Thoughts on the current run?

[Grey]

Seems like a weird alternate dimension to me. Ready for more “regular” books.

[Lapsus]

You read a Spider-Man story, you know that Spider-Man is not getting killed. Does that mean it's impossible to enjoy the stories?

Thats the point, i dont need that someone would assure me that Spider or half of the cast is inmortal at the begining of the story is not necessary.

You know that the good guys are going to win in this type of story, do you need that the author will tell that the hero is invencible ?? Is not going to change anything, he is going to win anyway but you at least wants the illusion of the struggle.

[jwatson]

Thats the point, i dont need that someone would assure me that Spider or half of the cast is inmortal at the begining of the story is not necessary.

You know that the good guys are going to win in this type of story, do you need that the author will tell that the hero is invencible ?? Is not going to change anything, he is going to win anyway but you at least wants the illusion of the struggle.

I don't associate death with struggle I associate it with finality. So it doesn't do much at all to enhance a story for me personally. Especially in a universe where nothing is final.

[Omega Alpha]

Will go back an read everyone else's thoughts in a second, but for me my issue(s) with this run is:

Retconned way too much. I feel like just about everything established here could have been done without changing Moira, Xavier or anything else. Anyone could have found Krakoa and established all of this in the months that have been skipped over.

No, it was absolutely impossible to do this without the retcon about Moira in HoX #2 because without it, you don't get PoX #6, which changes permanently the overlook of the franchise, and what's really about, not to mention you have someone that has seen with her own eyes that Xavier's dream, as well as Apocalypse and Magneto's ideologies, are destined to complete failure.

The deaths. I don't care how anyone else interprets it but to me these resurrections are a bunch of copies.
.

You, and anyone else that has this view, are being absolutely childish. Every Marvel hero (apart from Colossus) was murdered in the first Secret Wars by Dr. Doom. By your way of thinking, Spider-Man, Wolverine, Cyclops, etc, are all copies since then. And all the heroes that died in Infinity Gauntlet. Or Hickman's Secret Wars. Or the 100 different events in which they died. Hell, one can make a case that anyone that teleported once already died and is just a copy of the original.

[Zelena]

I don't associate death with struggle I associate it with finality. So it doesn't do much at all to enhance a story for me personally. Especially in a universe where nothing is final.

Not for me. Struggle to avoid death. Struggle to live with loss. The finality is the end of the story, nothing more to say: "they lived happily ever after…" Isn't it the case? Aren't they happy now?

[jwatson]

Not for me. Struggle to avoid death. Struggle to live with loss. The finality is the end of the story, nothing more to say: "they lived happily ever after…" Isn't it the case? Aren't they happy now?

Not really Storm seemed pretty unhappy other mutants were suffering and unable to find peace. Kitty too. I'm more interested in the actual journey and death has never really had an effect on me in stories. Maybe because i've never seen one stick for a character i was following. Jean came back after phoenix, Storm didn't really die and was a child. I can seperate myself as a reader and my emotion from what the character emotion is. But i can also see how someone can be all flippant about "well why can't i kill one person from this race." With no big story to back up why. I honestly can't think of one situation where a character died in the marvel u where t had some real impact. But that may be a personal issue.

Heck most of us knew it was only a matter of time before Cyclops came back. When my dad died after years of suffering i couldn't feel bad because he suffered for years and i like to believe he found peace. I never once was sad he was dead, i was sad we didn't say more things to each other before it was over.

[spirit2011]

Not for me. Struggle to avoid death. Struggle to live with loss. The finality is the end of the story, nothing more to say: "they lived happily ever after…" Isn't it the case? Aren't they happy now?

Not forever... that is what they want to achieve

[Kisinith]

is that hard to make an editorial mandate of not killing important characters that are not mean to stay dead??

Your story is going to be ruined because you dont have the liberty of killing nightcrawler in the most stupid way??

It is beyond me, huge decisions afecting the fate of important characters should be decided by Marvel itself.

If you need to kill half of the roster of the avengers go to an AU

The problem is that Marvel has, for a long time now, not been using editorial oversight to prevent these kind of issues. Characterization has been wildly different on the same character appearing in multiple books at the same time. The X-line, more than perhaps any other in Marvel, has been dragged down into this depressing morass of death, destruction and line wide deconstruction. His overarching goal is to reverse this trend the resurrection 5 are a plot device that achieves 2 things.

First it, almost instantly fixes all of the toys in the toy box. Years of misery, cheap deaths and line wide deconstruction snapped away.
Second its a narrative club to metaphorically beat marvel editorial and the other writers with until they get out the habit of cheap pointless deaths to sell mediocre drama.

Its not gonna last forever but hopefully it lasts long enough to break the miserable cycle the X-line has been mired in.

[Kitty&Piotr<3]

It's fine. The Moira thing was really inventive, as is the hold the X-Men have over the world community with the the drugs. Cool setups.

As far as the individual characters...oof. His Magneto is how I like my Magneto, I think, but besides him..eeehhhhhhh.

All-in-all: it's fine. I'm super anxious to get more of the stuff from the non-main writers. I think Marauders will be great when the narrative really kicks in. I'll probably pick up Adjectiveless intermittently.

Let's see what the other writers are cooking up.


Also: people mad about poly are silly, with the main reason being that it ain't happening. Unless you count the stereotypical male fantasy of a guy being with two women, which is where my wager remains on the poly mystery.

[ermac]

I believe bringing one of the best writers of lately to helm the franchise was definitely a good decision for Marvel. I am a fan of Hickman's writing on his previous Marvel projects and on East of West. The idea of having a very talented writer/editor can be very beneficial for the cohesion of the line, which was a weak point I guess since Claremont left.

Having said that, regarding the specifics of Hickman's vision, there are a lot of good decisions:

- Refurbishing the few plot points that worked lately in a new fashion (Utopia is now Krakoa, a fluid roster, Xavier and Magneto working together, the Machine vs Mutants etc)

- The effort to bring back and rehabilitate characters without forgetting some new additions as X23 or Trinary

- Enough with the genocide and letting the X-Men have some wins

- New exciting possibilities with the X-Men Illuminati (I mean, Quiet Council) and geopolitics of Krakoa

BUT... some things didn't click for me.

- The Moira retcon. I like the idea that Xavier and Magneto had backstage communications the whole time. But the way Hickman took us there, which was turning the most proeminent human ally to a whole different character, with an overpowered gimick that doesn't make much sense... I'm not sure I bought that decision. Also, I couldn't bring myself to care about any of her X^2shit lives.

- Some voices were REALLY off. Not only Pyro or whatever, I'm talking about pinnacles of the franchise such as Scott and Ororo. If this means the undoing of past character arcs such as Utopiaclops and Jeansus, I don't think it's worthy. Getting those voices wrong is a deal breaker for a X-writer for me.

- The teams selected for the first wave of books. I get the feeling the interpersonal dynamics (which is the strongest point of X-Men for me) is taking a back seat for plot and writers' preference. I hope they prove me wrong.

On a overall note, I think the franchise is better than last years. But isn't nearly as good as it was sold to us (nowhere good as Morrison's or Claremont's, for example). I still trust Hickman and the good team of writers can deliver tho. Just hope they focus more for the characters and less on the sci-fi element.

[jwatson]

I believe bringing one of the best writers of lately to helm the franchise was definitely a good decision for Marvel. I am a fan of Hickman's writing on his previous Marvel projects and on East of West. The idea of having a very talented writer/editor can be very beneficial for the cohesion of the line, which was a weak point I guess since Claremont left.

Having said that, regarding the specifics of Hickman's vision, there are a lot of good decisions:

- Refurbishing the few plot points that worked lately in a new fashion (Utopia is now Krakoa, a fluid roster, Xavier and Magneto working together, the Machine vs Mutants etc)

- The effort to bring back and rehabilitate characters without forgetting some new additions as X23 or Trinary

- Enough with the genocide and letting the X-Men have some wins

- New exciting possibilities with the X-Men Illuminati (I mean, Quiet Council) and geopolitics of Krakoa

BUT... some things didn't click for me.

- The Moira retcon. I like the idea that Xavier and Magneto had backstage communications the whole time. But the way Hickman took us there, which was turning the most proeminent human ally to a whole different character, with an overpowered gimick that doesn't make much sense... I'm not sure I bought that decision. Also, I couldn't bring myself to care about any of her X^2shit lives.

- Some voices were REALLY off. Not only Pyro or whatever, I'm talking about pinnacles of the franchise such as Scott and Ororo. If this means the undoing of past character arcs such as Utopiaclops and Jeansus, I don't think it's worthy. Getting those voices wrong is a deal breaker for a X-writer for me.

- The teams selected for the first wave of books. I get the feeling the interpersonal dynamics (which is the strongest point of X-Men for me) is taking a back seat for plot and writers' preference. I hope they prove me wrong.

On a overall note, I think the franchise is better than last years. But isn't nearly as good as it was sold to us (nowhere good as Morrison's or Claremont's, for example). I still trust Hickman and the good team of writers can deliver tho. Just hope they focus more for the characters and less on the sci-fi element.

i swear i must be the only person that didn't think morrison run was that good. He came in and created his own world using mutants he liked but it didn't feel like xmen to me. Then the books that played on that i found boring and if they werent boring the team members were. I just don't get the morrison hype.

[LordUltimus]

i swear i must be the only person that didn't think morrison run was that good. He came in and created his own world using mutants he liked but it didn't feel like xmen to me. Then the books that played on that i found boring and if they werent boring the team members were. I just don't get the morrison hype.

I've seen people complain about Morrison's run myself. They point out Genosha getting wiped out as the start of the "mutant genocides that no one tells the other writing groups about so they can't talk about it, only for the X-Men to call them out on never talking about it", especially since Morrison made a point to not reference the rest of the MU at all during that run.

[jwatson]

I've seen people complain about Morrison's run myself. They point out Genosha getting wiped out as the start of the "mutant genocides that no one tells the other writing groups about so they can't talk about it, only for the X-Men to call them out on never talking about it", especially since Morrison made a point to not reference the rest of the MU at all during that run.

i can actually see and understand that point. It was the biggest single moment wipe out of mutants in the marvel u and he had no one else react to it. His run was a bunch of new characters with no history sprinkled in it. Thats' why i don't say much when people mention his run. He came in an told a mutant story but not an x-men story. Xtreme xmen was FAR better in my opinion. I remember being happy the group in the X-treme run didn't have to deal with the main story.

I mean it was a well told original story but the world was more his than the mutants finding their way and changing the world themselves.

[spirit2011]

I've seen people complain about Morrison's run myself. They point out Genosha getting wiped out as the start of the "mutant genocides that no one tells the other writing groups about so they can't talk about it, only for the X-Men to call them out on never talking about it", especially since Morrison made a point to not reference the rest of the MU at all during that run.

This is a massive problem. We don't see the reaction but then x-men come to avenges complaining.
Since then we had more 2 genocides. Terrible

[tuck frump]

We dont see the reaxtion because there was no reaction. Its canon that the Avengers didnt show up even after Genosha was wiped out. Whats there to show?