Black Panther Appreciation: Wakanda Forever!

[Mr MajestiK]

I don't think it was because of BP's appearance in the MCU. BP #1 sold very very well because of Coates who has more than half a million followers on Twitter. If it wasn't really Coates then he wouldn't be the one writing WOW and BPATC. He may not be the best BP writer, Marvel believes in his popularity and writing skills.

You're entitled to believe whatever you choose to but as I said previously, never conflate quality with quantity.

Marvel's primary objective as a company, is to turn a healthyear profit whilst appearing dedicated to diversity amongst their creative teams as well as within the books they publish as well.

To achieve said diversity objectives, they've reached out to writers from different ethnic, religious, gender and sexual orientation backgrounds in the hopes that these moves will attract new and diverse readers to their books which is in fact quite laudable and in the case of Coates BP, obviously financially successful.

Unfortunately, Marvel have also lost sight of the fact that long term readers who in many cases have been following these characters and their books for decades, now feel short-changed and in some cases, totally disrespected by some writers who exhibit disdain for the source material that predated their arrival on the scene.

Coates as far as most long term BP enthusiasts are concerned, falls into this category.

Kasper Cole was 100% right about T'Challa's MCU appearance in the Captain America: Civil War movie sparking an interest in the character amongst the general movie going public.

Calls for a Black Panther movie prior to Coates arrival denote that the character was always Popular regardless of sustained editorial sloppiness and pushback on the part of some creative teams from other parts of the Marvel family who refused to be professional.

Coates twitter followers and associated cognoscenti have contributed to the books massive sales but that in no way should serve as any indication that the finished product is anything but the false narrative dependent twaddle that it is.

[Mr MajestiK]

Coates deserves some credit, but it was the movie buzz had a bigger impact. BP's appearance in Civil War and his own movie buzz was the greater impact. If Marvel pushed BP like this during Priest or Hudlin's run, the results would have been the same. Hudlin was just as well known as Coates outside of the comics.

We've made this argument before. If BP #1 sold so well only because of Coates and his popularity, then why the huge drop off in sales. Where are the legions of Coates followers?

Stop being so logical.

[Agent Z]

Coates deserves some credit, but it was the movie buzz had a bigger impact. BP's appearance in Civil War and his own movie buzz was the greater impact. If Marvel pushed BP like this during Priest or Hudlin's run, the results would have been the same. Hudlin was just as well known as Coates outside of the comics.

We've made this argument before. If BP #1 sold so well only because of Coates and his popularity, then why the huge drop off in sales. Where are the legions of Coates followers?

Sales drops are pretty common in comics these days for a variety of factors.

[Marvell2100]

Sales drops are pretty common in comics these days for a variety of factors.

Sure they are. One of them being that all those fans are no longer interested in the story. RLAAMJR attributed the high sales of BP#1 solely to Coates and his followers. By that logic, if his half million followers had remained, the drop off wouldn't have been so huge.

[Marvell2100]

Stop being so logical.

BCB it's like I said, gotta keep this thread honest.

And I will definitely be at HEF more.

[Mike_Murdock]

I wouldn't say it's because Coates did "better", but more so that Black Panther has become a hot property because of his appearance in the MCU. T'Challa started getting used more and more throughout the Marvel Universe BEFORE Coates even agreed to write the title.

Marvel is just doing things that many of us were asking them to do years ago, but that they refused to do. When Priest, Hudlin, and Liss were handling the character Marvel kept T'Challa in his own little corner of the Marvel universe and there wasn't an apparent mandate that other writers use the character in their book.

The sales for the first issue had nothing to do with the quality of the book, it was just the buzz surrounding the character at the time and Coates name.

I agree that Black Panther sales aren't necessarily correlated with the quality of the book, but Coates name has allowed there to be several BP books simply because he draws in an outside audience to the book. This audience hasn't read any other comic books and don't have a baseline to compare it to. I personally still think that's a good thing. The comic audience needs to grow and I hope these people will be inspired to check out the runs of this character from the past now that they've dipped their toe into the comic world. Of course, outsiders are unlikely to become Wednesday Warriors. I think many have grown bored with the monthly format and have either switched to digital or waiting for trade. Or, of course, abandoning it entirely after checking it out briefly. I'll save a rant about the direct market for another day, though.

I disagree with the suggestion that the book sales are due to Civil War. Doctor Strange with Jason Aaron wasn't noticeably improved due to headlining a movie. A cameo in Civil War doesn't move the needle that much.

[Marvell2100]

I agree that Black Panther sales aren't necessarily correlated with the quality of the book, but Coates name has allowed there to be several BP books simply because he draws in an outside audience to the book. This audience hasn't read any other comic books and don't have a baseline to compare it to. I personally still think that's a good thing. The comic audience needs to grow and I hope these people will be inspired to check out the runs of this character from the past now that they've dipped their toe into the comic world. Of course, outsiders are unlikely to become Wednesday Warriors. I think many have grown bored with the monthly format and have either switched to digital or waiting for trade. Or, of course, abandoning it entirely after checking it out briefly. I'll save a rant about the direct market for another day, though.

I disagree with the suggestion that the book sales are due to Civil War. Doctor Strange with Jason Aaron wasn't noticeably improved due to headlining a movie. A cameo in Civil War doesn't move the needle that much.

Hudlin's name is just as recognized as Coates, maybe moreso, outside of comics. Had he launched a BP solo around these same circumstances, the results would have been similar. There's no denying Coates' name and reputation had an impact on sales. But to attribute it solely to him or even the majority of it to him does a disservice to BP fans who were enthusiasts long before Coates' relaunch and disregards how much buzz his appearance in CW and news of his own movie had in the success of the new series. And it goes far beyond just the posters in this forum.

[DigiCom]

I don't think it was because of BP's appearance in the MCU. BP #1 sold very very well because of Coates who has more than half a million followers on Twitter. If it wasn't really Coates then he wouldn't be the one writing WOW and BPATC. He may not be the best BP writer, Marvel believes in his popularity and writing skills.

So where are they? Sales on the ongoing are down to the same levels they've always been.

And as for WOW: The last issue sold 15,847, and all signs are that this week's issue is the last. So much for the grand Coates franchise.

I disagree with the suggestion that the book sales are due to Civil War. Doctor Strange with Jason Aaron wasn't noticeably improved due to headlining a movie. A cameo in Civil War doesn't move the needle that much.

Doctor Strange also regularly outsells BP. Does this mean Aaron is better known than Coates?

[XPac]

Coates deserves some credit, but it was the movie buzz had a bigger impact. BP's appearance in Civil War and his own movie buzz was the greater impact. If Marvel pushed BP like this during Priest or Hudlin's run, the results would have been the same. Hudlin was just as well known as Coates outside of the comics.

We've made this argument before. If BP #1 sold so well only because of Coates and his popularity, then why the huge drop off in sales. Where are the legions of Coates followers?

It's hard to say what had the biggest impact. Several marvel characters got movies without generating 300k sales, so I think it likely needed to be a combination of both. Though I guess we'll get a better idea after we see the comic sales when the next movie comes out.

I will say this ... even if another writer achieved the same sames numbers Coates achieved there's no way they could have sustained it. Any writer would have had a huge drop in sales.

[Mike_Murdock]

^ Jason Aaron is better than Coates. He's probably Marvel's biggest writer currently outside of Brian Michael Bendis.

Hudlin's name is just as recognized as Coates, maybe moreso, outside of comics. Had he launched a BP solo around these same circumstances, the results would have been similar. There's no denying Coates' name and reputation had an impact on sales. But to attribute it solely to him or even the majority of it to him does a disservice to BP fans who were enthusiasts long before Coates' relaunch and disregards how much buzz his appearance in CW and news of his own movie had in the success of the new series. And it goes far beyond just the posters in this forum.

I think it would have been a different story if Hudlin's run came out after the popularity of Twitter.

[DigiCom]

^ Jason Aaron is better than Coates. He's probably Marvel's biggest writer currently outside of Brian Michael Bendis.

I said "better known." Because your own statement was that BP was doing "so well" (last month, 37K) because Coates' name brought in outside readers, not because of CA:CW. But for the last few months, Strange has been outselling it. By your logic, that must mean that Aaron brings in more outside readers than Coates, right? It can't possibly be a minor bump from the movie....

[Kasper Cole]

*reads last several posts*
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So people are just going to carry on as if I didn't clearly say the bump in sales was due to Panther's role in Captain America: Civil War AND Coates name?

The sales for the first issue had nothing to do with the quality of the book, it was just the buzz surrounding the character at the time and Coates name.

And considering retailers have been saying people have come into their shops looking for Black Panther comics specifically because they saw the movie and wanted to know more about the character, I'm not sure why anyone would try to downplay the role the film had in boosting the characters profile. Marvel was making it a point to have T'Challa appear in other comics, there was lots of merchandise out there, and Marvel made sure to FINALLY release and promote the entirety of the Priest series.

We saw similar interest increase in other properties before and after a films release. There's no way in hell we'd be seeing all these Guardians of the Galaxy books if not for the film doing so well and generating so much interest in the property.

Sure they are. One of them being that all those fans are no longer interested in the story. RLAAMJR attributed the high sales of BP#1 solely to Coates and his followers. By that logic, if his half million followers had remained, the drop off wouldn't have been so huge.

And that's even if we assume that all of his followers were picking up his book in the first place. A good chunk of Coates twitter followers have no interest in reading any comic book no matter who is writing it.

Doctor Strange with Jason Aaron wasn't noticeably improved due to headlining a movie.

Doctor Strange didn't have anywhere near as much mainstream buzz as Panther did leading up to Civil War. There just wasn't as much interest (or merchandise) for Strange leading up to his film compared to to what there was for T'Challa.

[Mr MajestiK]

BCB it's like I said, gotta keep this thread honest.

And I will definitely be at HEF more.

That's all one can do in Coatesville I suppose. :smh:

[Ezyo1000]

It was a combination of CW hot debut, 50 year anniversary (so New comers could easily get info on BP and his mythos) Coates name and followers, and the assload of variant covers that helped contribute to the massive #1 sales. Not just Coates and his followers. It was a whole Storm, marvel was really pushing last year

[RLAAMJR.]

Sales drops are pretty common in comics these days for a variety of factors.

True. Past BP writers wouldnt be able to sell as much as Coates can if they were writing BP today