Scorsese explains why he thinks Marvel movies aren't cinema

[Beaddle]

Scorsese started his anti marvel rant a month ago, the aftermath is more interesting than what he saying about marvel. Its not even newsworthy that scorsese said marvel movies are not cinema, many other directors have said it. perhaps sometimes its the messenger that matters.

In one of his first rants, he called marvel theme parks, he was quickly hit with a question about sexism in his movies, which he shut down hard and fast, I think he knew and understood the press was trying to destroy him because of his marvel comments so they tried to paint him as a sexist.
https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-e...-a9178836.html



What happened next got more transparent, Bob Iger took a dig at him and made it about Ryan Coolger and Black Panther. Of all the 25 Marvel films he could mention Iger chose Black Panther as the example to prove Scorsese wrong. Had scorsese responded to black panther negatively he would be a called racist, the same way they tried to make him a sexist.

https://www.slashfilm.com/bob-iger-defends-marvel/
Scorsese played it wise here not to respond to the CEO of Disney comparing Black Panther to his movies. Again, we are seeing how the press likes to unnecessary start a sexist and racist war based on bs lies because there is no hard evidence out here Scorsese is a racist or a sexist but the media wanted to push that narrative all because he is not a fan of MCU movies.

[Beaddle]

He's not wrong. You have to look beyond theatres for quality flicks though, tons of material on streaming.

He is wrong that marvel movies are taking over cinema but why does he think that? because the press likes to hype up Marvel movies. Marvel makes 3 movies a year, there are more romantic comedies and action summer films than marvel or comic films in a year. DC , Sony and Fox combined. the only difference is a single MCU film can get 10x the hype than all the romantic comedies combined will get in a single year. Marvel movies have perfected the illusion of a cinema take over.

[Kirby101]

this is the guy that worked with Roger Corman, of all people, and gave us "Boxcar Bertha" long before he gave us "the Godfather"! so, maybe he should chill out a little bit. some of these franchise work-horses could end up becoming cinematic thoroughbreds later. and, even if they don't, it's not a problem. some artists will paint the Sistine Chapel and other artists will make really nicely done window curtains. it's okay. they can still show a love for their work, and a dedication to their craft either way.

Hate to nitpick, but Scorcese gave us "Goodfellas" Coppola gave us "The Godfather". He also started with Corman.

[Zero Hunter]

What is funny is these old men playing gatekeepers to what "real cinema" is are all forgetting the directors of the 40's through the 60's probably said the same things about them when they were in their heyday in the 70's and 80's. I'm sure to them all the sex, graphic violence and swearing was not "real cinema" at the time either and they just thought it was shock for shock sake. In every aspect of entertainment there comes a time when your are just out of touch because of your age and that is what these cranky old men are. Out of touch.

Plus blockbusters are the only thing keeping theaters alive. That is just the stone cold truth. It is not like if the blockbusters went away all the theaters would suddenly being showing "real" cinema. They would close down. The whole reason he had to go to Netflix in the first place was because no studio would back the Irishman because they knew people don't go and pay 15-20 bucks for movies like that anymore in the theaters when they can just watch it at home

[Beaddle]

What is funny is these old men playing gatekeepers to what "real cinema" is are all forgetting the directors of the 40's through the 60's probably said the same things about them when they were in their heyday in the 70's and 80's. I'm sure to them all the sex, graphic violence and swearing was not "real cinema" at the time either and they just thought it was shock for shock sake. In every aspect of entertainment there comes a time when your are just out of touch because of your age and that is what these cranky old men are. Out of touch.

I doubt directors in the 40s though 60s said the same thing. Scorsese is one of the rightful heirs of the golden age of Hollywood.

Plus blockbusters are the only thing keeping theaters alive. That is just the stone cold truth. It is not like if the blockbusters went away all the theaters would suddenly being showing "real" cinema. They would close down. The whole reason he had to go to Netflix in the first place was because no studio would back the Irishman because they knew people don't go and pay 15-20 bucks for movies like that anymore in the theaters when they can just watch it at home

Not many of these old men are directly against Blockbusters, they are against mindless CGI driven blockbusters that are clearly very manufactured. Scorsese used that word of manufacturing to describe marvel films. One of his closest friends is Speilberg, who is arguably the greatest blockbuster director of all time, challenged only by James Cameron but even those two have shown disdain for the comic book genre.Cameron doesn't like Marvel cinematic movies. Steven thinks they will die out like westerns.

[j9ac9k]

What is funny is these old men playing gatekeepers to what "real cinema" is are all forgetting the directors of the 40's through the 60's probably said the same things about them when they were in their heyday in the 70's and 80's.

Exactly. As I'm sure there are plenty of novelists who think all movies are garbage and contribute to the illiteracy of humankind.

[thwhtGuardian]

I doubt directors in the 40s though 60s said the same thing. Scorsese is one of the rightful heirs of the golden age of Hollywood.



Not many of these old men are directly against Blockbusters, they are against mindless CGI driven blockbusters that are clearly very manufactured. Scorsese used that word of manufacturing to describe marvel films. One of his closest friends is Speilberg, who is arguably the greatest blockbuster director of all time, challenged only by James Cameron but even those two have show disdain for the comic book genre.Cameron doesn't like Marvel cinematic movies. Steven thinks they will die out like westerns.

They did actually have disdain for newer films, and before them the directors of silent films were against talkies. It's cyclical.

[Rincewind]

I doubt directors in the 40s though 60s said the same thing. Scorsese is one of the rightful heirs of the golden age of Hollywood.



Not many of these old men are directly against Blockbusters, they are against mindless CGI driven blockbusters that are clearly very manufactured. Scorsese used that word of manufacturing to describe marvel films. One of his closest friends is Speilberg, who is arguably the greatest blockbuster director of all time, challenged only by James Cameron but even those two have shown disdain for the comic book genre.Cameron doesn't like Marvel cinematic movies. Steven thinks they will die out like westerns.

Harsh words from Spielberg: https://collider.com/steven-spielber...xy-james-gunn/

[Flash Gordon]

He is wrong that marvel movies are taking over cinema but why does he think that? because the press likes to hype up Marvel movies. Marvel makes 3 movies a year, there are more romantic comedies and action summer films than marvel or comic films in a year. DC , Sony and Fox combined. the only difference is a single MCU film can get 10x the hype than all the romantic comedies combined will get in a single year. Marvel movies have perfected the illusion of a cinema take over.

I mean, they are overtaking actual cinema structures. Disney is, 100%.

[H-E-D]

To me, any attempts to restrict what qualifies as art are wrong-headed. They tend to be based in a notion that something has to be good to be art, which is nonsense.

Uwe Boll's films are art. They're shitty art, but they're still art.

[wjowski]

Coppola supports Martin, calls Marvel despicable.



Ken Loach calls Marvel cynical



Marvel are more diet sodas Ken.

Coppola on the other hand can just shut his damn mouth. Godfather 3 was proof enough he's no stranger to doing it for the checks.

[Bloxer]

Harsh words from Spielberg: https://collider.com/steven-spielber...xy-james-gunn/

There is a difference between heroes and superheroes. The hero is an ordinary person who is faced with a serious fact and acts to modify it. A hero is a person who, walking down the street, see[s] a car on fire and runs [to] help the person who is in the driver’s seat, attached to the seat belt to loosen. [A] superhero is a person who, on the same scene, would fly to the car and try to turn it upside down and shake it using his super strength, until the driver is released. I identify more with the first example. Film[s of] everyday heroes.”

This will always sound incredibly ignorant and tone-deaf to me though, just saying superheroes are just idiots with powers and no common sense.

[Rincewind]

Coppola supports Martin, calls Marvel despicable.



Ken Loach calls Marvel cynical



Marvel are more diet sodas Ken.

Classic appeal to authority fallacy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority

[Blind Wedjat]

It's not Marvel's fault that:

- the financial risks in creating the MCU paid of in spades, and every other studio and franchise started copying them.

- in copying Marvel Studios, said other studios and franchise started flooding the market with soulless sequels, remakes and reboots and spinoffs.

- other studios began to heavily prioritise whatever big IP they had in favour of unique directorial visions to create their own shared universe.

- society favours capitalism and technological innovation, which created wider screen TV with smart user interfaces, higher surround sound setups and streaming services like Netflix, Hulu, Amazon, Cinemax, HBO Now, etc (the real cinema killers).

- technologically innovative and driven directors like Nolan and Cameron created the high demand for seeing big budget, CGI ladden, tentpole films in IMAX and 3D technologies, something smaller films do not use.

- ticket prices have steadily risen over the years (inflation).

- film piracy still exists.

- Hollywood has always chased whatever the latest trend was and has always sought to shell out (inferior) copies again and again.

- a lot of directors like Scorsese are one trick ponies in the sense that they can make only one type of film (i.e., a gritty drama) and these types of films can be viewed in the comfort of a home now thanks to advanced technology.

- many smaller films/film festival types don't even get to be released in cinemas until after the awards and festival circuit (this has always been a thing).

Everything Scorsese has been complaining about has always been in effect. It's the cycle of Hollywood. He's probably just now really feeling the pinch, and he's taking out on the one studio and franchise he can without burning bridges (because we damn well know Disney/Marvel would never hire Scorsese for anything.

[Rincewind]

It's not Marvel's fault that:

- the financial risks in creating the MCU paid of in spades, and every other studio and franchise started copying them.

- in copying Marvel Studios, said other studios and franchise started flooding the market with soulless sequels, remakes and reboots and spinoffs.

- other studios began to heavily prioritise whatever big IP they had in favour of unique directorial visions to create their own shared universe.

- society favours capitalism and technological innovation, which created wider screen TV with smart user interfaces, higher surround sound setups and streaming services like Netflix, Hulu, Amazon, Cinemax, HBO Now, etc (the real cinema killers).

- technologically innovative and driven directors like Nolan and Cameron created the high demand for seeing big budget, CGI ladden, tentpole films in IMAX and 3D technologies, something smaller films do not use.

- ticket prices have steadily risen over the years (inflation).

- film piracy still exists.

- Hollywood has always chased whatever the latest trend was and has always sought to shell out (inferior) copies again and again.

- a lot of directors like Scorsese are one trick ponies in the sense that they can make only one type of film (i.e., a gritty drama) and these types of films can be viewed in the comfort of a home now thanks to advanced technology.

- many smaller films/film festival types don't even get to be released in cinemas until after the awards and festival circuit (this has always been a thing).

Everything Scorsese has been complaining about has always been in effect. It's the cycle of Hollywood. He's probably just now really feeling the pinch, and he's taking out on the one studio and franchise he can without burning bridges (because we damn well know Disney/Marvel would never hire Scorsese for anything.

I think the biggest factor is that people choose to wait a few months to watch it at home on Blu Ray/Streaming/HBO/etc rather than see it at the theater. There are so many other options for entertainment that going to the movies is becoming less common. Going to the movies is becoming more like going to see a concert or live theater, a special event rather than the default option. The movies that get screens are the movies that people still show up for. And Marvel movies get people out of their houses and into the theaters. Putting MCU movies on fewer screens and indies on more screens doesn't mean that people will show up for the indies.