T'Challa: The Black Panther Appreciation 2024

[Ekie]

Which sides would Queen Divine Justice, Vibraxas, and Okoye be on?

The righteous side ofcourse, big QDJ fan.

[Marvell2100]

I credit alot of Coates early sales to Hickman's showings T'Challa plus Avengers EMH had been out at the time and created a bunch of fans.
Maybe Marvel saw those early sales and thought tearing down T'Challa was a preffered direction

Plus there was buzz surrounding the upcoming movie and this was the first BP solo since Hudlin/Maberry's run ended. People were hyped.

Alot of those initial fans were also Coates fans who dropped the book really quick after the start of the 2nd arc I believe.

[skyvolt2000]

Plus there was buzz surrounding the upcoming movie and this was the first BP solo since Hudlin/Maberry's run ended. People were hyped.

Alot of those initial fans were also Coates fans who dropped the book really quick after the start of the 2nd arc I believe.

Remember when the movie came out we saw the Black Panther wave that saw everything Black Panther trades wise dominate Amazon trade sales including BP WOW that was top 150 before it came out. A wave that we saw last a good 5 years.

I think most folks stayed for the first Coates series as those trades sold until we saw the decrease of folks not coming back for volume two of the first run. The second Coates run really didn't dominate in sales as much as the earlier runs and BP WOW and The Crew.

Aside from that Coates first trade and some of the Hudlin and Priest stuff-it's do right ULTRA Rare to see any volume since sniff top 100 trade sales on Amazon.

[Redjack]

That was clearly too much Black Excellence and forward thinking for them to handle. You should have thrown in some societal dysfunction (red-herrings) to make it seem not so: Black Futurist Africa is AWESOME!!!

Wakanda's a utopia.

[Ezyo1000]

I belive her dream book is a storm solo based on her early interviews. This book just landed in her lap and she was excited to world build in the setting

That would honestly be insane. I think there would have to be more than chance. I would believe that maybe Coates put word in for her or something. Because if it fell into her lap while we know RJ wants the book that'd would be craziness

[Redjack]

That would honestly be insane. I think there would have to be more than chance. I would believe that maybe Coates put word in for her or something. Because if it fell into her lap while we know RJ wants the book that'd would be craziness

RJ is never getting that book.

[Ekie]

That would honestly be insane. I think there would have to be more than chance. I would believe that maybe Coates put word in for her or something. Because if it fell into her lap while we know RJ wants the book that'd would be craziness

From what I remember reading she made it sound like editor Wil Moss just called her up and offered her the book. She didn't submit a pitch (or whatever the comics equivalent for it is).
That's why I keep on saying he put her in a bad spot.

[Ezyo1000]

RJ is never getting that book.

I refuse to accept that. If folk's are just getting handed the book who have little to no experience in comics why sideline a veteran who checks the boxes to make a good BP book

[Emperorjones]

Plus there was buzz surrounding the upcoming movie and this was the first BP solo since Hudlin/Maberry's run ended. People were hyped.

Alot of those initial fans were also Coates fans who dropped the book really quick after the start of the 2nd arc I believe.

I'm re-reading/reading Coates run now, and I would agree that he got a lot of help by his book coming out in BP's 50th anniversary year, and the rising buzz for the Black Panther movie. And Coates also was a celebrity writer. He was someone lavished with praise in the liberal mainstream media, so he brought prestige to the title and to Marvel. So, he had a lot of the liberal mainstream cultural zeitgeist behind his book and also pushing it, whether it was quality writing/art or not, because he basically was saying what they believed, and wanted to hear.

I finished his first 12 issues, his "A Nation Under Our Feet" arc last night. I do think it's a stronger 12-issues than Ridley's twelve. I haven't gotten Dr. Ewing's ninth issue yet, but so far, Coates's first eight issues were stronger than her first eight. That said, it's the third act in particular where I see more of T'Challa taking a backseat, of him being a bit too deferential to Shuri, of Shuri being praised by Aneka while T'Challa is blamed for what befell Wakanda (which means Shuri isn't going to be held accountable for her role, which is a feminist double standard). As I was reading this arc, and seeing people ripping T'Challa apart-which he largely accepted-I was thinking that he wouldn't have to consult with "torturers", and that he would've (or should've known) all the things Shuri and Changamire said, and that he wouldn't have been as out of touch with his people that things would get so bad that The People or the Midnight Angels would find audiences.

And while I think Coates sought to make Wakanda more "realistic" he didn't really factor in how advanced they are, even though he mentions it, or rather the word "advanced". And he didn't really contend with how Wakanda crumbling would affect the rest of 616-Earth. He also shortchanges how the Midnight Angels take over the Jabari lands, and how they so quickly build a matriarchal utopia there. This goes along with his feminist thinking that women are naturally better and more civilized, and so forth.

I also think Coates's tends to go on with dialogue (like me, I suppose), philosophizing, and that doesn't mesh well with his action. I thought the insufferable Changamire is a self-insert character for Coates, and he allows Coates to spend lots of pages on just talking with little action. The history lesson about American slavery is something that felt more Coates than germane to the book, and it was a stretch to believe that T'Challa wouldn't know the history of slavery in America.

Coates cares more about talking, than action, and that's why his confrontation between T'Challa and The People's shaman was anticlimactic, and over quickly. I do give Coates credit that he let T'Challa be the one to take him down, and not have Shuri or one of the Midnight Angels do it.

I didn't read Hickman much, so it was hard for me to buy that Wakanda was in such dire straits, and I also felt that Coates didn't do a great job of depicting how bad things were, or how widespread the rebellion is. I didn't get why all the Dora Milaje would join the Midnight Angels, or that Wakanda would be so weak. It's mentioned somewhat in dialogue, but I didn't feel it was well depicted on the page. I will give Coates's points for reaching back to DoomWar and the stupid decision for T'Challa to go to Hell's Kitchen instead of helping rebuild Wakanda after DoomWar. But while T'Challa does have some things to answer for, so does Shuri, and one could argue Ramonda for that matter. The focus on T'Challa alone speaks to the feminist bent of Coates's writing/thinking, but it seems to me that angry Wakandans would want both T'Challa and Shuri to go.

That said, I'm not taking into consideration all the things happening in larger Marvel that might have pulled T'Challa away from keeping up on Wakanda, or how his grief over Shuri's loss might have affected him. Further, I should consider as well that many Wakandans were traumatized and looking for someone to blame for their losses and defeats, a scapegoat, and the still alive king is as good as any. And to be fair to Coates's he didn't exactly make T'Challa all bad, or the Midnight Angels and Changamire all good. He gave them doubts too, unlike Ridley who was more black-and-white in his vilification of T'Challa.


I do like that Coates tried to differentiate Shuri and give her a different power set, though I also think he made her too powerful compared to T'Challa (in terms of saying she's everything Wakanda was, or something like that, like she's the collective knowledge of Wakanda, so what does that mean for T'Challa to be King of the Dead?). And if she's that powerful, what need is there for T'Challa? I did like that Coates had Shuri backing, and not undercutting her brother. I also liked that Shuri was harder against their opponents, but at the same time, this goes back to DoomWar where Shuri was harder edged. I feel that's done because it pushes the media narrative that Black women are more take charge than Black men. With Ridley and Ewing, Shuri has gone back more to her MCU version, which I think is disappointing, though I get they wanted to synch her comics depiction again more with the MCU because of Wakanda Forever.

I think Dr. Ewing does a better job of depicting how average Wakandans are living, better than Coates and Ridley. Ridley focused more on the obnoxious Tosin, whereas Coates focused more on the leaders of The People, Changamire, and the Midnight Angels, who arguably were all more elite, and spoke more abstractly. Freed prisoner M'Bali was the only average Wakandan that got a voice really in "A Nation Under Our Feet", but she was often in the background throughout most of this arc. I should throw in Kwabena Ware as another average Wakandan, but like M'Bali he didn't get that much spotlight.

[Emperorjones]

Im surprised with the empahsis BP runs have used Shuri and White Wolf (and movie Killmonger) that no one’s brought back Jakarra yet.
I doubt most readers today even knows who he is or his relation to T’Challa.

I'm with you on that. I would like to see him back. He could've worked as a villain either in Ridley or Ewing's runs, and it meant more than what they've done.

[MindofShadow]

Jakarra was in Rise

I belive her dream book is a storm solo based on her early interviews. This book just landed in her lap and she was excited to world build in the setting

Do you think she'd put Storm in a **** hole city too?

[Frontier]

Jakarra was in Rise





Do you think she'd put Storm in a **** hole city too?

Probably not. Storm doesn't need to be Batman .

[Ezyo1000]

The only thing good to come out of Coates run were the aesthetics, the force push, and Shuri getting a powerset different from T'Challa. The MA criticizing the WK government (which of you read gays world of Wakanda, you see thenMA are the cause of the problem starting in coates book) then turn around and start executing people who don't agree with them, side with known terrorists, Refuse to assist in protecting their people, then demand they be left to keep the Jabari lands they killed for. Then they get pissed at T'Challa for SHURI telling rape victims they should've accepted their fate.

The irony is that in his quest to make Black women seem more capable or take charge, he made them hypocrites and actually less capable because they would never be held accountable for their actions

[marvelprince]

I credit alot of Coates early sales to Hickman's showing of T'Challa plus Avengers EMH had been out at the time and created a bunch of fans.
Maybe Marvel saw those early sales and thought tearing down T'Challa was a preffered direction

Probably more to do with him being an established writer at the time. I know it’s cool to hate Coates now but at the time people were really hyped for the title.

[Marvell2100]

Probably more to do with him being an established writer at the time. I know it’s cool to hate Coates now but at the time people were really hyped for the title.

Then we read the book. And hell soon followed.