Ororo Munroe: Storm Appreciation 2019

[Marvell2100]

I don't think anyone has ever implied that negative views of his work are unwelcomed.

Certain posts would prove you wrong my friend.

There aren't as many fans of "Hadari Yao" as one would believe. A good many ignore that aspect of her character. If I'm being honest, I believe the math is different, so our calculations are bound to be different. Most fans gravitate to key personality traits in their faves. I know I do. I like all-powerful Storm, but most do not. I do not like powerless Storm, but other fans do and that's okay.

Here, you've stated your preference of how you like Storm portrayed. That's no different than what many BP fans have said. The only difference is that some choose to critique others pov and then call them wrong. My views don't match yours. That doesn't make either of us wrong. That means we have different tastes.

The comparison to Guggenheim is understandable, but it misses the mark for me. Guggenheim broke her down over her tragic leadership and left her there to bolster Kitty. Duggan remains to be seen. We know he has her in a right frame of mind.

I see where you were going, it just doesn't hold water for me. I'm clearly biased and I make no apologies. T'Challa isnt this weak man that most claim him to be under Coates. Not by my calculations. Our math is different and that's okay. I enjoy reading your posts. I hope you never stop sharing your views. I hope I never came across as if your criticism of Coates was less than.

Again, you've stated your preference and what you like. Some of us are just as biased and will make no apologies. I'm not here to change minds, I'm here to state my opinion. I bear no ill will or animosity and I rarely if ever speak from anger. I will continue to enjoy the dialogue with you, BK, Windrider, stormphoenix, guilty pleasure and the rest as well as many of my CBBs in the Panther thread . I will continue to post my opinions in this thread as well, popular or not.

However this constant need to "correct" BP fans who don't like Coates writing is something that really needs to be looked at.

My friend, we are always at peace with one another whether we agree or not. I'm zen like that.

[Mr MajestiK]

It had to be. Funeral of Mar-Vell and all.

One of the greatest stories ever written.

[GuiltyPleasure]

My apologies for misunderstanding your original post.

No worries. Thanks.

[butterflykyss]

Are there any posters currently posting within the BP Appreciation Thread, called "Usual Suspect?"

hey friend long time.

I'm not in the business of calling specific people out. hopefully the initial post spoke for itself.

Stating facts is saying that Marvell2100 does not like Coates BP.

Throwing shade is saying that Marvell2100 is wrong for not liking Coates because Coates writes a great BP.

That's the difference.

I never ssid anyone was wrong for not liking coates though. I only said people would not like him even if he wrote tchalla "perfectly."

Certain posts would prove you wrong my friend.


Here, you've stated your preference of how you like Storm portrayed. That's no different than what many BP fans have said. The only difference is that some choose to critique others pov and then call them wrong. My views don't match yours. That doesn't make either of us wrong. That means we have different tastes.




Again, you've stated your preference and what you like. Some of us are just as biased and will make no apologies. I'm not here to change minds, I'm here to state my opinion. I bear no ill will or animosity and I rarely if ever speak from anger. I will continue to enjoy the dialogue with you, BK, Windrider, stormphoenix, guilty pleasure and the rest as well as many of my CBBs in the Panther thread . I will continue to post my opinions in this thread as well, popular or not.

However this constant need to "correct" BP fans who don't like Coates writing is something that really needs to be looked at.

My friend, we are always at peace with one another whether we agree or not. I'm zen like that.

and you know there is no ill will on my end either. I love our exchanges both when we agree and disagree. I do question though at times if neither writer had tchalla doing similar things would that writer get similar heat that coates has gotten. I recall some posters saying ororo was just a bootie call for tchalla when he returned and that they didnt actually talk. well had those people let the story play out they would have seen those concerns were addressed in this latest issue. nevertheless, I'm not saying you or anyone else for that matter are wrong for their opinions on Coates but from the previous complaints I've seen some make I think he addressed those in this issue, which was why i made the case this was why there wasnt much for anyone to complain about because tchalla was shown in a favorable light.

[Marvell2100]

hey friend long time.

I'm not in the business of calling specific people out. hopefully the initial post spoke for itself.



I never ssid anyone was wrong for not liking coates though. I only said people would not like him even if he wrote tchalla "perfectly."




and you know there is no ill will on my end either. I love our exchanges both when we agree and disagree. I do question though at times if neither writer had tchalla doing similar things would that writer get similar heat that coates has gotten. I recall some posters saying ororo was just a bootie call for tchalla when he returned and that they didnt actually talk. well had those people let the story play out they would have seen those concerns were addressed in this latest issue. nevertheless, I'm not saying you or anyone else for that matter are wrong for their opinions on Coates but from the previous complaints I've seen some make I think he addressed those in this issue, which was why i made the case this was why there wasnt much for anyone to complain about because tchalla was shown in a favorable light.

Just because people haven't commented on it doesn't mean they see it as good.

Don McGregor is considered one of the greatest BP writers. I can't stand his T'Challa.

BP fans ripped Jonathan Maberry to shreds over Doom War.

Coates isn't the only one to feel our wrath.

[Shadey]

Just because people haven't commented on it doesn't mean they see it as good.

Don McGregor is considered one of the greatest BP writers. I can't stand his T'Challa.

BP fans ripped Jonathan Maberry to shreds over Doom War.

Coates isn't the only one to feel our wrath.

And mind you up until the 3rd issue of doomwar we were praising Mayberry until he started pulling his crap. We just tell it like it is.

[Ezyo1000]

hey friend long time.

I'm not in the business of calling specific people out. hopefully the initial post spoke for itself.



I never ssid anyone was wrong for not liking coates though. I only said people would not like him even if he wrote tchalla "perfectly."




and you know there is no ill will on my end either. I love our exchanges both when we agree and disagree. I do question though at times if neither writer had tchalla doing similar things would that writer get similar heat that coates has gotten. I recall some posters saying ororo was just a bootie call for tchalla when he returned and that they didnt actually talk. well had those people let the story play out they would have seen those concerns were addressed in this latest issue. nevertheless, I'm not saying you or anyone else for that matter are wrong for their opinions on Coates but from the previous complaints I've seen some make I think he addressed those in this issue, which was why i made the case this was why there wasnt much for anyone to complain about because tchalla was shown in a favorable light.

See heres where what your saying becomes shade throwing. You claim BP fans would still complain even if Coates wrote T'Challa perfectly because we don't like him. This is wholeheartedly false and has been disproven multiple times in The BP thread as posters (myself included) have given praise when Coates wrote a issue that in itself was average to decent. In fact there have been several issues that people have him credit where credit was due.

IF Coates started writing T'Challa in Character we would change our opinion on him. The problem is, issues are only decent in a vacuum, and even then they have shade throwing I them or aren't fully treating T'Challa as he should. And i said this in the BP thread.

In the entirety of Coates writing BP, 40+ issues in, T'Challa has NEVER defeated a villain by himself. Never. He always has help. You know the last time he tried? Issue two. He goes alone to capture Zenzi and lose. After that, Everytime he faces a villain it's with help. Coates took the phrase "No one Man (should have that much power)" and literally took it to mean, for T'Challa, he cannot and will not ever do anything of his own power to handle a situation alone. He literally doesn't have the power to overcome any villain to date without needing someone else there to help.

And in 3 different occasions he didn't even defeated the main villain. Adversary in S2, and twice now in S3 with N'Jadaka, first time is nu-Achebe a character no gives a isht about, second time is Okoye (who also I said issue appears to be the main character in the action shot before the fight while T'Challa takes the role of support

[Mr MajestiK]

hey friend long time.

I'm not in the business of calling specific people out. hopefully the initial post spoke for itself.



I never ssid anyone was wrong for not liking coates though. I only said people would not like him even if he wrote tchalla "perfectly."




and you know there is no ill will on my end either. I love our exchanges both when we agree and disagree. I do question though at times if neither writer had tchalla doing similar things would that writer get similar heat that coates has gotten. I recall some posters saying ororo was just a bootie call for tchalla when he returned and that they didnt actually talk. well had those people let the story play out they would have seen those concerns were addressed in this latest issue. nevertheless, I'm not saying you or anyone else for that matter are wrong for their opinions on Coates but from the previous complaints I've seen some make I think he addressed those in this issue, which was why i made the case this was why there wasnt much for anyone to complain about because tchalla was shown in a favorable light.

Hey friend,

It's been awhile but I didn't go anywhere.

Being the sole individual who automatically cancelled Coates from day one before he penned his first issue of BP, I wear the "Usual Suspect" tag with confidence.

I read Coates a$$ backwards views on the BP mythos in interviews before he started writing the book and new from jump, that he had ZERO good intentions for T'Challa, Wakanda or the aforementioned mythos from jump.

I was the sole poster in the BP Appreciation thread who refused to partake of the Coates Koolaid because I foresaw what a writer with his particularly biased mindset would inflict 9n the mythos and now, three years later, most of my fellow posters in the BP thread have now understood why I took the stance I did.

Coates has done good by Storm at the BP mythos expense in a manner that no X-enthusiast would countenance or accept if the shoe were on the other foot and this my friend, is why there will always be a divide between a fanbase that should be united by a mutually shared appreciation of the MU but remains at odds because some wilfully choose to diminish the justified concerns of others.

This will probably be my last post on this subject for the simple fact that this is the Storm Appreciation thread and as such, I have no wish nor desire to take up space discussing the BP mythos herein but suffice it to say, that I sincerely hope Coates wilful derailment of the BP mythos to prop up and elevate Storm is appreciated and acknowledged by the X-office with a commensurate and quantifiable raising of Ororo's profile within her own family of books.

[The Quiet Councilor]

Hey friend,

It's been awhile but I didn't go anywhere.

Being the sole individual who automatically cancelled Coates from day one before he penned his first issue of BP, I wear the "Usual Suspect" tag with confidence.

I read Coates a$$ backwards views on the BP mythos in interviews before he started writing the book and new from jump, that he had ZERO good intentions for T'Challa, Wakanda or the aforementioned mythos from jump.

I was the sole poster in the BP Appreciation thread who refused to partake of the Coates Koolaid because I foresaw what a writer with his particularly biased mindset would inflict 9n the mythos and now, three years later, most of my fellow posters in the BP thread have now understood why I took the stance I did.

Coates has done good by Storm at the BP mythos expense in a manner that no X-enthusiast would countenance or accept if the shoe were on the other foot and this my friend, is why there will always be a divide between a fanbase that should be united by a mutually shared appreciation of the MU but remains at odds because some wilfully choose to diminish the justified concerns of others.

This will probably be my last post on this subject for the simple fact that this is the Storm Appreciation thread and as such, I have no wish nor desire to take up space discussing the BP mythos herein but suffice it to say, that I sincerely hope Coates wilful derailment of the BP mythos to prop up and elevate Storm is appreciated and acknowledged by the X-office with a commensurate and quantifiable raising of Ororo's profile within her own family of books.

Hudlin lifted BP at the expense of Storm, so I say Coates is just righting some past wrongs.

Storm should have never been in his shadow. That was the great failure of the relationship the first time around.

[jwatson]

Poor Tchalla fans. BP #18 was just trash. A whole issue devoted to showing once again what a blind a$$ man Tchalla is. One who is so primally self indulgent he missed all the signs in front of him. His talk with mother Ororo just felt so tedious and pointless. we get it Coates Tchalla is the most selfish blind privliedged black man in the history of the MU and now he knows it too. This as garbage imo. And Mama Ororo chastising the man for being born with a vibranium spoon in his mouth so of course he couldn't possibly understand the REAL world. *barf*

Oh and i was right. This whole Storm/Tchalla conversation i didn't hear Nakia mentioned once so once again. We don't know what Tchalla told her about the situation she just inferred and basically dressed Nakia down in the nicest way same way Mother Ororo did here with Tchalla. I wonder if they sell Lightning shaped halos in Wakanda so Hardari Mother can complete her look.

[Mr MajestiK]

Hudlin lifted BP at the expense of Storm, so I say Coates is just righting some past wrongs.

Storm should have never been in his shadow. That was the great failure of the relationship the first time around.

Considering the fact that it was Reginald Hudlin who actually took the time to have Ororo discovering and reconnecting with the paternal side of her family whilst the X-writers spent their collective time twiddling their creative thumbs, I'd say that your non-argument is wholly lacking in merit or qualifiable substance.

If the X-office were genuinely interested in doing anything constructive with Ororo, they would have done so once they managed to "rescue" her from the clutches of big bad T'Challa.

But alas, her development is all taking place in the wait for it....self same Black Panther's solo book.

The place for substantive character development where Storm is concerned, should be taking place within her own core family of books as opposed to being done within the pages of another characters solo book.

[The Quiet Councilor]

Considering the fact that it was Reginald Hudlin who actually took the time to have Ororo discovering and reconnecting with the paternal side of her family whilst the X-writers spent their collective time twiddling their creative thumbs, I'd say that your non-argument is wholly lacking in merit or qualifiable substance.

If the X-office were genuinely interested in doing anything constructive with Ororo, they would have done so once they managed to "rescue" her from the clutches of big bad T'Challa.

But alas, her development is all taking place in the wait for it....self same Black Panther's solo book.

The place for substantive character development where Storm is concerned, should be taking place within her own core family of books as opposed to being done within the pages of another characters solo book.

He introduced them and did nothing else with them. Storm was a prop in Hudlin’s run. McDuffie did a much better job of presenting them as equals.

[Mr MajestiK]

He introduced them and did nothing else with them. Storm was a prop in Hudlin’s run. McDuffie did a much better job of presenting them as equals.

None of which changes the fact that the X-office have done nothing to develop Ororo's character in a meaningful manner that shows commitment to elevating her within the MU.

It's not the responsibility for any other writers outside of her core family of books to do the heavy lifting of character building for her.

And as far as being presented as "equals" goes, how's that equality thing working out for the mutants with this whole Homo Superiority Vs flatscan thing working out under Hickman?

Is Ororo anything other than a prop in the X-books at present?

[The Quiet Councilor]

None of which changes the fact that the X-office have done nothing to develop Ororo's character in a meaningful manner that shows commitment to elevating her within the MU.

It's not the responsibility for any other writers outside of her core family of books to do the heavy lifting of character building for her.

And as far as being presented as "equals" goes, how's that equality thing working out for the mutants with this whole Homo Superiority Vs flatscan thing working out under Hickman?

Is Ororo anything other than a prop in the X-books at present?

Oh, I’m very critical of her handling by the X-office. Doesn’t change Hudlin’s failures no matter how much you deflect.

[Vibranium Weave]

Oh, I’m very critical of her handling by the X-office. Doesn’t change Hudlin’s failures no matter how much you deflect.

Coates should just write a Storm solo & leave T'Challa alone, honestly.