[Spoiler] Batman 77 Preview and Discussion thread

[millernumber1]

The majority of fans liking King's run are BarCat fans. Hope they get what they want but I doubt even if King promised a marriage and a happy ending it won't last that the reality of comics. And to support such a bad plot, pace and characterization just so that you see your pairing ship be canon is strange.

That's more than a little insulting to people who may like several things about King's run.

[GCWaters]

I wonder if it's personality driven? Different personality types enjoying certain things? I wasn't a huge fan of Morrison's run either. It started off ok but as it progressed I liked it less and less and ended up hating RIP. I'm not a Morrison guy but I like more of his work than King's. His Animal Man was pretty great. King did well on Sherriff of Babylon but that's the only thing he's written that I've liked.

Most likely....and writers change—I loved Snyder at the beginning, not so much at the end, and hated “Dark Knights Metal” and his JL run...

[Talon1load]

Most likely....and writers change—I loved Snyder at the beginning, not so much at the end, and hated “Dark Knights Metal” and his JL run...

100% agree about Metal and JL. Snyder tries to make everything too big.

[Fergus]

That's more than a little insulting to people who may like several things about King's run.

Curious miller, You've never been much of a batman fan. Always very vocal about how he's the least interesting and how you find the family more interesting. What's it about this run that you love so much?

[Coal Tiger]

The majority of fans liking King's run are BarCat fans. Hope they get what they want but I doubt even if King promised a marriage and a happy ending it won't last that the reality of comics. And to support such a bad plot, pace and characterization just so that you see your pairing ship be canon is strange.

What? I never wanted them to get married. Never thought they’d get married either.

[Starrius]

What? I never wanted them to get married. Never thought they’d get married either.

I want them to be married, but I want Selina to reform first.
I don't like Bruce marrying a woman that continues to steal.
I didn't like that Selina blew up a store and stole her wedding dress and King making the excuse for writing it "Well..Catwoman is a thief"
ummm...that's not all that she is
she has reformed in the past
she reformed in 1980s and became a crimefighter before being turned back to villain by the Joker with a mind machine

[Inversed]

The majority of fans liking King's run are BarCat fans. Hope they get what they want but I doubt even if King promised a marriage and a happy ending it won't last that the reality of comics. And to support such a bad plot, pace and characterization just so that you see your pairing ship be canon is strange.

Honestly I never really cared that much about Bat/Cat, besides a few select stories here and there, UNTIL King's book. Thought that by actually focusing on their relationship for an extended period of time allowed their chemistry to grow to a point where I believed they worked well together, while also weaving in the meta nature of their history throughout the decades.

Plus there's all the other little elements throughout I like about the book beyond just their pairing. While I get not liking the run, I do not understand the visceral amount of anger its received from some people. There's really nothing THAT shocking here.

[millernumber1]

Curious miller, You've never been much of a batman fan. Always very vocal about how he's the least interesting and how you find the family more interesting. What's it about this run that you love so much?

I mean, I made a whole thread about it.

[Talon1load]

Honestly I never really cared that much about Bat/Cat, besides a few select stories here and there, UNTIL King's book. Thought that by actually focusing on their relationship for an extended period of time allowed their chemistry to grow to a point where I believed they worked well together, while also weaving in the meta nature of their history throughout the decades.

Plus there's all the other little elements throughout I like about the book beyond just their pairing. While I get not liking the run, I do not understand the visceral amount of anger its received from some people. There's really nothing THAT shocking here.

King has shown zero chemistry between the two though. How, in your opinion, has he made their relationship better? Batman has become a manchild, Catwoman has become CatGOD and they haven't really shown any sort of real emotional substance. They have both changed for sure, just not in good ways, to me anyway.

[Ansa]

King made me go from absolutely neutral about batcat to strong dislike (at least for his version of them for sure).

[Mosameen]

That's more than a little insulting to people who may like several things about King's run.

Sorry, If that was insulting didn't mean to sound like that. But as I said there are people who like King's run for what it's and there are people how read for the BatCat pairing and a few of them that I know personally only care for the marriage and Helena and as long as they get what they promised they'll continue to support it. And keep in mind that King himself used the pairing to promote his run.

[Mr. White]

Why? What about it is appealing? Not arguing, just trying to understand. He has big ideas but his follow through is terrible. His dialogue is bad and repetitive. He sets up plots points and then either abandons or forgets about them. He doesn't seem to understand the majority of the characters he writes. He's appears to only have the one thing that he keeps going back to which is depression. What about this run is enjoyable?

Echoing T1L...
To those who enjoy/ "really like" King's run - What exactly do you like about it? Genuinely asking.
I for one have found his run to be underwhelming on the whole. Not sure it was a quality thing per say. Perhaps it was overhyped?
Truth be told I did enjoy some of the arcs e.g. Rooftops, Rules of Engagement and a couple of "smaller" stories.
But yeah I'm curious. I sometimes feel I'm missing something. Funnily enough had to re-read issue 75 to fully get what King was selling but while I "get it", I don't find it amazing or anything of the sort.
And before anyone says I hate King etc - I enjoyed his Vision, Sherrif of B and Mister Miracle...

[Scott Taylor]

Just a thought - but there is an entire thread dedicated to exactly that.

[Mr. White]

Just a thought - but there is an entire thread dedicated to exactly that.

Thanks for your invaluable contribution.

The question was actually directed to those who said (on this thread) that they are enjoying it.

Particularly those that have been reading for a number of decades.

Apologies that wasn't clear.

[millernumber1]

Thanks for your invaluable contribution.

The question was actually directed to those who said (on this thread) that they are enjoying it.

Particularly those that have been reading for a number of decades.

Apologies that wasn't clear.

I've been reading since 2004, and have done a lot of back-reading, though not much of the pre-Year One stuff.

The TL,DR version of why I love King's run:

For one of the first times since I started reading Batman, King has made me care about what Bruce wants. I care because it feels like he might end up in a different place than in Hush, or in Bruce Wayne, Murderer, or in Batman Inc, or the n52. All of which basically end by saying, "Batman cannot figure out how to balance a long term serious relationship with his mission."

And that does sound an awful lot like I just care about Bat/Cat. But if you look at Detective Comics #1000, "Batman's Greatest Case" - that, I think, is the mission statement for King's Batman. It's not all about Bat/Cat. It's about Batman finding a certain measure of contentment with the family he's found after his parents were taken away. It doesn't end with Batman alone - it ends with him saying, "Cheese."

And yes, it's kinda cheesy. And I would never argue that it's flawless. But Batman finding that contentment while still being able to be Batman is really exciting for me.

(There's also a lot about King's style - the setups and payoffs, the poetic style, the interpretive gaps - that appeal to me. But that's about all of his writing in general, not just Batman.)