Wonder Woman 1984: Discussion, Set Leaks & Spoilers #WW84

[Gaelforce]

And? WW 2017 was expected to flop because there was no hit comic movie with female leads at that point. It surpassed the expectations. 410M for overseas is not bad. The film was successful worldwide, just because other movies did better is not going to change thge fact that WW 2017 was a global hit.

Suicide Squad also had (a) a bigger budget and (b) bigger names (Will Smith, Viola Davis, Jared Leto).

[Titan Theo]

Spoilers

In the new trailer we see two amazons use a rope really rather well stylistically; and both of them know to hold the lasso from it's base...

So far, WW is holding it like as if there was loose noodle where she is gripping it and the I don't find whatever the previews show that impressive at all, and rather surprising considering what they have shown in the opening. Also, lassoing the lightning is obviously a magical feat that requires a very major suspension of disbelief that it's so hard even to do it...considering that it's light and has no solid shape and that it happens so far that WW has to be so much faster than the speed of lightning.


However, I've only seen the preview and the overly golden effects of the lasso looks a bit too cartoonish so let's hope the rest of the action scenes are at least better than the last movie. If they only consulted with the DC Animation department I will have absolute faith that the action scenes will spot on.

[WonderLight789]

Spoilers

In the new trailer we see two amazons use a rope really rather well stylistically; and both of them know to hold the lasso from it's base...

So far, WW is holding it like as if there was loose noodle where she is gripping it and the I don't find whatever the previews show that impressive at all, and rather surprising considering what they have shown in the opening. Also, lassoing the lightning is obviously a magical feat that requires a very major suspension of disbelief that it's so hard even to do it...considering that it's light and has no solid shape and that it happens so far that WW has to be so much faster than the speed of lightning.


However, I've only seen the preview and the overly golden effects of the lasso looks a bit too cartoonish so let's hope the rest of the action scenes are at least better than the last movie. If they only consulted with the DC Animation department I will have absolute faith that the action scenes will spot on.

WW has reacted to lightning speed and beyond in the comics. With the speed of a God she should be fast enough to do so. And the lasso is a magical tool that has done crazier stuff than lassoing lightning.

[Titan Theo]

WW has reacted to lightning speed and beyond in the comics. With the speed of a God she should be fast enough to do so. And the lasso is a magical tool that has done crazier stuff than lassoing lightning.

Although I am not a fan of lassoing lightning...I can accept that if they somehow explain that the lasso WW is lassoing is something generated by her and it allows her magically to "hang on to it." WW is fast, yes, fast enough to deflect lightning, but unless she can anticipate where the lightning will strike it's really hard to even imagine her having the speed to lasso it..it will be over by the time she reacts to it.

[WonderLight789]

Although I am not a fan of lassoing lightning...I can accept that if they somehow explain that the lasso WW is lassoing is something generated by her and it allows her magically to "hang on to it." WW is fast, yes, fast enough to deflect lightning, but unless she can anticipate where the lightning will strike it's really hard to even imagine her having the speed to lasso it..it will be over by the time she reacts to it.

Again, with the speed of a God she should be fast enough to do that. Comic WW has proven herself faster than lightning anyway. Super speed remember? And fiction specially in this type of genre doesn't go by the laws of physics. Which is why the lasso does all kinds of crazy stuff.

[Titan Theo]

Again, with the speed of a God she should be fast enough to do that. Comic WW has proven herself faster than lightning anyway. Super speed remember? And fiction specially in this type of genre doesn't go by the laws of physics. Which is why the lasso does all kinds of crazy stuff.

WW is not even a pure Olympian god; demi-god at best, and her power set has been inconsistent. For that matter, however, WW has to be able to possess speed force Flash level to do that. By the time she even swings that lasso, the lightning will be over; blocking it incoming towards her, and hurling the lasso far away is another thing. However, since if the entire thing is indeed magic based, lightning included, then it makes suspension of disbelief better. This stunt almost reminds me when Superman use to move the earth; that's just won't fly in today's comics because we know how much casualties that will create.

Anyway, PJ handling of WW's lasso techniques are really not so impressive in my opinion; overly neon glowy that it sort of cartoonish..hopefully that gets retconned later on. But to to each his own, I suppose.

[Rightoya]

Although I am not a fan of lassoing lightning...I can accept that if they somehow explain that the lasso WW is lassoing is something generated by her and it allows her magically to "hang on to it." WW is fast, yes, fast enough to deflect lightning, but unless she can anticipate where the lightning will strike it's really hard to even imagine her having the speed to lasso it..it will be over by the time she reacts to it.

What, are you talking about DCEU, or DC Comics Wonder Woman? Because for the latter is that notion absolutely laughable, something like this as example would be not nearly possible if Wonder Woman could not even move fast enough to lasso lightning bolts, considering from where she came to move Superman out of the way:

WW is not even a pure Olympian god; demi-god at best, and her power set has been inconsistent. For that matter, however, WW has to be able to possess speed force Flash level to do that. By the time she even swings that lasso, the lightning will be over; blocking it incoming towards her, and hurling the lasso far away is another thing. However, since if the entire thing is indeed magic based, lightning included, then it makes suspension of disbelief better. This stunt almost reminds me when Superman use to move the earth; that's just won't fly in today's comics because we know how much casualties that will create.

Anyway, PJ handling of WW's lasso techniques are really not so impressive in my opinion; overly neon glowy that it sort of cartoonish..hopefully that gets retconned later on. But to to each his own, I suppose.

Wonder Woman is supposed to be the literal counter to a full fledged god in the DCEU, and was in her modern version originally not a demi-god at best but empowered by 6 full fledged gods and 1 god level soul, and her power-set was never inconsistent enough to exclude super-speed. Wonder Woman possessed in her history often enough Flash level speed, just not consistent at the absolute cheese-high ends, and the speed force had in the past an entry speed around the speed of light, which is around 3000 times faster than a lightning bolt and still at least 3 times faster than even the return stroke. By the time a properly portrayed Wonder Woman in the comics swings her lasso will be nothing over, the lightning bolt would have not even notably traveled. Superman lifted the earth for 5 days in New 52, and this as example is also not from the Silver age, or any of the other truly cheesy periods:



How should they retcon the glow of the lasso, at best they will change the color palette of a potential third movie.

[FutureWonder]

Yeah, it makes me so angry how casually so many people claim Wonder Woman was "not that beloved outside of the US"; WTF? This is a narrative that NOBODY peddles about the MCU's Phase I films, most of which made less money domestically AND overseas than WW. Heck, even some MCU films from beyond phase 1 (Ant-Man and the Wasp) made less than WW overseas, and others like Dr. Strange and Guardians of the Galaxy made more than WW overseas, but not by that large of a margin. Yet, nobody says that any of those films were not successful overseas. Somehow, Wonder Woman's success is measured with a different yardstick. Such BS.

In any case, I am concerned. If WW84's less-than-stellar box office in some international markets is stupidly blamed on the film itself (instead of the pandemic), or worse, if a "WW was a fluke" narrative starts developing for whatever reason, I fear that WB will not want to give WW3 a greenlight. We all know that there is a double standard for female-led movies. And now that Jenkins will be super busy with Cleopatra and Rogue Squadron, what if all parties involved decide that a third go at the Amazing Amazon is not worth it? That would suck.

When Superman 3 flopped, they still made Superman 4. When all the Burton Batman films progressively grossed less than their predecessors, WB still greenlit Batman & Robin. Then eventually they greenlit three more Batman films (Nolan's). But I fear that Diana will not get the same opportunities.

IF they greenlight a third WW, Jenkins needs to do an Aquaman on us and bring on the type of dazzling spectacle and bone-crunching action/adventure that led to the first movie about the King of Atlantis grossing a billion dollars. God knows that Diana has the rich mythology (figuratively AND literally) to spawn a WW movie that gives us killer visuals, fantastic worlds, and immersive adventures beyond imagination. Bring on Circe and have her unleash mythological beasts and monsters (harpies, a cyclop, the minotaur, et al) on the world. Make us visit Olympus and Tartarus. Make it a visually arresting thrillride that becomes irressistible to many of the countries that had a more subdued reaction to Wonder Woman's first film.
Just don't stop making WW films, please.

[Geraldofrivia]

Yeah, it makes me so angry how casually so many people claim Wonder Woman was "not that beloved outside of the US"; WTF? This is a narrative that NOBODY peddles about the MCU's Phase I films, most of which made less money domestically AND overseas than WW. Heck, even some MCU films from beyond phase 1 (Ant-Man and the Wasp) made less than WW overseas, and others like Dr. Strange and Guardians of the Galaxy made more than WW overseas, but not by that large of a margin. Yet, nobody says that any of those films were not successful overseas. Somehow, Wonder Woman's success is measured with a different yardstick. Such BS.

All of these characters were niche comic book characters unlike Wonder Woman.

In any case, I am concerned. If WW84's less-than-stellar box office in some international markets is stupidly blamed on the film itself (instead of the pandemic), or worse, if a "WW was a fluke" narrative starts developing for whatever reason, I fear that WB will not want to give WW3 a greenlight. We all know that there is a double standard for female-led movies. And now that Jenkins will be super busy with Cleopatra and Rogue Squadron, what if all parties involved decide that a third go at the Amazing Amazon is not worth it? That would suck.

When Superman 3 flopped, they still made Superman 4. When all the Burton Batman films progressively grossed less than their predecessors, WB still greenlit Batman & Robin. Then eventually they greenlit three more Batman films (Nolan's). But I fear that Diana will not get the same opportunities.

Gal has enough clout to make WW3 happen

IF they greenlight a third WW, Jenkins needs to do an Aquaman on us and bring on the type of dazzling spectacle and bone-crunching action/adventure that led to the first movie about the King of Atlantis grossing a billion dollars. God knows that Diana has the rich mythology (figuratively AND literally) to spawn a WW movie that gives us killer visuals, fantastic worlds, and immersive adventures beyond imagination. Bring on Circe and have her unleash mythological beasts and monsters (harpies, a cyclop, the minotaur, et al) on the world. Make us visit Olympus and Tartarus. Make it a visually arresting thrillride that becomes irressistible to many of the countries that had a more subdued reaction to Wonder Woman's first film.
Just don't stop making WW films, please.

For me, Patty Jenkins is the problem. No offence, she did an incredible job with Diana and Steve Trevor's romance and character but everything else was bad. In DC, villains are as popular as Heros yet she completely neglected Ares and Cheetah. She neglected Amazons, Themsyscira, technology, Gods and Diana's power level. Superhero movies need big CGI spectacles and action pieces to make money internationally and yet she neglected it in the sequel . It is time for a new Director to bring new vision and ideas to WW franchise.

[Castling]

Yeah, it makes me so angry how casually so many people claim Wonder Woman was "not that beloved outside of the US"; WTF? This is a narrative that NOBODY peddles about the MCU's Phase I films, most of which made less money domestically AND overseas than WW. Heck, even some MCU films from beyond phase 1 (Ant-Man and the Wasp) made less than WW overseas, and others like Dr. Strange and Guardians of the Galaxy made more than WW overseas, but not by that large of a margin. Yet, nobody says that any of those films were not successful overseas. Somehow, Wonder Woman's success is measured with a different yardstick. Such BS.

In any case, I am concerned. If WW84's less-than-stellar box office in some international markets is stupidly blamed on the film itself (instead of the pandemic), or worse, if a "WW was a fluke" narrative starts developing for whatever reason, I fear that WB will not want to give WW3 a greenlight. We all know that there is a double standard for female-led movies. And now that Jenkins will be super busy with Cleopatra and Rogue Squadron, what if all parties involved decide that a third go at the Amazing Amazon is not worth it? That would suck.

When Superman 3 flopped, they still made Superman 4. When all the Burton Batman films progressively grossed less than their predecessors, WB still greenlit Batman & Robin. Then eventually they greenlit three more Batman films (Nolan's). But I fear that Diana will not get the same opportunities.

IF they greenlight a third WW, Jenkins needs to do an Aquaman on us and bring on the type of dazzling spectacle and bone-crunching action/adventure that led to the first movie about the King of Atlantis grossing a billion dollars. God knows that Diana has the rich mythology (figuratively AND literally) to spawn a WW movie that gives us killer visuals, fantastic worlds, and immersive adventures beyond imagination. Bring on Circe and have her unleash mythological beasts and monsters (harpies, a cyclop, the minotaur, et al) on the world. Make us visit Olympus and Tartarus. Make it a visually arresting thrillride that becomes irressistible to many of the countries that had a more subdued reaction to Wonder Woman's first film.
Just don't stop making WW films, please.

I think you guys are forgetting that we are in the middle of a surging pandemic, and that most theaters world-wide are closed.

[Geraldofrivia]

I think you guys are forgetting that we are in the middle of a surging pandemic, and that most theaters world-wide are closed.

China and Japan are more or less normal. Top movies after pandemic are from these countries. Also, China is very important if WW have to get to 1 billion milestone and the movie has got horrible word of mouth from audience there.

[Gaius]

For me, Patty Jenkins is the problem. No offence, she did an incredible job with Diana and Steve Trevor's romance and character but everything else was bad. In DC, villains are as popular as Heros yet she completely neglected Ares and Cheetah. She neglected Amazons, Themsyscira, technology, Gods and Diana's power level. Superhero movies need big CGI spectacles and action pieces to make money internationally and yet she neglected it in the sequel . It is time for a new Director to bring new vision and ideas to WW franchise.

How did she neglect the Amazons? Themyscira and the Amazons takes up a big portion of the first film and was a well-liked part of it, now being brought back for some scenes in the second film. We can argue over whether they should have had the GA technology but the comics have gone back and forth themselves when it comes to that so I'd say it's a valid choice if a film forgoes that stuff if it wishes (same over the idea if Diana can fly or not).

And while I roll my eyes at people who complain about CGI in films, it's not the only way of creating a memorable set piece. The No Man's Land scene has less CG than something out of the fight scenes from MoS or Aquaman but it's far more memorable than the stuff from those films.

[LordUltimus]

I think all the delays severely damaged people's enthusiasm for the movie.

[Geraldofrivia]

How did she neglect the Amazons? Themyscira and the Amazons takes up a big portion of the first film and was a well-liked part of it, now being brought back for some scenes in the second film. We can argue over whether they should have had the GA technology but the comics have gone back and forth themselves when it comes to that so I'd say it's a valid choice if a film forgoes that stuff if it wishes (same over the idea if Diana can fly or not).

And while I roll my eyes at people who complain about CGI in films, it's not the only way of creating a memorable set piece. The No Man's Land scene has less CG than something out of the fight scenes from MoS or Aquaman but it's far more memorable than the stuff from those films.

What about the third act which was universally panned for terrible CGI and cartoonish depiction of Ares

[Castling]

What about the third act which was universally panned for terrible CGI and cartoonish depiction of Ares

That doesn't stop the film from being great. Black Panther also had wonky CGI and cartoony battle rhinos in its third act that people weren't fond of; still a great film.