's cool, but fir me this wasn't even an actual ending, it's no further on from where it started really, 12 issues to effectively go nowhere
imo
As for being more that punching people, that's blasé, I want a good story, imo this ending really wasn't an ending as more than a "couldn't figure out what it wanted to be so just stopped"
For all the internal character discussion, actually on the page, he's not really any different and we still don't know his situation
which I didn't like, there was plenty of time to get past this point and have some clarity
This isn't anything more than a maybe it is/maybe it isn't
that never really works for me and it don't work for me here
If you liked it I'm glad for you
Firstly I picked it up coz I love scott and the new gods
When it started I quite liked what I had seen of king, that's not the case now not just for this book
If this is a study of his mind set that does not require an ending where we as readers are not really any further down the path than at the start, there are many points left unclear, and whilst that may be ok with you it's not for me, it's ok that we don't agree on that
it frustrates me because this was 12 issues of what effectively ends on a nonsense ending with no real clarity or conclusions, and I don't like that, I hoped for better
and in fairness, I hoped it woukd be better than this, as I felt it started well and hoped it would end as such, whilst it was unclear along the way, there was more than enough time to come to a definitive conclusion
the writer didn't want to, Ok, I reserve the right not to like that and to say so
It's not wrong that he wrote this, just as it's not wrong that I, as a consumer gave it the full try and supported an alternative story
you know, like a fan of the character and compony might do
Have I enjoyed part of it, the first half or so sure
the conclusion not at all
if you did, good for you I'm glad, I'm also ok saying I didn't
Lesson learned for me is skip tom king from now on, why I haven't looked at the current crisis book
and my point about the opus was a simple one, and neither of us are in charge of creative so that's all cool too
Last edited by kilderkin; 11-15-2018 at 12:43 PM.
And that's totally cool that you didn't care for it. My post was in response to the part of your post that I put in bold. I wasn't disagreeing with your dislike, I was questioning the comment of "this is Superheroes not some opus" because that implies the story should have been dumbed down, or at least made simpler. Hence my question, "should comics not aspire to be something greater?" I won't lie & say I understood everything I just read, and I haven't even decided if I liked it or not; but attempting to be "an opus" is never a bad thing. Whether it was or not is up for debate, but attempting is never a negative.
"Darkseid...always hated music..."
Every post I make, it should be assumed by the reader that the following statement is attached: "It's all subjective. What works for me doesn't necessarily work for you, and vice versa, and that's ok. You may have a different opinion on it, but this is mine. That's the wonderful thing about being a comics fan, it's all subjective."
Okay fair enough
my point there was really to say that I felt the story imo tried to be more than it really was and in my view failed
I'm not saying comics can't be that, I'm saying that imo I felt king was trying to do something like that and failed in the ending here
Not to say that shouldn't be tried, just that in my view it did not succeed
of course that's just how I felt about it, and that was all I was saying
It wasn't meant about comics as a whole
Although I do think that sometimes trying to be an opus for example can be a mistake, sometimes a simple straight forward story is great and going beyond that is detrimental to a satisfactory book
But I'm not saying comics can't do that
Just that imo he tried to do that and at the last hurdle fell
Others will disagree with this and that's cool
Last edited by kilderkin; 11-15-2018 at 01:03 PM.
"We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
"All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
"There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord
Some more observations about issue 12. Funny to see some comedians make a cameo at the beginning. Looked like Scott Aukerman, Adam Scott, Jason Mantzoukas, Paul F. Thompkins, Paul Scheer, and I didn’t recognize the others. Obviously Dan Didio and Jim Lee laughing it up.
“ Shut the &$%# up Lightray!” cracked me up. Very reminiscent of Big Lebowski.
Loved that they named their daughter after Kirby’s wife.
You can always say the point of the book was asking if Mister Miracle could escape intentionally dying, which is a trap no one can escape from. The answer is: only if he wants to escape. Following his adventure for 12 issues was just showing what would happen if things played out a certain way in his life and the shoes were on the other foot.
His father died and his brother became king, he then became king himself, he had a son and the same circumstances that led to his own adoption came up and he rejected the notion of repeating it, he killed his own adoptive father to end the war. It shows the difficulties of being Higherfather and how they both reacted differently. Scott couldn't bring himself to abandon his son, despite millions and millions of lives depending on it, while Highfather did do it. Scott is a god who chooses to live in the mundane than being a higher lifeform. He could put a crown on his head and order universes to bow, but chooses to mow his grass and play with his son.
Last edited by whiterabbit; 11-15-2018 at 05:40 PM.
I wish I felt that message more strongly. I think that is a worthwhile message...but too many things work against that being what King is leaving us with. The issue of Barda - real or not? Eye color? The issue of why the victory over Darkseid is the penultimate, and not the final issue. The issue of whether he's dead or not.
"We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
"All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
"There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord
This, at least, is a pretty basic and simple answer. The purpose of the story wasn't setting up Scott vs Darkseid, it was Scott and whatever the world he was trying to escape/decided to stay in mess. A basic good guy vs bad guy story ends with the good guy winning and the bad guy losing. Regardless of how you felt about this tale, love or hate it, it wasn't a standard good guy vs bad guy fight.
Did Scott end up in a purgatory after a suicide attempt? Is he actually being mind%^$#ed by the Lump?
Or is this an actual end and nothing more will be said?
As seen in the Beat: http://www.comicsbeat.com/nycc-18-to...-fourth-world/
http://www.comicsbeat.com/nycc-2018-...otlight-panel/
Originally Posted by The Beat
I got the whole "Fourth World is what we're creating" - a very existentialist answer, and very Tom King-ian, based on his Green Lantern one-shot, and honestly most of what he's written.
Maybe part of the problem I've been fumbling to articulate is that when I finished Omega Men and Vision, I was emotionally shattered. In pain but loving it.
Here...I'm just kinda numb. And I feel like I felt before reading it, and I wanted to be changed.
"We're the same thing, you and I. We're both lies that eventually became the truth." Lara Notsil, Star Wars: X-Wing: Solo Command, Aaron Allston
"All that is not eternal is eternally out of date." C. S. Lewis, The Four Loves
"There's room in our line of work for hope, too." Stephanie Brown
Stephanie Brown Wiki, My Batman Universe Reviews, Stephanie Brown Discord
I just reread the last page. Now we know why Darkseid would be seen sitting in everyone's living rooms on the sofa.
He's ^%$#ing with their remotes.
He is an evil dude.