Loki Appreciation 2019

[Rosebunse]

It was ok. But Loki is not as smart than before.

He does seem a bit less clever, but then again, he hasn't actually had the time to do much. And I think some of his behavior is partially coming from his own depression and the uncertainty. He probably shouldn't have followed the mysterious figure, but at that point, he wasn't only curious, but in desperate need of escaping what Thor has laid out for him.

Also, it occurs to me that Thor having a role for Loki and expecting him to follow it, even if it's partially for his own protection, really puts Thor in Odin's spot and really puts Loki in Thor's spot.

Raye, good point about the dangers to Loki's romantic LI, but that could be extended to his other relationships too, like what he has with Drrf and Thor.

[Raye]

It's not the taking of the deal that makes him look less smart, i can get that, since he was kind of out of options. It's the talk about the casino with Tony Stark, none of that made sense for a character as smart as Loki is supposed to be. He should have known damn well that wasn't Tony's casino, and he should have also known that destroying it wouldn't win him any good guy points in Tony's eyes, ESPECIALLY if it was Tony's casino.

But the rest of it, I liked. But yeah, he didn't come off as smart as he should in places. I get that writing a character that is supposed to be smarter than you is difficult, but at least try to not make him look stupid.

As for the time travel stuff, I know i am probably getting ahead of myself on how it works, based on a few words. but, assuming it works the way I am describing, then yes it could risk his relationship with Thor as well, but not to the same extent, since Thor is the same age as Loki, slightly older, actually, so it would be absolutely impossible for Loki to actually erase him from existence, since Loki can not go back further than his own age, and they are going to be brothers no matter what. But it can mean something happens that results in Thor being killed or something at some point after that, yeah.

I enjoyed issue 2. I liked the interaction between Loki and Tony. I thought Loki did a good job of outsmarting Tony, but throwing Thor's name in there. Tony calmed down, even though he didn't fully believe Loki. And Loki's comment about Tony naming his new car ANVL. Classic. And Tony getting flustered about the name and that Loki could see it was a bad idea.

Okay, so Nightmare escaped and found Loki. Does Loki realize that and just playing coy, or does he not have a clue?

I mean the owl may have been a clue he should have caught, but then again, he may not know Nightmare uses them as his eyes. As far as I know, Loki's first real encounter with him was in Journey Into Mystery, so it's not like he knows him and his tactics super well. And even if he did, Nightmare used owls to spy from his own realm, so it being out there doesn't necessarily mean he's out walking the world making nightmares a reality, you know?

Yeah, Thor still doesn't understand Loki, and the depths of his soul. And you can see how Loki is frustrated and stressed over it. That was a great page seeing some of the highlights from his past. And his possible future. Curious.

So who are those two at the end? And yeah what is that house? What do they know about time. And was one of them the one that brought Loki to the house?

No UnFather this issue, but hope he's mentioned next issue. Thought this was well done and adds to the story and intrigue.

I presume based on their appearance and what happened just prior to that page, that those are the Children of Eternity (or was it Eternity's Children? whatever, same difference) from the solicits. And contrary to my first thought when i saw that name, that they are LITERALLY Eternity's children. So Loki is face to face with the children of the personification of the universe, pretty much, the next to most powerful entity in the universe. Pretty sure these kids are not to be trifled with, they're likely nigh omnipotent, way above Loki's weightclass. they'd be to Loki what Loki is to a baseline human. Why they are directing their attention towards him is the real question. I am assuming the mysterious UnFather is part of the answer to that. Eternity does have children already in continuity, but I don't know which of them these would be, or if they are new ones. They are a bit like the Endless, they are personifications of concepts, but where the Endless all have 'D' names, Eternity's children all have 'E' names. so you have like Empathy, Eon, Epiphany etc. and now that I think about it, Entropy is one of his children. and there is a lot of talk of entropy in the King Thor stuff. So Entropy may be the UnFather. If Entropy kills his father, the universe ends. But then from the void, a new universe is created, and Entropy becomes the new Eternity. It's a cycle.

Interestingly though, one of the early stories to feature Eternity had him being kidnapped.... by Nightmare.

And the House of Ideas was first introduced in Avengers: No Road Home. It's a very Eternity kind of place, so it makes sense for them to be there. It's kind of the sum of the entire MU and all the stories it is made up of, and you can tap into the raw story essence of the MU inside it. Though the series had 3 co-writers, one of them was Al Ewing, and it was very clearly primarily his creation, and it very much felt like something he had originally intended for God of Stories Loki, so it's kind of fitting that it is being used here.

I'm rereading it now, and here's a stupid question about that flashback: when, exactly, had he been a "fancy cowboy"? Did I miss something?

It hasn't happened yet, or at least, it hasn't been shown in the comics yet. From the sounds of it it will likely happen in issue 5. Presumably a flashback or one of his first time hops.


Anyway, turns out there are some pretty big MCU Loki rumors floating around. From the sounds of it, the Loki Disney+ series feeds directly into the next Thor movie, in that it is Loki that brings Mjolnir from the other timeline so that Jane can get her Thor on, and he will then go on to be in Love and Thunder as well, and be re-introduced to the main MCU timeline:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=If1WhAzewJU

[Prof. Aegis]

I'm going off the fact that he's a little rattled right now due to dying, coming back to life, becoming king, being seen as a hero, having Thor treat him as an equal, but also feeling like he's lost himself and not sure who he really is or is supposed to be. So he's grasping at straws, so to speak, and a little off his game. Plus, the whole casino thing, I wonder if Loki isn't letting additional info out and if he knew more than he was saying to get Tony thinking about it. It just seems odd for him to not know it wasn't Stark's as well.

Loki has gone through a lot in a short time and his entire life has just shifted. Partially to what he wants, but also to this unknown scary place of possible happiness that he doesn't understand and is afraid that his life won't amount to anything important. Thor seems to see it as a good thing, but Loki see it as a bland life devoid of purpose.

Yeah, I do see this whole House if Ideas and the children of Eternity as being something very big and having a profound effect on Loki. This isn't something small. But I do wonder what they Book of Loki has in it that they feel are lies or where that book actually came from. Or perhaps the CoE (Children of Eternity) are trying to show Loki that his life isn't written yet and that he can still create it as he wants. Which would open up stories all over as even alternative stories or the current King Thor storyline doesn't have to be set in stone.

I didn't read that Avenger story. Was anything established in that story about the House? What it can do or it's purpose?

And I'm not only happy to see Loki being in the future Thor movie, but in seeing that his series will have an impact on the movie as well. It puts some weight behind the series as it should have great repercussions for Thor. According to what I read on CBR, this series has been in the works before the Infinity War movie came out. So it's been in the planning and development stages for some time, which is good.

[Rosebunse]

Loki was very drunk for some of his time at the casino. Who knows what that has to do with it.

https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/House_of_Ideas

This is what I found. It's the house of the One-Above-All, so it's basically the writer's brain? This could get weird. But with this in mind, it actually makes perfect sense for why these people would be interested in the former God of Stories. In fact, Loki's powers actually make him uniquely able to take advantage of it in a way that even Eternity can't. That being said, Loki isn't in the same class as Eternity. He doesn't have the raw strength and while I'm sure he could figure out a way out of this if it's a trap, if he's off his game, then that becomes much more difficult. I mean, Loki did survive the Incursions, while Eternity did not, but that was because of his unique place in the MU.

In fact, I wouldn't actually say that Loki is under Eternity so much as he's just in a different class altogether. It's like comparing apples and oranges.

[Raye]

Yeah, it might be that he is trying to feed Tony some information, like he did with feeding Cap the information to win against the Celestials. I'm not sure to what end, though, if that's the case.

(And I don't think he was THAT drunk. He still clearly had a plan being there, one which was presumably formed before entering the casino. He went there trying to cause damage, and he did.)


The House of Ideas is... difficult to sum up. It's a nebulous kind of place and the rules of it are not very concrete, it's only appeared in one or two other issues so far. But basically, it's kind of the place where ideas and stories are created. If the universe is the stage, and the characters/people the actors, the House of Ideas is the writer crafting their stories. And if you are IN the house, you can tap into that, anything you imagine can be made real. It is the heart of the MU. Presumably gods that dealt with Fate, like the Norns, tapped into it's power, but it is bigger than just those gods of fate, which is presumably why killing the Norns wasn't enough to break Loki's fate. Loki is in a place of immense power right now, basically. Possibly the most powerful place in the entire universe. It's also very meta.



Also, there's mention of entropy again:


I don't think Loki was EVER the God of Stories. he TRIED to become that, he may have thought he was for a little while, but it never took. Because he was never in a position to make that call. But he may have been able to tap into the power of the House of Ideas right at the end there, for a little while, as reality was coming apart at the seams. And he has edited stories before, with Cul and Leah. so yeah, he's kind of tapped into it's power before, at least, while others haven't.

Eternity did not survive the incursions because he is linked to the universe, if the universe ends he ends, and vice versa. as long as the universe exists, he is immensely more powerful than Loki, there's no comparison, Loki is an ant to him.

and yeah, this news definitely made me more interested to see the show, and I was already gonna watch the thing! Very curious to see how he ends up back in the main MCU, and what he's like by the time he gets there.

[Rosebunse]

Loki did go into the casino with a plan, only to seemingly get distracted and not finish things...I think...

I'm not sure Loki can really be called an ant to Eternity, not anymore. Because he survived the Incursions and Eternity didn't. He is in theory able to pull himself from Eternity all together. And depending on what this new power is, he could have real control over Eternity.

Damn, thinking about it, Marvel really needs to do something with Eternity.

[Raye]

Loki never got distracted. Read the captions, he's all like 'that is probably enough damage' and is about to escape because goals accomplished, before he tripped and got bowled over by Armadillo. He wasn't just partying it up for the hell of it because he got distracted, he was cheating at craps in order to draw enough attention to himself that he could initiate a fight with the muscle that would trash the place, and presumably draw the attention of the authorities in the process. That was the plan, and it went smoothly until he tripped. And it was implied that tripping was not because he was drunk, it was the cost paid for changing the perfume into venom, because apparently when he's on Earth, he has to abide by the whole 'magic has a cost' thing. When Thor said he must be drunker than he looked, that was just because Loki didn't remember sending Thor a message, so Thor assumed he had forgotten sending it, so he must have been super drunk, in Thor's line of thinking. Except Loki really didn't send a message, he didn't forget anything, so Thor thought he was drunker than he actually was. Yeah, he'd been drinking, but not to the point of like, blackout or even slurring his words, judging by the dialogue. And he was agile and coordinated enough to dodge most of Armadillo's attacks until that cord tripped him up.

I think it is a real stretch to say he could have control over Eternity just because he was able to escape to the whitespace when things were falling apart. Gwenpool goes to the whitespace on the regular, and not like she's considered particularly powerful in the cosmic order sense. The only beings ranked above Eternity on the power scale are the Living Tribunal, the Beyonder, and the One Above All. He's stupid powerful. But I don't think Loki is going to be fighting him, in any case. but he'd be foolish if he took the encounter lightly, even if these are jsut the children of Eternity rather than Eternity himself.

And Marvel has been doing quite a bit with Eternity, actually. Where do you think all those kids came from? most of them were created in the 2000's. and he was in Ewing's Ultimates. It's just that he's one of those characters that just kinda pops up here and there...

[Prof. Aegis]

Okay, the House of Ideas makes more sense now. And I can see the power it can hold and yield for Loki. However, the question to me is, why would Eternity's children care about Loki and why would they contact him and want to give him access to it? What's in it for them? There must be some goal they have as well for wanting Loki or wanting to give him that power.

[rpmaluki]

I don't think Loki is in the same league as Eternity but with Loki surviving the Incursions, I treat that as a sort of rock-paper-scissors situation. No way the paper is stronger than a rock but in a particular circumstance, the paper has an advantage over the rock, if that makes sense. Loki had an advantage that saw him survive where many stronger than him didn't due to his peculiar power set.

I enjoyed #2 and am so impatient to see what this whole House of Ideas is leading to.

[Rosebunse]

I don't think Loki is in the same league as Eternity but with Loki surviving the Incursions, I treat that as a sort of rock-paper-scissors situation. No way the paper is stronger than a rock but in a particular circumstance, the paper has an advantage over the rock, if that makes sense. Loki had an advantage that saw him survive where many stinger than him didn't due to his peculiar power set.

I enjoyed #2 and am so impatient to see what this whole House of Ideas is leading to.

This is what I meant! Thank you!

And this is why I think the Children of Eternity are interested in him. Yes, Eternity is stronger than Loki, sure, but Loki has a unique perspective snd power which would make him quite interesting for beings like these.

And it actually does make sense for them to come for him now. He has no grander scheme to work on and he's depressed from that stuff about the book of Loki.

Which leads me to wonder, whay if the Children wrote that book and left it for Thor to find? What if it isn't actually Loki's book at all?

[Raye]

Okay, the House of Ideas makes more sense now. And I can see the power it can hold and yield for Loki. However, the question to me is, why would Eternity's children care about Loki and why would they contact him and want to give him access to it? What's in it for them? There must be some goal they have as well for wanting Loki or wanting to give him that power.

Right, like i said, why they are directing their attention to him is the real question. the whole power levels thing wasn't to pose the question of if he could beat Eternity, it was to illustrate the significance of Eternity/his children approaching Loki in the first place. Eternity has approached mortals and gods that wouldn't normally be on his radar (remember, we are talking the personification of the entire universe, Loki may be a big deal on Earth, but there are MILLIONS of pantheons, let alone individual gods in the universe, and Loki is just one of many, nothing too special about him relative to the other gods. We see primarily Earth-centered stories in the comics, but that doesn't mean the rest of the universe doesn't matter, or have compelling stories and characters that are happening off-panel) but typically only in the most dire of circumstances, so for him to approach Loki poses a lot of questions.

oh edited to add - So looks like the Avengers are going to space, to find the new Star Brand, right? well, Kibblesmith said something in a tweet about the Kree, which will presumably be coming into play in Loki from issue 5 or 6 onward. Though Loki was not on the cover for Avengers, given Loki's request to join the team, and the fact that it looks like they will both be out in space, could it be they may end up working together? Granted, 'space' is a very big place, and we don't know if the Avengers will be coming into contact with the Kree at all... (Shi'ar, yes, Brood, yes, Kree, unknown) they could be at opposite ends of the galaxy. but... still... the timing. Also, there was that teas in the FCBD issue with a Brood-ified Thor, so... he may need his brother's help.

[Raye]

remember we were discussing his musical tastes a littel while ago? Well, Kiibblesmith made a playlist: https://twitter.com/kibblesmith/stat...07359572037632

It's got Mastodon, so **** yeah to that. but I think it needs more Queen and Avatar.

*edit - he added Queen for me.

[Rosebunse]

I love me some Mountain Goats, so I'm a happy camper. Loki needs to get a love interest and break up with them so that No Children can go on that playlist!

And people need to be nice to Drrf!

I don't think it's that odd that Eternity would seek Loki out. Loki isn't an ant. Yes, there are tons of pantheons in the universe, but Earth is special and Loki is a pretty unique god.

[lordozone]

I love me some Mountain Goats, so I'm a happy camper. Loki needs to get a love interest and break up with them so that No Children can go on that playlist!

And people need to be nice to Drrf!

I don't think it's that odd that Eternity would seek Loki out. Loki isn't an ant. Yes, there are tons of pantheons in the universe, but Earth is special and Loki is a pretty unique god.

It's time for characters like Loki (or Hercules) to have male love interests: a lot of the pagan gods are pansexual in their story, and even in comics it was hinted that Loki and Hercules are interested by both sex. If they are well written (contrary to Iceman) it will not change them to be bisexuals.

[Rosebunse]

It's time for characters like Loki (or Hercules) to have male love interests: a lot of the pagan gods are pansexual in their story, and even in comics it was hinted that Loki and Hercules are interested by both sex. If they are well written (contrary to Iceman) it will not change them to be bisexuals.

Yeah, he needs a male LI. We just don't know who it could be. That being said, I'm really happy that they aren't just dumping an LI on us. We're building up to it.