Irredeemable Characters?

[Vegan Daddy]

So, what is this Max Eisenhardt thing? I know in the 90's they tried to go with the 'Erik Lensherr' papers were faked, but is that still a thing?

Isn't it from Magneto Testament? I'm pretty sure that's canon.

[yogaflame]

Isn't it from Magneto Testament? I'm pretty sure that's canon.

I've never read that. Does anyone actually call him Max?

[Jirrenm]

So, what is this Max Eisenhardt thing? I know in the 90's they tried to go with the 'Erik Lensherr' papers were faked, but is that still a thing?

That's from Magneto:Testament which is his canon origin story.

[Vegan Daddy]

I've never read that. Does anyone actually call him Max?

Oh yeah. It goes from his early childhood to his escape from Auschwitz.

[yogaflame]

Oh yeah. It goes from his early childhood to his escape from Auschwitz.

Right, of course in the story. Just any of the people in his life now? Charles always calls him Magnus, or now Erik. Does it line up with the Classic X-Men origin by Claremont?

[Jirrenm]

Right, of course in the story. Just any of the people in his life now? Charles always calls him Magnus, or now Erik. Does it line up with the Classic X-Men origin by Claremont?

Everybody just calls him Erik in the X-Men books, although in his solo series from 2014 there were a few flashbacks to his childhood where he was called Max. This story is previous to the Classic X-Men stories as it ends at the moment he escapes the concentration camps with Magda, the Claremont's origin story starts right after that, the way he escapes though it's a bit different in both stories.

[Muffinman]

Irredeemable characters?

Scarlet Witch- after what she did on m-day, I don’t care who possessed who or what drove who to squat, it was your body, your powers, your words out of YOUR mouth. Positively awful.

Emma Frost- she’s done a few things that have been morally gray in the form of almost black, but towards the end and at the end of IvX... I am not even a fan of the inhumans, but that was beyond crazed. Again, you’re having a mental breakdown- that doesn’t mean you can just kill whomever you want and say “oops, I’m sorry”.

Mystique- too many to list, I am not sure why I am even putting her here as she is mainly a villain. She’s a psycho that needs some chains.

Sabertooth- again mainly a villain, he has killed so many just for sport it is disturbing that he would be allowed on any x team, inverted or not. The dude has more bodies than he even knows.

Jean- much like the scarlet witch, Jean fans cannot harp that Wanda has not been properly punished while Jean as the Phoenix has swallowed millions of lives. Much like Wanda, Just because you are under the influence, in the cocoon or whatever retcon is latest, doesn’t mean that you have a get out of jail free card. At least partially answer for it and never act above your peers which she sometimes did.

With so many x-villains sometimes becoming x-members for a short time it is hard not to include so many, I only threw in creed and Mystique because they are in current active x-books as an x-hero

[Vegan Daddy]

Right, of course in the story. Just any of the people in his life now? Charles always calls him Magnus, or now Erik. Does it line up with the Classic X-Men origin by Claremont?

Everyone who knew him as Max is dead. Charles definitely knew though. I like to think Magneto told him after a particularly passionate bout of lovemaking, or Charles just fished it out of his head. Either way, Magneto probably doesn't think of himself as 'Max' anymore. That boy died in the camps.

I think Magneto Testament just adds to what was shown in Classic X-Men #12, but there could be some inconsistencies.

[JasonEsta]

Right, of course in the story. Just any of the people in his life now? Charles always calls him Magnus, or now Erik. Does it line up with the Classic X-Men origin by Claremont?

Everyone calls him Erik Magnus Lehnsherr..that's the name he goes by but in Magneto Testament, we learned his parents name, his name, and where he got "Erik" from.

[Dementia5]

The reality is that no character is irredeemable as long as the writer has access to this.

[Agent Z]

I don't know about Sabretooth but Magneto is one of the most beloved characters in comic history. He topped every list of villains(Wizard, erc) throughout the 90s..he's so charismatic a villain on the tv shows that he always ends up as a tweener instead of a hero or villain because his goal is just. Last 3 movies..He was sympathetic and the theaters responded to his scenes more then anyone else in the movies.

How can Magneto be "irredeemable " when he is the DIRECT reason Rogue and Kitty are alive today? Or when he rescued Lorna and Rachel when the X men forgot about them? How about when he saved Storm in X Men Unlimited after she got shot and struggled to keep that car full of teenagers from falling off the bridge?

Sabretooth doesn't do these things unless he's mind controlled.

Emma? She's always in a position of remote ease and likes the good life. Magneto is a whole another level of complexity..which is why he's iconic and sells books and they don't.

I'd say crippling Xavier, killing Jean, herding humans into ovens and setting off a global EMP are enough to put him in the "irredeemable" camp.

[Agent Z]

Who says what's too far? If Mystique, Daken, Logan, and Deadpool had women who loved or were attracted to them, I don't see why Sabretooth couldn't. Anyone could probably do better than these guys. But they were still wanted.

Monet had a thing for Strong Guy and slept with Darwin. So her standards are not super high. lol And Hell she didn't even like Darwin. I think she just wanted sex for a chance to feel something. So you got her sleeping with a dude casually that she wasn't even into. In Uncanny, we weren't dealing with evil Sabretooth. It was anti-hero Creed. And he was very noble when Monet was with him. He did nothing but try to watch out for her. Monet & Creed was the Buffy & Angel of Uncanny. Isn't Buffy a bit into herself and prissy like Monet? She's a vampire slayer. Angel is a vampire and former murderer & rapist of 200+ years as Angelus.

Plus, that added more drama. It seemed Monet was attracted to him -the Creed she got to know. But she definitely ran hot and cold on him. And I think part of that could have been annoyance or anger because she knows / feels that she shouldn't be interested in him. It wouldn't have been a happy relationship with no issues. There'd have been plenty of room for drama and problems. Hence why it works for fiction lol

There's no more reason Sabretooth & Monet should be off the table than

Deadpool + Rogue
Buffy + Angel
Buffy + Spike -who tried to rape her
Deadpool + Siryn
Batman & Catwoman lol

Monet & Creed share a similar snarkiness, and cynical view of life. Their back & forth seems to show fondness for the banter. Again, Monet liked Strong Guy. So she may very well be into macho guys. It's not unheard of for a rich brat to be attracted to bad boys. Honestly, it's almost a cliche in fiction. Monet acts like a perfect priss, but she is very flawed and has a good few problems. I never saw her as so pure and noble to the point that Sabretooth attracting her would be impossible. But again, Good Sabretooth. Not the psycho one.

But like someone mentioned in another thread. Monet thinks everyone is beneath her. So what's the losers from the keepers. And if she dated someone that's the male equivalent of her, she'd probably be competitive with them so as not to feel weak, or overshadowed.

Strong Guy and Darwin aren't serial killers and rapists.

[yogaflame]

I'd say crippling Xavier, killing Jean, herding humans into ovens and setting off a global EMP are enough to put him in the "irredeemable" camp.

If that really was Magneto I would agree, but Marvel bent over backwards to sweep that whole thing under the carpet and I agree with that decision(they really shouldn't have let Morrison do that in the first place). I loved Xorn before the reveal and then when we saw it was Magneto and then what he did next, I mean, yeah, you couldn't really redeem such a character except to say that it wasn't him!

[JasonEsta]

I'd say crippling Xavier, killing Jean, herding humans into ovens and setting off a global EMP are enough to put him in the "irredeemable" camp.

In your head? Sure but he's saved mutants Asses while the X men were playing hide and seek in their little mansion afraid to reveal their identity and location.

Courage>>>>

And Magneto is not seeking redemption...just in case you missed the ENTIRE Magneto series.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

Though some of Magneto's actions put those same mutants that he saved in danger in the first place, and last time I checked didn't Magneto hide out all over the world and play hide and seek as well, only leaving to kill people and take whatever he wanted and call it good...