T'Challa: Black Panther Appreciation 2018

[XPac]

What I'm suggesting has nothing with this though. In fact, it's the opposite. Streamlining T'Challa base gear in his suit allows him to not allow him to pull out a gadget or new suit just to take out a higher level threat. It's what you are suggesting that leads to this: That T'Challa needs to have a different suit to deal with other level threats.

The thrice blessed armour is a redundant addition to T'Challa's gear that has no use that his suit can't have without overcompensating. This is the same issue Batman (that you bring up) that had recently that is a problem. Compare these two instances of Batman confronting Darkseid: When he bargains to rescue Supergirl and when he confronts him in the forged Hellbat armour.

The first instance, Batman only wears additional Apokaliptian armour and he uses his brains and a well played bargain to win against Darkseid




This is what Batman is about. Being the human underdog everyone underestimates but has the will and brain to do whatever it takes to win.

Batman in the Hellbat armour that's forged by the entire Justice League and can beat them all (having most of their abilities) and can also beat Darkseid is not what Batman is about in my opinion. This is the kind of thing Tony Stark would do, and why I'm generally against T'Challa having any additional sort of armour.

And just to finalise: Black Panther is not Batman, nor does he need to be restricted in that idea of being like Batman. Batman is a regular human, a street vigilante (who is good enough to be a league member) and a detective. T'Challa is a king of the most technologically advanced human nation on earth, is an enhanced warrior trained from birth, and is the avatar of the god of his people. That alone puts him above what Batman is defined as. There's no reason why T'Challa at his base level shouldn't be handling more powerful threats with a combination of his superior intellect, his enhanced stats, his almost unparalleled skills, and his access to some of the best technological innovations on Earth. That's who he is.

Yes what I am suggesting is that he has different gear and suits for different threat levels. Again, from a meta standpoint that's just practical.

As is, T'Challa can be used in a relatively wide range of stories. It makes him a far more versatile character because he can scale up or down as needed logically, without jobbing or plot armor. Restrict him to his absolute best, and it creates several problems storytelling wise. Firstly it requires every single opponent he faces to be equal to or superior to his best. Every single one. Because the point isn't to make it easier for the hero... if anything it's the reverse. And secondly, it means the types of stories he fits in are greatly diminished.

He's MUCH better off having the ability to adopt and adjust his power levels according to the treat level. That means he can fit into most stories against opponents who are credible threats in a believable fashion.

[hbky2j]

You think T'Chadwick will meet MCU Bast?

Or that a completely revamped/reworked KotD will make it's way to the MCU in a later BP or Avengers (secret wars?) movie?

what could have been a cool way to bring in the "KotD" power set in The MCU and give T'challa a big moment in Infinity War would have been

At then end sequence when Thanos Invades wakanda and The Avengers charge him have black panther run and pounce at Thanos get suspended in midair with telekinesis using The Realty Stone from infinity gauntlet while Thanos is slapping around the other Avengers T'Challa's suit absorbs the energy from The Realty Stone T'Challa's free but not just free but newly powered form The Infinity Stone because T'Challa enhanced by the "Vibranium" enriched heart shaped herb (something like the youtube link)
2:40


anyway back to the end sequence T'Challa's materialize the "Sprite Spear" throw's it at Thanos have him use vison's phasing intangibility power but the spear still hurt's Thanos because it hurt the "spirit" and not the physical being ...setting up Thor to come in just like the movie originally ended

this would have gave T'Challa his big moment he never got and set up "King of The Dead" power set triggered by an Infinty Stone and ( I mean if vision can handle/House The Mind Stone because of his "Vibranium" body then T'Challa should at lest be able to channel Infinity stone energy because his body is basically Vibranium enhanced ) this can be explained/explored in Black Panther 2

[Redjack]

[Ezyo1000]

@Blind

I agree with you with the villains except: Namor and Doom should NOT have superior tech to T'Challa. Equal or slightly lesser yes, but the advanced nation on Earth needs to be the most advanced nation on Earth in more then name only. Doom can have the edge in magical might and Namor in physical might. Tech abd martial arts should go to T'Challa. Period

I don't disagree the force push isn't a natural upgrade. It makes perfect sense. That's why I'm not arguing it should be disgarded... rather I'm simply saying it shouldn't be used all the time since that effectively means anyone below Namor level is no longer a physical threat. Which basially eliminated his entire rogues gallery, including Klaw since he's weak against vibranium. The point of upgrades shouldn't be to make things easier for the hero since no writer actually wants that.

I'm not arguing to dumb down T'Challa... merely suggesting that his gear reflects the power level he's facing. This allows him to deal with a variety of threat levels, from street level to cosmic, and overall makes him a more usable character. By establishing that he can take take damage by Namor level beings, you significantly neuter that.

Regardless of what your suggesting, that's exactly what happens. Writer's get lazy and the tech disappears. Again why dumb T'Challa down when you can raise his rogues up? His gear doesn't need to go up or down depending on the threat. That's not what Priest did, that's not what Hudlin tried to do (though the armor unfortunately did this) and for the most part didn't do. It's a boring and unimaginative way to do things and makes for inconsistent power levels on top of what Wedjat said with plot convenience and the hero being unprepared. That's arguably what happened to Tchalla in power against Doom.

T'Challa is plenty useable and the force push if anything adds to his power set without actually making Street level unusable

[Cville]

Awesomesause. He chased that truck like T-1000 in Terminator 2. Lol

[Rumble]

what could have been a cool way to bring in the "KotD" power set in The MCU and give T'challa a big moment in Infinity War would have been

At then end sequence when Thanos Invades wakanda and The Avengers charge him have black panther run and pounce at Thanos get suspended in midair with telekinesis using The Realty Stone from infinity gauntlet while Thanos is slapping around the other Avengers T'Challa's suit absorbs the energy from The Realty Stone T'Challa's free but not just free but newly powered form The Infinity Stone because T'Challa enhanced by the "Vibranium" enriched heart shaped herb (something like the youtube link)
2:40


anyway back to the end sequence T'Challa's materialize the "Sprite Spear" throw's it at Thanos have him use vison's phasing intangibility power but the spear still hurt's Thanos because it hurt the "spirit" and not the physical being ...setting up Thor to come in just like the movie originally ended

this would have gave T'Challa his big moment he never got and set up "King of The Dead" power set triggered by an Infinty Stone and ( I mean if vision can handle/House The Mind Stone because of his "Vibranium" body then T'Challa should at lest be able to channel Infinity stone energy because his body is basically Vibranium enhanced ) this can be explained/explored in Black Panther 2

Good idea. If they could do it again (or depending on what these reshoots for A4 entail), i think between the spirit realm, the ancestral plane, infinity gauntlet (soul stone/reality stone) and the dues ex machina of vibranium, there's a story somewhere to be told about KotD. Perhaps not too different from what you said.

I'd still prefer it came directly from Bast if it could be helped or, like Blind Wedjat said, a natural progression/self-discovery by BP that his abilities/powers/attributes are naturally evolving.

But if a catalyst were needed for a power upgrade, i have two trains of thought: (1)KotD, while embarrassingly vague/useless in the comics, still became a notable event in BP comics that anyone with a surface level indulgence in marvel comics is aware of. At worst, they remember zombies from Secret Wars. On average, they know he can talk to his ancestors. So Fiege, Coogler, and the MCU writers are aware of these things.

(2) Because of how vague the execution of KotD was, it serves as a free power upgrade option for MCU BP w/o much restrictions. It could be as simple as: "big indomitable threat emerges, T'Challa meets Bast like the first BP did, Bast blesses T'Challa with KotD (aka whatever stat boots or abilities Coogler feels MCU KotD should be), BP proceeds to dominate the once indomitable threat. Role credits. <-- Whether that takes place in a BP movie or just a big subplot in a future Avengers film (like Thor in Infinity War), the intent would be the same.

[Ezyo1000]

Yes what I am suggesting is that he has different gear and suits for different threat levels. Again, from a meta standpoint that's just practical.

As is, T'Challa can be used in a relatively wide range of stories. It makes him a far more versatile character because he can scale up or down as needed logically, without jobbing or plot armor. Restrict him to his absolute best, and it creates several problems storytelling wise. Firstly it requires every single opponent he faces to be equal to or superior to his best. Every single one. Because the point isn't to make it easier for the hero... if anything it's the reverse. And secondly, it means the types of stories he fits in are greatly diminished.

He's MUCH better off having the ability to adopt and adjust his power levels according to the treat level. That means he can fit into most stories against opponents who are credible threats in a believable fashion.

You do know that the force push does just that right? The stronger the opponent, the stronger the push hits them for. Weaker opponents still get knocked away by it, but they aren't going to get blasted into orbit by it then say, Namor. Nor should they be, and if we are being Frank, if he is fighting street level villains, they need something to even the odds anyways. Never would I expect or accept the likes of king pins or bull eyes to ever tangle with T'Challa at full strength and give him trouble without a serious handicap to keep him from destroying them in under 10 sec. MCU got it right, Evans got it right, Redjacks got it right too (I hope he gets another season and could make the force push become a staple) the one good thing Coates had done so far is still use the force push in previous season's he has the tech

[Rumble]

Ezyo, Cville, MoS, this is that anime ish i was talking about. He noticed breh aiming at him with a sniper then dodged after breh shot the sniper.

And before that, he kicked the first guy which caused the gun to flail in the air, then kicked the flailing gun into the next guy. Then he ran down the truck and did the claw thing. Then he petted the deer like a good hunter in hxh.

I'm not sure if Redjack knows anime physics or humors half the dbz/mha/hxh references we throw out here, but he understands how to give BP what essentially amounts to anime physics. This is a good thing

[Ezyo1000]

Gotdamn Blind...you are on fire!



shit aint' that hard is it lol?



Why does it take an IDW book to get a non plain black suit lol?

Because IDW actually cares about making Tchalla look cool and not just a shadow with eyeballs

[MindofShadow]

If KotD was never uttered again in the comics, I wouldn't be mad at all lol

[Rumble]

What's this about?

How come his suit can't be like tis everywhere?

[Cville]

What's this about?

How come his suit can't be like tis everywhere?

Part of the kid friendly line of books

[XPac]

You do know that the force push does just that right? The stronger the opponent, the stronger the push hits them for. Weaker opponents still get knocked away by it, but they aren't going to get blasted into orbit by it then say, Namor. Nor should they be, and if we are being Frank, if he is fighting street level villains, they need something to even the odds anyways. Never would I expect or accept the likes of king pins or bull eyes to ever tangle with T'Challa at full strength and give him trouble without a serious handicap to keep him from destroying them in under 10 sec. MCU got it right, Evans got it right, Redjacks got it right too (I hope he gets another season and could make the force push become a staple) the one good thing Coates had done so far is still use the force push in previous season's he has the tech

I'm more talking defense than offense. Yes, he returns the force of the opponent back at them which theoretically should scale perfectly against whatever he's fighting. But the problem is if even Namor level opponents can't do actual damage to him, then it heavily restricts the treat level a large portion of the MU (and frankly his entire rogues gallery) presents to him. If a Killmonger and a M'Baku can't hurt him, then they don't really belong in a story with him. They can both stand there all afternoon punching away while T'Challa sits down to take a quick evening nap.

Of course, that would never happen because no writer would want to tell that story. So instead we get a suit that scales up and down with no explanation whatsoever. Killmonger and Man Ape will be credible threats, and WILL be able to hurt him because that's what needs to happen in comics. All I'm suggesting is an explanation is better than no explanation. Have him different gear against different opponents, and you're good to go.

[XPac]

@Blind

I agree with you with the villains except: Namor and Doom should NOT have superior tech to T'Challa. Equal or slightly lesser yes, but the advanced nation on Earth needs to be the most advanced nation on Earth in more then name only. Doom can have the edge in magical might and Namor in physical might. Tech abd martial arts should go to T'Challa. Period



Regardless of what your suggesting, that's exactly what happens. Writer's get lazy and the tech disappears. Again why dumb T'Challa down when you can raise his rogues up? His gear doesn't need to go up or down depending on the threat. That's not what Priest did, that's not what Hudlin tried to do (though the armor unfortunately did this) and for the most part didn't do. It's a boring and unimaginative way to do things and makes for inconsistent power levels on top of what Wedjat said with plot convenience and the hero being unprepared. That's arguably what happened to Tchalla in power against Doom.

T'Challa is plenty useable and the force push if anything adds to his power set without actually making Street level unusable

Priest and Hudlin didn't do it because they didn't need to do it. T'Challa wouldn't likely not be able to completely shrug off attacks from Namor level people in their books. People the level of a Captain America and Kraven were able to fight him on a completely even.

Coates force push and kinetic absorbtion is an upgrade which theoretically woud change things if not for the fact that it's ignored when it's convenient to do so.

[Redjack]

You guys are going to lose your shit over the next six episodes. especially the back three.