Really tired of Darkseid

[Broddie]

Yeah he is that interesting. The situation is this:

I will never be sick of Darkseid.

I will always be sick of poorly executed Darkseid stories. That posturing, brawling, mewling space tyrant in World's End is patently NOT Darkseid. Yeah blah blah blah he's an emanation, a spectrum fractured variant, yadda yadda. Darkseid doesn't posture and brawl and grit his teeth in barely-contained rage. He's not Kalibakseid. His hate is not an angry hate. It is a cold, eternal hate.

I'm sick of lame portrayals of the Fourth World. Seriously, use them with some nuance; make them actually FEEL mythological, or don't use them at all.

I absolutely love Darkseid and the Fourth World, but I do think they're very often poorly or under executed.

Morrison is like the only writer who uses them correctly and captures they're epic nature and their Kirbyness. (and Morrison infuses a little of his Lovecraftian love into them)

Yeah, it's not Darkseid or the Fourth World that's the problem, but the uninspired, unimaginative, and all-too-frequent use of them. Darkseid is a wonderfully complex character, a a glorious yet horrific embodiment of authoritarianism, but most creators only use him as the big, powerful guy who acts as a punching bag to prop up heroes. This loses the nuance, complexity, and intellectual underpining of Kirby's work

These guys get it.

[Cipher]

Yeah he is that interesting. The situation is this:

I will never be sick of Darkseid.

I will always be sick of poorly executed Darkseid stories. That posturing, brawling, mewling space tyrant in World's End is patently NOT Darkseid. Yeah blah blah blah he's an emanation, a spectrum fractured variant, yadda yadda. Darkseid doesn't posture and brawl and grit his teeth in barely-contained rage. He's not Kalibakseid. His hate is not an angry hate. It is a cold, eternal hate.

There have been maybe three or four panels in all of New 52 Darkseid that have reminded me of good and proper Darkseid. Usually of him just standing there stoic like a monolith with his arms behind his back. The rest of the time he and Nu-Apokolips are literally interchangeable with Mongul and War World.

Agreed.

Not sick at all of Darkseid as he appeared in Kirby's New Gods or even Superman: The Animated Series. That guy was tons of fun to read, and an unpredictable story element to boot.

I am sick to death of Darkseid-the-brute-force conqueror, though. And he's who we've been getting for years.

[LifeIsILL]

Why not Anti-Monitor? It's harder to get him so wrong when he's been used much less.

As a Darkseid fan, I think I'd prefer more Anti-Monitor use and less Darkseid dilution. Or Mongul. Or Despero.


Speaking of Despero: DESPERO

He could be used more (though I have no idea how he's been used or not in the New 52).

Nah...I'd rather have Manhunters rather than Anti-Monitor. Same emotionless killers, but with Manhunters at least it will be more interesting.

Other than that I don't know, you have to start looking at Legion's villains or characters from Booster Gold's timeline.

[FanboyStranger]

I've been looking for Simonson's 4th World work for a while. Has it been collected?

The Orion omnibus was released last week. You can get it for a nice discount at Amazon. Mine should be here tomorrow.

[JBatmanFan05]

Krona is another villain that could be used more as a big bad.

[protege]

I'm sick of lame portrayals of the Fourth World. Seriously, use them with some nuance; make them actually FEEL mythological, or don't use them at all.

And yes, I primarily mean Johns on this one. And World's End. And pretty much most portrayals of the 4th world besides from a very specific list of writers.

About the only fourth world character that's interesting to me is mister miracle.

[Marvell2100]

Darkseid is suffering from overuse and is being used in stories where he's almost a typical super-villain. Darkseid isn't a supervillain but rather a force of evil. They pretty much have worn out his welcome with all the overexposure. Two of the best Darkseid stories imo were the Great Darkness Saga and the Great Darkness Saga II. That's how you use him.

[HsssH]

Nah...I'd rather have Manhunters rather than Anti-Monitor. Same emotionless killers, but with Manhunters at least it will be more interesting.

Other than that I don't know, you have to start looking at Legion's villains or characters from Booster Gold's timeline.

Well writers could always create new villains.

[Marvell2100]

About the only fourth world character that's interesting to me is mister miracle.

Have you read the New Gods vol 3 series by Mark Evanier and Paris Cullins? That was a great series and how they did Orion was perfect.

[Robotman]

He's one of if not thee best villains in comics but he is rarely written correctly. I think Morrison is the only current writer who does the character justice.
Darkseid has really been put through the ringer in the New 52. First he shows up in Justice League and acts like a regular brute villain. A villain who hardly ever used to get his hands dirty is fighting the League as if he was the Hulk. Pretty ridiculous.
I'm not even going to get into the trainwreck that has become Earth 2.

He's supposed to be the ultimate Machiavellian schemer but with the power to stomp Superman. That's an amazing villain.

Thankfully. Grant has mentioned him in Multiversity.

[Frontier]

Krona is another villain that could be used more as a big bad.

I think if we go with the Green Lantern canon being relatively intact post-reboot, Krona should still be dead in Earth-0. Unless there's been something recently that's disregarded that...

Well, as far as Darkseid's portrayal is concerned, interviews for Darkseid War make it seem like Johns is going to try his best at conveying Darkseid's character correctly and in the same way other posters have described. So here's hoping it works out .

In any case, at least we still get to appreciate Fabok's rendition of Darkseid .

[Blacksun]

He's one of if not thee best villains in comics but he is rarely written correctly. I think Morrison is the only current writer who does the character justice.
Darkseid has really been put through the ringer in the New 52. First he shows up in Justice League and acts like a regular brute villain. A villain who hardly ever used to get his hands dirty is fighting the League as if he was the Hulk. Pretty ridiculous.
I'm not even going to get into the trainwreck that has become Earth 2.

He's supposed to be the ultimate Machiavellian schemer but with the power to stomp Superman. That's an amazing villain.

Thankfully. Grant has mentioned him in Multiversity.

Johns should had used Mogul instead of darkseid.

It's funny how good darkseid is in destroying earth 2 lol

[Judge Dredd]

As others have said I do not think the issue is Darkseid, but with the fact that no one knows how to use the new gods material correctly.

[Robotman]

Darkseid is one of the best villains out there but if I was new to comics and just knew of him from his New 52 appearances I probably wouldn't be too impressed either.

Morrison's Darkseid is the only great modern interpretation.
Fingers crossed for the Darkseid War but it's hard to remain hopeful with the recent track record.

[Weapon X]

I've no doubt Final Crisis will be the last great Fourth World story, the last great Darkseid tale.

I think Final Crisis is still very good, but I think the old fashioned in me would have preferred Morrison going at least 12 Final Crisis titled issues (not just 12 if you included his Batman RIP tie-in and Superman Beyond and whatever that other tie in was). I think any Crisis should be a bit bloated and drawn out (all in a good way, like COIE) to accentuate its epic scale. In summary, Morrison needed to dial back himself in just that one area, and channel some Wolfman/Perez from COIE, be a bit more Geoff Johns for once.

Amen. I completely agree. I think the "Crisis" events lend themselves to be epic and told in a certain way. Like a summer, Hollywood blockbuster (i.e., Wolfman/Perez/Geoff Johns). Grant's a great writer and tells great stories but for Final Crisis, I too wish he would have dialed himself down and appeal to the masses more. He did that wonderfully with JLA and I was hoping for that going into Final Crisis. However, we he gave us with Final Crisis felt like the End of the Fourth World/New Gods vs the last chapter in the Multiversal Crisis stories.