Minorities in Comics and Other Media, etc

[OopsIdiditagain]

1) I think part of it is that English and Film grads who write this stuff have no clue of how research is produced. Instead they are trying to graft their experience from liberal arts where novels/movies are the vision of a lone genius (ex. auteur theory). That's hardly the case where research is much more collaborative and the result of dozens or even hundreds of people working together.

That's just some cultures being more individualistic than collectivist.

[CosmiComic]

Mmmm. Facts. Never let it be forgotten that first kid- the Native American, which even for white supremacy is really low thing to co-opt the use of that name, pretty much wiped out.

Native Americans are the most marginalized group in American media. And there are 100s of indigenous nations in North and South America

EDIT: Even the Papa Johns guy said it's a struggle for him to stop using the N-word...LOLOLOLOLOL.

I read it somewhere that some white people teach their kids racism as early as five (5) years old, that's some scary ****. And clearly quite true with the stuff that we see nowadays. It's staggering and horrifying how some folks don't want to call the crimes against Asians "hate crimes". What's even scarier is that a lot of Asian-Americans have bought into the "model minority" bullshit and didn't want to call it out.

That's disturbing, especially with the rise of anti-Asian hate during the quarantine

1) I think part of it is that English and Film grads who write this stuff have no clue of how research is produced. Instead they are trying to graft their experience from liberal arts where novels/movies are the vision of a lone genius (ex. auteur theory). That's hardly the case where research is much more collaborative and the result of dozens or even hundreds of people working together.

2) I think coding really needs to be emphasized more. Unless you are CS graduate, a lot of programs like mathematics or biology don't do a good job of teaching it (or else it's haphazard and patchy) even when a lot of these data science related jobs really emphasize coding experience. And stuff like neural networks and deep learning aren't gong away.

Also science isn't really valued in our society. In my state for example, cops get paid better than most professors.

I've heard that's part of the backlash against auteur theory. Also, I agree with your point on science

The whole model minority stereotype has always been something that was created by and for white people, so that they could convince themselves that America wasn't a racist country, Asian people have never actually believed it. What is more relevant here is that a lot of Asian-Americans really value being "white adjacent" in order to be able to navigate wealthy elite circles, and fear that saying anything that might be upsetting to white yuppie types will get them ostracized and lumped in with the masses of poor peasants from the old country. And because these types of people are the only ones that have any chance of getting a semblance of a public platform, their views are taken as representative as those of the entire community.

White hierarchy thrives on pitting oppressed groups against one another. Yet Asian Americans are mocked for being "weak" and "girly" while African Americans are mocked for being "dangerous". How does that work!?

That's just some cultures being more individualistic than collectivist.

Well, it's more collectivism for the benefit of few vs all in practice

[Username taken]

The same people who protested against civil rights are still alive as grandparents right now. It is sometimes easy to forget that. And it is very easy to forget that when you are half black (like me) and when you marry a white lady (like me).

My white grandma was not in my life until I was a teenager. Despite living in the same city as my black grandparents. Meaning, we could have seen her just as easily as we saw them. It was because, she basically DIDNT LIKE MY EXISTENCE. It was not ok my dad married a black chick and it was not ok he had black kids. I had no idea until I was much older and my dad told my wife, not even me lol.

Once she was around... she is totally nice to me. In fact, she gets nicer and nicer lol. You could never tell, she is 100% nice grandma. I don't know if she got over it, I don't know if she just deemed me as "a good one." No idea. For me... it is just weird.

My wife's grandparents have been nice to me from the instance I first went over there. My wife's grandpa is TOO nice... aka he won't stop talking to me lol. He is that talkative old man who has story after story. Wife's grandma has always been nice.

My wife's grandma when she was a kid had a black dog named *insert N word* And she dropped that story CASUALLY at a family gathering (I wasn't there). No one batted an eye except my wife, who asked her to explain herself. And the explanation was simply "it was no big deal, it was just a joke back then."

I've thought about that a lot sense then lol.

This **** is DEEPLY ingrained

Wow, this is deep.

Like really, really deep.

I actually have white relatives too but have very little interaction with them.

[Surf]

My wife's grandpa is TOO nice... aka he won't stop talking to me lol. He is that talkative old man who has story after story.

Shoutout to familial overtalking old white dude lol. You kinda squint in his direction the more he goes on. You nod a lot, Is he puttin me on? Prolly maybe not, still though. You just wanna be- sir, relax.

[CosmiComic]

This is an odd idea, but has anyone noticed how white characters have children as legacy characters but PoC characters don't?

Both Ant-Men have daughters who are heroes (Wasp and Stature), Scarlet Witch and Vision have Wiccan and Speed, Thunderstrike (Eric) had Thunderstrike (Kevin), Mr. Fantastic and Invisible Woman have Franklin and Valeria, Cyke and Phoenix have Cable and Rachel, Wolverine has Daken and X-23, Spider-Man has Spider-Girl, Captain Marvel has Hulkling, Quicksilver and Crystal have Luna, etc. Vision also has Viv but they're not technically human.

Meanwhile none of the PoC legacy characters are children of older PoC heroes. Storm, Black Panther, Falcon, War Machine, Spectrum, Shang-Chi, Bishop, etc. have no "legacy children". What gives? I'm not saying younger heroes have to be related to older ones, in fact I prefer they don't, but why do only white heroes get to have children who become heroes?

[MindofShadow]

This is an odd idea, but has anyone noticed how white characters have children as legacy characters but PoC characters don't?

Both Ant-Men have daughters who are heroes (Wasp and Stature), Scarlet Witch and Vision have Wiccan and Speed, Thunderstrike (Eric) had Thunderstrike (Kevin), Mr. Fantastic and Invisible Woman have Franklin and Valeria, Cyke and Phoenix have Cable and Rachel, Wolverine has Daken and X-23, Spider-Man has Spider-Girl, Captain Marvel has Hulkling, Quicksilver and Crystal have Luna, etc. Vision also has Viv but they're not technically human.

Meanwhile none of the PoC legacy characters are children of older PoC heroes. Storm, Black Panther, Falcon, War Machine, Spectrum, Shang-Chi, Bishop, etc. have no "legacy children". What gives? I'm not saying younger heroes have to be related to older ones, in fact I prefer they don't, but why do only white heroes get to have children who become heroes?

Luke Cage?

[CosmiComic]

Luke Cage?

Hah, forgot about him! Still, that's only one.

[Surf]

This is an odd idea, but has anyone noticed how white characters have children as legacy characters but PoC characters don't?

Both Ant-Men have daughters who are heroes (Wasp and Stature), Scarlet Witch and Vision have Wiccan and Speed, Thunderstrike (Eric) had Thunderstrike (Kevin), Mr. Fantastic and Invisible Woman have Franklin and Valeria, Cyke and Phoenix have Cable and Rachel, Wolverine has Daken and X-23, Spider-Man has Spider-Girl, Captain Marvel has Hulkling, Quicksilver and Crystal have Luna, etc. Vision also has Viv but they're not technically human.

Meanwhile none of the PoC legacy characters are children of older PoC heroes. Storm, Black Panther, Falcon, War Machine, Spectrum, Shang-Chi, Bishop, etc. have no "legacy children". What gives? I'm not saying younger heroes have to be related to older ones, in fact I prefer they don't, but why do only white heroes get to have children who become heroes?

Both Black Lightning's daughters.

I'd say 80% of the OG's also don't have offspring.

[CosmiComic]

Both Black Lightning's daughters.

I'd say 80% of the OG's also don't have offspring.

That's true. Most don't. I just see an odd proportion in white heroes' favor

Although I realize now I only listed Marvel heroes!

[Marvell2100]

The same people who protested against civil rights are still alive as grandparents right now. It is sometimes easy to forget that. And it is very easy to forget that when you are half black (like me) and when you marry a white lady (like me).

My white grandma was not in my life until I was a teenager. Despite living in the same city as my black grandparents. Meaning, we could have seen her just as easily as we saw them. It was because, she basically DIDNT LIKE MY EXISTENCE. It was not ok my dad married a black chick and it was not ok he had black kids. I had no idea until I was much older and my dad told my wife, not even me lol.

Once she was around... she is totally nice to me. In fact, she gets nicer and nicer lol. You could never tell, she is 100% nice grandma. I don't know if she got over it, I don't know if she just deemed me as "a good one." No idea. For me... it is just weird.

My wife's grandparents have been nice to me from the instance I first went over there. My wife's grandpa is TOO nice... aka he won't stop talking to me lol. He is that talkative old man who has story after story. Wife's grandma has always been nice.

My wife's grandma when she was a kid had a black dog named *insert N word* And she dropped that story CASUALLY at a family gathering (I wasn't there). No one batted an eye except my wife, who asked her to explain herself. And the explanation was simply "it was no big deal, it was just a joke back then."

I've thought about that a lot sense then lol.

This **** is DEEPLY ingrained

That must have been some really hard stuff to deal with for you, your parents and grandparents.

My daughter dated a white guy and she was hesitant to have him meet her mom's family because she knew how some of them would react. She brought him to my mom's house and they stayed there because my mom would just hug people and try to feed them all the time. Me and dude got along good because I gave him the speech I usually give any dude my would date: Don't go overboard to try to be my friend. Treat my daughter with respect and we'll get along just fine, lol.

I've always told her I don't care who you date, just make sure that they treat you well.

[J. D. Guy]

This is an odd idea, but has anyone noticed how white characters have children as legacy characters but PoC characters don't?

Both Ant-Men have daughters who are heroes (Wasp and Stature), Scarlet Witch and Vision have Wiccan and Speed, Thunderstrike (Eric) had Thunderstrike (Kevin), Mr. Fantastic and Invisible Woman have Franklin and Valeria, Cyke and Phoenix have Cable and Rachel, Wolverine has Daken and X-23, Spider-Man has Spider-Girl, Captain Marvel has Hulkling, Quicksilver and Crystal have Luna, etc. Vision also has Viv but they're not technically human.

Meanwhile none of the PoC legacy characters are children of older PoC heroes. Storm, Black Panther, Falcon, War Machine, Spectrum, Shang-Chi, Bishop, etc. have no "legacy children". What gives? I'm not saying younger heroes have to be related to older ones, in fact I prefer they don't, but why do only white heroes get to have children who become heroes?

That is so true. It's one of those things we take as a given because of social conditioning that, if we stop to think on it, we realize it is actually very weird and disconcerting.

Even Dani Cage doesn't really count, because while she is the daughter of a hero/active hero, she isn't a hero herself, let alone a legacy hero taking after her father. In fact, we rarely see her. So that just leaves Jefferson Pierce. (Who's situation is its own thing, wherein fandom comes off caring more for the daughters and taking or leaving/ outright not caring for the father.)

But yeah. It's probably connected to the fact Black characters and other non-White characters, with superheroes being no exception, aren't as likely to be depicted in relationships, heteronormative or otherwise, let alone ones that produce children. Heck, not even non-White heroes with non-White adopted kids who become legacy heroes taking after their parents. Sometimes, it feels like you can't get a clear win any way you look at it.

[CosmiComic]

That is so true. It's one of those things we take as a given because of social conditioning that, if we stop to think on it, we realize it is actually very weird and disconcerting.

Even Dani Cage doesn't really count, because while she is the daughter of a hero/active hero, she isn't a hero herself, let alone a legacy hero taking after her father. In fact, we rarely see her. So that just leaves Jefferson Pierce. (Who's situation is its own thing, wherein fandom comes off caring more for the daughters and taking or leaving/ outright not caring for the father.)

But yeah. It's probably connected to the fact Black characters and other non-White characters, with superheroes being no exception, aren't as likely to be depicted in relationships, heteronormative or otherwise, let alone ones that produce children. Heck, not even non-White heroes with non-White adopted kids who become legacy heroes taking after their parents. Sometimes, it feels like you can't get a clear win any way you look at it.

I was worried I was the only one who thought that.

But you're right. I don't think legacy heroes should have to be related to their predecessors. I like the more egalitarian aspect of the millennial/gen z versions having separate origins. But if they are related why don't the PoC characters have legacies?

You're righr about PoC not being shown in normal family relationships. Couldn't any of the white heroes have PoC love interests? I mean, Scott Lang shows up as the new Ant-Man and already has a daughter, but Rhodey and Monica Rambeau don't, so the Ant-Man legacy is all white family while the more diverse Iron Man and Captain Marvel legacies aren't families.

That's not even getting into the extremely dated whitebread whiteness of the F4.

And none of the white heroes' legacies are mixed race

[Overhazard]

The same people who protested against civil rights are still alive as grandparents right now. It is sometimes easy to forget that. And it is very easy to forget that when you are half black (like me) and when you marry a white lady (like me).

My white grandma was not in my life until I was a teenager. Despite living in the same city as my black grandparents. Meaning, we could have seen her just as easily as we saw them. It was because, she basically DIDNT LIKE MY EXISTENCE. It was not ok my dad married a black chick and it was not ok he had black kids. I had no idea until I was much older and my dad told my wife, not even me lol.

Once she was around... she is totally nice to me. In fact, she gets nicer and nicer lol. You could never tell, she is 100% nice grandma. I don't know if she got over it, I don't know if she just deemed me as "a good one." No idea. For me... it is just weird.

My wife's grandparents have been nice to me from the instance I first went over there. My wife's grandpa is TOO nice... aka he won't stop talking to me lol. He is that talkative old man who has story after story. Wife's grandma has always been nice.

My wife's grandma when she was a kid had a black dog named *insert N word* And she dropped that story CASUALLY at a family gathering (I wasn't there). No one batted an eye except my wife, who asked her to explain herself. And the explanation was simply "it was no big deal, it was just a joke back then."

I've thought about that a lot sense then lol.

This **** is DEEPLY ingrained

If it's any kind of consolation, it's not always a race thing. Some families just shut people out. Both of my parents are black, but my father's family wants nothing to do with me. I'm persona non grata to them and to this day I have no freaking clue why. Its difficult to have a relationship with someone when the other party just doesn't seem interested.

[ed2962]

I was worried I was the only one who thought that.

But you're right. I don't think legacy heroes should have to be related to their predecessors. I like the more egalitarian aspect of the millennial/gen z versions having separate origins. But if they are related why don't the PoC characters have legacies?

You're righr about PoC not being shown in normal family relationships. Couldn't any of the white heroes have PoC love interests? I mean, Scott Lang shows up as the new Ant-Man and already has a daughter, but Rhodey and Monica Rambeau don't, so the Ant-Man legacy is all white family while the more diverse Iron Man and Captain Marvel legacies aren't families.

That's not even getting into the extremely dated whitebread whiteness of the F4.

And none of the white heroes' legacies are mixed race

I wanna say there was an Iron Man story where Tony's grand daughter from the future shows up. I'm not sure if they've used her since though.

[CosmiComic]

I wanna say there was an Iron Man story where Tony's grand daughter from the future shows up. I'm not sure if they've used her since though.

I can't recall that story