T'Challa: The Black Panther Appreciation 2024

[KingNomarch]

Looks like Ult T’Challa won’t be joining the Ultimates just yet. Ideally I’d want his first meeting with the team to be akin to EMH or his F4 introduction but that’s just wishful thinking.

[Redjack]

To play devils advocate then - would you recommend Coates run to someone who has never read BP before? (or maybe only read Hickmans take, for instance)

From there - they can go backwards to read better runs, but this is a good modern jumping on point?

I would tell them to ignore everything since Coates came in, except KiB. The Avengers stuff is good but not really part of the Black Panther run. While SOME of the single stories are solid, they were all made to support Coates' vision which was cancerous to the franchise. Best to ignore.

A new reader should start with the Priest run if they want to feel what was felt when he changed the game in regard to the Panther. While Dr. Ewing has done a solid job with what was left her (I disagree with BP = Batman but it's a fair take) Coates and Ridley basically destroyed everything that was built prior.

A new reader, starting with Coates, will not understand how and why this thing got as big as it did.

[Emperorjones]

Read Dr. Ewing's latest. This is one of her best issues to me. We are finally getting some answers and it feels like things are moving faster. I liked the design of the demon. If the next issue is the last, I think this storyline will be finished, so there's that. I doubt Dr. Ewing will have the time and space to put T'Challa back on the thrown or sprout the seeds she's planted about things not being quite right in the Golden City.


The other day I finished Coates "Avengers of the New World" arc and I've started the Intergalactic Empire of Wakanda.

I think Coates's first arc was stronger than his second, though his writing isn't as ponderous in the second arc, and from what I've read of "Intergalactic" so far, "Intergalactic" is the most fluid writing yet, which shows progression on his part. I feel that "Avengers" felt too much like a retread of the first arc, except that he focused on religious problems instead of ideological/philosophical/political ones. I do like the name Ras the Exhorter, and the look was okay too, but this character was way too underdeveloped. I think both of Coates's first arcs might have been better if he had established Klaw as the mastermind behind everything and then built up to a confrontation between Klaw and T'Challa. I felt Coates was mirroring his take on T'Challa with Klaw, in that he was desperate to be reunited with his sister. However, how Coates resolved that was anticlimactic, and a lot of the "Avengers" arc was as well.

He introduced (I'm assuming here) a whole new pantheon of Wakandan gods, but he didn't do much with them. He made the Originators too primitive and didn't satisfactorily end that storyline as well. I didn't know who Asira was, or why she was important, and so the twist there didn't work for me. I wish they had built her up more in the book first, and also that they had told us the name she is better known by right off so I could understand the stakes better.

When it comes to the Midnight Angels and Dora Milaje, it's like Coates seems to reverse course a bit, and now have them being more willing to serve under T'Challa. I'm not sure if that's because he felt he went too far in the first arc, got pushback, or if it goes along with his seesaw style, because I feel he goes back and forth a lot. It might add ambiguity, complexity, and nuance, but it also speaks to Coates's (in my opinion) doubting, vacillating style (and that's how he approaches his characters, particularly T'Challa). I don't know why the Midnight Angels needed to be in this story at all, or why Klaw wanted to use one of their brains to resurrect his sister. There had to be millions of people in Azania to do that. It just felt like Coates shoehorning the Midnight Angels in. (I'm still glad they weren't as antagonistic toward T'Challa anymore though).

I enjoyed how Coates writes Storm and T'Challa, that's one of the best parts of his run so far. The artwork here wasn't as good as in the first arc, and I get what one you said about them making T'Challa look too old. "Avengers" whimpers out and it makes me wonder if he had more planned and he wasn't able to do it, because there were a lot of loose ends at the end of that arc.

For my two cents, if I had to recommend who to start with, I would go with Hudlin. I found Who Is the Black Panther? a great introduction to the character and his world. I would not recommend Coates unless you already knew something beforehand about the character and could perhaps appreciate Coates's take on him. To me, it's not as horrible as I thought it was, but it's not the greatest thing ever either. It has the kind of air of a college discussion.

[Frontier]

Looks like Ult T’Challa won’t be joining the Ultimates just yet. Ideally I’d want his first meeting with the team to be akin to EMH or his F4 introduction but that’s just wishful thinking.

That would be cool .

[butterflykyss]

I have talked to people outside this forum to and guess what? The vast majority that say they like Coates run, haven't actually read anything before him. His run was their exposure to BP.

I have talked to a lot of people who have read BP before Coates and it ain't it. His run is just as bad as Ridley. The difference is that that Ridley didn't have as much buzz around him as coats and since he burned away all the goodwill, Ridley had Even less room for error (Which he butchered it) and Ewing has even less because of Ridley, and she has done better than Coates and Ridley.

As for your second part. No, Hickman left T'Challa having him sending off an Alpha flight to the stars with T'Challa saying Wakanda was going to pull humanity to space and ended on a very positive trend

well I don't think either of us would be able to quantify the number of folks who liked or didn't like the run based upon social media interactions. so I won't attempt to argue against those you've talked to, I just know I've talked with many comic readers who enjoyed his run.

tchallas contributions during this period, imho, can't be denied:

[IMG]https://i1.wp.com/multiversitystatic.s3.amazonaws.com/uploads/2016/01/secretwars9-6.jpg?fit=624%2C309[/IMG


[IMG]https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/53a2f2e5e4b01da0d6aee932/1468463029712-ZTTNYZ0DWMGCZEUIXMGP/image-asset.png[/IMG





This is the end of Secret Wars. T'Challa restored the universe right to the point of the beginning of New Avengers/Illuminati #1. This is before the Incursions began and Shuri is still alive.

to the incursion point, thank you for the correction.

when did this alpha flight revelation happen respective to the following:





before or after?

edit: so just reread the incursion didn't happen right? just want to clarify I don't remember.

[skyvolt2000]

For Black History month at the library across from my school they had free coloring pages.

Franklin (Peanuts)
Static (I have seen that art but I can't remember who the artist was)
Panther
Storm
Miles

They had larger display with some comic related black history stuff.

It was mainly Miles and T'Challa.

Side note-it was funny to see how much DC was left out. Because other libraries it was the same thing. Marvel and other companies used but DC left out.

[Marvell2100]

well I don't think either of us would be able to quantify the number of folks who liked or didn't like the run based upon social media interactions. so I won't attempt to argue against those you've talked to, I just know I've talked with many comic readers who enjoyed his run.

tchallas contributions during this period, imho, can't be denied:








to the incursion point, thank you for the correction.

when did this alpha flight revelation happen respective to the following:





before or after?

edit: so just reread the incursion didn't happen right? just want to clarify I don't remember.

Hey BK, The Alpha Flight program was in effect before the events depicted in the image.

The Incursions still occurred, but T'Challa restored the universe to the the point prior to the first Incursion wave happening. That was part of the reason why he started the Alpha Flight program

[Dariel81]

well I don't think either of us would be able to quantify the number of folks who liked or didn't like the run based upon social media interactions. so I won't attempt to argue against those you've talked to, I just know I've talked with many comic readers who enjoyed his run.

tchallas contributions during this period, imho, can't be denied:








to the incursion point, thank you for the correction.

when did this alpha flight revelation happen respective to the following:





before or after?

edit: so just reread the incursion didn't happen right? just want to clarify I don't remember.

lol that panel always make me laugh both had to have that end of the world “Adult time”

[MindofShadow]

MCU Killmonger to me is Magneto from the very first X-Men film. Suffers a traumatic event at a young age, spends rest of life believing they're getting back at their persecutors, when in actuality, they just want to be at the top of the pile of skulls. There's some depth, but the actors in both cases are putting a huge amount of work into them (and I think Coogler's a better director than a writer). The writing might be "deep" in comparison to the other MCU efforts with villains, but it's not really that dimensional when compared to other work. Both are clearly villains. People typically talk about Killmonger killing his girlfriend or choking the elder in the Heart-Shaped Herb garden, but even the way he taunts and torments the museum worker as she dies via poison speaks to his malice.

Exactly.

Dude is just a villain.

Black Twitter tried to make him more than that. But he's just a villain lol.

Ain't no different than how White Twitter had to think Loki was sucha nice guy (pre tv show). Despite the fact he grew up as royalty when he should have been dead. But "woe his me his brothers shadow"... naw he's a villain lol.

so if my memory serves me correct, Coates picks up right after tchalla left his sister as the planet was going to be destroyed due to harmonic conversion, right?

Shuri died in hickmans run basically committing suicide charging Proxima after T'challa/Shuri/HZ tried to infiltrate

Shuri mentally broke and decided to have a warriors death/suicide and let T'challa go save the world.

[king of hybrids]

Here’s a question; which has been more useful to T’Challa as a character; all of the ‘worldbuilding’ of the last few runs or Aaron’s incredibly stupid but somewhat entertaining Avengers run with “hey! Black Panthers used to to team up with immortals and legacies all the time. Now go team up with Odin for weird and wacky adventures” that regrettably got cut short?

[dkrook]

Here’s a question; which has been more useful to T’Challa as a character; all of the ‘worldbuilding’ of the last few runs or Aaron’s incredibly stupid but somewhat entertaining Avengers run with “hey! Black Panthers used to to team up with immortals and legacies all the time. Now go team up with Odin for weird and wacky adventures” that regrettably got cut short?

Odd question, but if you're talking about Aaron's regular Avengers book? Yes it was more entertaining to see T'Challa in. If you are talking about that Avengers 100000 B.C., then all that was trash anyway cause it was basically Odin smashing off The Phoenix. All these Uber ancient gods and Black Panther was a bruh with an animal skin....?? We seen all these powerful beings and my mind went into overload thinking that this first Black Panther might be the mightest, maybe he had a greater portion of Bast power and that would put him on par with the others. Perhaps this was Bast o.g. form. NOPE! Black guy and a spear...??????? .....I hate Aaron forever for that mess. Sadly the few runs did more add to T'Challa, I just hate 85% of what was added.

[Ekie]

Here’s a question; which has been more useful to T’Challa as a character; all of the ‘worldbuilding’ of the last few runs or Aaron’s incredibly stupid but somewhat entertaining Avengers run with “hey! Black Panthers used to to team up with immortals and legacies all the time. Now go team up with Odin for weird and wacky adventures” that regrettably got cut short?

The latter for me. Even if silly its atleast not destructive.
That's not to say that World building isn't wanted and needed it's just that it was done so poorly that it's a blight on the franchise.
Besides, a lot of Feats in those panels from Aaron. His Panther was extremely powerful/capable.

[Redjack]

Here’s a question; which has been more useful to T’Challa as a character; all of the ‘worldbuilding’ of the last few runs or Aaron’s incredibly stupid but somewhat entertaining Avengers run with “hey! Black Panthers used to to team up with immortals and legacies all the time. Now go team up with Odin for weird and wacky adventures” that regrettably got cut short?

Worldbuilding is meal prep.

Make it the meal and you will suffer.

[Ezyo1000]

Odd question, but if you're talking about Aaron's regular Avengers book? Yes it was more entertaining to see T'Challa in. If you are talking about that Avengers 100000 B.C., then all that was trash anyway cause it was basically Odin smashing off The Phoenix. All these Uber ancient gods and Black Panther was a bruh with an animal skin....?? We seen all these powerful beings and my mind went into overload thinking that this first Black Panther might be the mightest, maybe he had a greater portion of Bast power and that would put him on par with the others. Perhaps this was Bast o.g. form. NOPE! Black guy and a spear...??????? .....I hate Aaron forever for that mess. Sadly the few runs did more add to T'Challa, I just hate 85% of what was added.

Honestly? I didn't care much because it wasn't T'Challa who got punked out. Ultimately it was some random and ALL the Bc Avengers got murked while Odin was busy trying to get Some from Phoenix.

But I would take JAs stuff all day everyday. T'CHALLA was shown as capable and a true leader. And he was pulling feats left and right, kicking the hell out of khonshu and Mk, vamps, wolverine, Batman, Superman and Flash analogues, and was Making political power plays which was a interesting place he was taking the Avengers that I really which was focused on.

World building that doesn't focus on T'Challa is a waste of panel space. No one is paying money to read about rando Wakandans who are going to be gone come next writer

[Username taken]

For Black History month at the library across from my school they had free coloring pages.

Franklin (Peanuts)
Static (I have seen that art but I can't remember who the artist was)
Panther
Storm
Miles

They had larger display with some comic related black history stuff.

It was mainly Miles and T'Challa.

Side note-it was funny to see how much DC was left out. Because other libraries it was the same thing. Marvel and other companies used but DC left out.

If one is looking for black characters in comics, the independents are the way to go.

From Killadelphia to Spawn to House of Slaughter, the indies are doing a much much better job at minority representation than the big 2.