The Minority Report! Diversity In The MU.

[Tiamatty]

This conversation truely isn't worth getting into anyway because again your last line says it all. You and others are mad that an established character did not have a change of sexual preference. Can we move on now? It's been made pretty clear from this reveal that some who claim to want representation are only willing to accepted if it embarks on others or changes cannon to please them. There is little to no reason to continue indulge those who choose to behave so selfishly.

No. That's not at all the case. Most people expected either Starbrand, Nightmask or Hyperion to be LGBT. None of them had established preferences, so nothing would've been changed.

Like Vision? Or Magneto? Or Danger? Or Swordsman? The list goes on and on.

We've only just learned that there's a feeling and thinking person inside Pod. Give it a chance to develop.

Yes, we've only just now, nearly three years into the run, discovered that a character who only appeared for one issue over a year ago, is anything other than a robot. It took him this long to give Pod even that much development, so I'm sceptical of how much she'll get over the course of this coming year.

I don't think that anyone has said anything like that. I think most folks have chosen to view it as a nice start, or a step in the right direction. I have yet to read a post with the sentiment of "there, you have one, now shut up". That's BS.

Honestly, Pod's introduction and the revelation that she's a lesbian (or perhaps bisexual, I suppose)....if you had to say it's good or it's bad, which do you pick?

It's barely even a start. It won't really be a good thing until she's an actual character, with a personality, and dialogue beyond "Everything is cool" and "That's not a kitty cat."

I think you're mistaking "happy" for "completely satisfied". Why shouldn't fans of diversity be happy about this? Being happy about it by no means implies that the progress has to stop here. I don't get why it's this all or nothing mentality.

I'm not letting the perfect be the enemy of the good, here. I'm saying that I don't think it's wrong for people to not be particularly happy about this. Honestly, even if Pod wasn't a lesbian, I don't think anyone would be wrong for not giving half a rat's ass about her. Frankly, remove the lesbian angle, and I think people would care even less about her. As it is, I feel like we're supposed to care about her just because she's a lesbian. We haven't actually been given a reason to care about her as a character. We've been given her backstory through exposition, because Hickman is incapable of writing anything in this entire Avengers run that isn't pure exposition, but we have no idea what she's like as a character.

Could she be cool? Sure, maybe Hickman will actually do something really neat with the character, and make her someone that people love and want to see more of. But Hickman has failed to impress me for his entire run so far, so I don't expect much. I still barely give a damn about Smasher or Hyperion.

[Mr MajestiK]

The former misguided villains started off clearly misguided. Pod started off as being pretty much mindless. She wasn't a character, she was an obstacle.

You're not really making sense with the bolded here as your complaint about Pod's first appearance in the Avengers book seems to hinge around what you've described as the character being launched as an "obstacle".

How exactly did said introduction make Hickman's recent reveal and expansion on Aikku/Pod any less valid?

Even now, she's more an idea than a character.

Aren't all of the characters in the fictional 616 MU a collection of ideas conceptualized by a myriad of writers?

We'll see if Hickman actually does anything with her. Given how little character work he did in his first two years, I'm sceptical that this next year is going to do much to show Pod as a genuinely compelling character.

You do have a valid point here as Hickman's character work on the Avengers book could be better.

But mostly, I'm just annoyed at the tone of "shut up and be happy about this current non-entity of a character, whose only previous appearance was as a mindless antagonist, as the first active-duty LGBT Avenger."

I don't seek Aikku/Pod as being a "non-entity" so I'm a bit confused as to why you're so quick to shoot down this character before we get to see how she fits into Hickman's ongoing Avengers mossaic.

I don't think the fact that so many people are so totally underwhelmed is either surprising or wrong. People have been waiting to find out who the LGBT Avenger is, and now that it's revealed, it's one that even people reading the book barely remember, and which no one even knew was sentient.

Have you actually conducted a poll to establish just how many people currently posting in this thread are "totally underwhelmed" by Aikku/Pod? And as far as Aikku's revealed sentience as depicted in Avengers #38 is concerned, how exactly has this revelation negatively impacted upon the characters introduction in earlier issues of the book?

And we still don't actually know jack shit about her. We know she's from Norway, had a girlfriend, and likes cats. That is the entire extent of her character at this point. This is her big introductory issue, and she isn't given a real personality.

The bolded aspect of your comment kind've contradicts the non-bolded because I'd say that finding out that there was an actual person ensconced within what some thought was a deadly automaton is kind've a big deal that should lead to further developments as Hickman's saga expands exponentially.

We now know her name and where she comes from so it would make sense to see what else the writer intends to do with her rather than deriding a character who's just been revealed because they don't immeadiately fit whatever pre-concieved paradigm.

You like Pod? Fine. Good for you. But don't try to argue that the people who want LGBT representation should be happy with this, or that the disappointment is just because we're never happy or any shit like that.

I like the Aikku/Pod reveal for what is right now and look forward to seeing what part she'll play in future issues of the book as would be the case for any of the other featured characters regardless of whether they're LGBT or not.

The disappointment is because who the hell is Pod?

I'm sure we'll all get to find out more about Aikku and her world in due course.

Peace.

[Mah VM]

I just wish those who are so against Pod would be honest with not only themselves but with everyone else about a few things. One, no matter what the writer did some probably wouldn't have been satisfied, wether he introduced the LGTB character in the beginning or the end, two, the only way some would have even acknowledged Pod is if she would of had the book focused on her in a book where the focus isn't on any character at all and three, that some were hoping that a popular established character would be changed to LGTB for their benefit and the fact that she isn't upsets them.(Insert other selfish reason here)

1) Saying that some people wouldn't be satisfied either way is incredibly diminishing of LGBT posters/allies because it reduces us to "people who only like to complaint" when we actually have a very valid cause to complaint here and the "MINORITY" thread seems to me like the place for it, isn't it?

2) Straight characters have solos all the time right out of the gate. Straight characters became leaders of teams all the time. Why would a LGBT one receiving the same treatment be something we shouldn't be expecting or calling for?

3) "Changed"??? I believe you meant "Revealed". Whenever a character is introduced and no word is said about their sexual orientation people will assume they are straight, because straight is the default sexuality for them. That is a fact and the reason for it is the straight privilege that our society is deep rooted in. And that is considering that the character in question never had a love interest, characters who've only had opposite gender love interests still can be revealed as Bi. The only people who cry in forums about their precious (assumed)straight character turn out to be gay/bi are blinded by their straight privilege that stops them from realising that they still have way more than they need and they take it for granted, they can't see how ridiculously selfish it is for them to be mad at some people for wanting to have a fair share while they are used to have it all.
You think we're being "selfish" for wanting an stablished character to come out while completely ignoring the fact that even if 3 stablished characters came out you'd still have the vast Majority in every single title published out there. And we're the ones being selfish? Some people think that we shouldn't ask for an A-List when some people have all of them for granted. That is selfish by every definition.

Nobody here is against Pod, all I've seen are posters (who like me) are incredibly disappointed that after years a minor character who nobody ever even heard of is all we get and some people think that we shouldn't complaint about getting table scraps. I'm glad some people liked Pod and I hope she becomes popular but we do deserve more and better.

[Mr MajestiK]

Nobody here is against Pod, all I've seen are posters (who like me) are incredibly disappointed that after years a minor character who nobody ever even heard of is all we get and some people think that we shouldn't complaint about getting table scraps. I'm glad some people liked Pod and I hope she becomes popular but we do deserve more and better.

I'm really confused as to why a character who singlehandedly wiped the floor with an Avengers team with all of their heavy hitters present, is being described as being "minor" or a "table scrap"?

[Tiamatty]

^ On top of that, Hickman's introduced plenty of characters already, much earlier in the book, who've already gotten some focus. By the time Hickman's run is finished, will Pod have gotten as much focus as Hyperion? Starbrand? Nightmask? Manifold? Smasher? I doubt it. Is Marvel going to do a .1 issue for Pod? Again, I'd guess probably not. Considering we've got, what, four or five months left before he launches a year-long event? And considering events are almost never character-focused these days, and Hickman's entire run has had minimal character focus, it's doubtful that Pod's going to get much to do during Secret Wars, aside from hitting things.

[just another user]

I'm really confused as to why a character who singlehandedly wiped the floor with an Avengers team with all of their heavy hitters present, is being described as being "minor" or a "table scrap"?

You can have amazing powers but if your only used sparsely without much characterisation you can still be a minor character - having minor importance in the greater scheme of things. I don't know if this is the case in this instance as I haven't read her appearances yet.

[Mr MajestiK]

^ On top of that, Hickman's introduced plenty of characters already, much earlier in the book, who've already gotten some focus. By the time Hickman's run is finished, will Pod have gotten as much focus as Hyperion? Starbrand? Nightmask? Manifold? Smasher? I doubt it. Is Marvel going to do a .1 issue for Pod? Again, I'd guess probably not. Considering we've got, what, four or five months left before he launches a year-long event? And considering events are almost never character-focused these days, and Hickman's entire run has had minimal character focus, it's doubtful that Pod's going to get much to do during Secret Wars, aside from hitting things.

A lot can happen 4-5 months.

[Mr MajestiK]

You can have amazing powers but if your only used sparsely without much characterisation you can still be a minor character - having minor importance in the greater scheme of things. I don't know if this is the case in this instance as I haven't read her appearances yet.

Very fair point.

As far as Aikku Jokkinen's characterization goes it will be interesting to see what Hickman does with her moving forward.

I like what I've seen so far.

[Holt]

I'll wait and see on Pod. I liked the issue but Hickman's Avengers run has become rather famous for introducing characters and then completely ignoring them for issue after issue because of how huge his cast is. He ended up with a team with diverse characters like Falcon, Shang-Chi and Captain Universe who usually go months on end without appearing or doing anything beyond standing in the background.

[Tiamatty]

A lot can happen 4-5 months.

Well, it looks like the next issue will focus on the hunt for the Illuminati, so Pod's not likely to have much of a role there. The issue after it looks likely to focus on Thanos, so again, probably not much of Pod there. The cover after that is pretty vague, but it probably would be about time to take another look at what Sunspot's team is doing. So hey, maybe Pod will get two lines of dialogue in that issue.

But yeah, five months until Secret Wars starts, and that time has to be split between multiple factions, each with a bunch of members. So it's basically impossible for Pod to get a spotlight issue in that time. This issue was her spotlight, and literally her only line of dialogue in the issue was "That's not a kitty cat."

Secret Wars itself looks like it's going to be full of tons of alternate realities, and each new alternate reality shown is going to have to get mounds of exposition detailing it, so that's also going to take away from any character focus, so Pod's still unlikely to get another spotlight issue during that time. I guess it's possible that she could get a .1 issue during Secret Wars, but it seems unlikely to me that there will be any character-specific .1s. More likely, we'll get one-shots for alternate realities.

It looks likely to me that Pod is going to wind up being the least-developed character of Hickman's run. That he waited so long to actually bring her in that he's left virtually no time to give her much of a chance for focus. She'll hit things, get occasional one-liners while hitting things, and toss off some exposition about things she's hitting.

[Mr MajestiK]

Well, it looks like the next issue will focus on the hunt for the Illuminati, so Pod's not likely to have much of a role there. The issue after it looks likely to focus on Thanos, so again, probably not much of Pod there. The cover after that is pretty vague, but it probably would be about time to take another look at what Sunspot's team is doing. So hey, maybe Pod will get two lines of dialogue in that issue.

But yeah, five months until Secret Wars starts, and that time has to be split between multiple factions, each with a bunch of members. So it's basically impossible for Pod to get a spotlight issue in that time. This issue was her spotlight, and literally her only line of dialogue in the issue was "That's not a kitty cat."

Secret Wars itself looks like it's going to be full of tons of alternate realities, and each new alternate reality shown is going to have to get mounds of exposition detailing it, so that's also going to take away from any character focus, so Pod's still unlikely to get another spotlight issue during that time. I guess it's possible that she could get a .1 issue during Secret Wars, but it seems unlikely to me that there will be any character-specific .1s. More likely, we'll get one-shots for alternate realities.

It looks likely to me that Pod is going to wind up being the least-developed character of Hickman's run. That he waited so long to actually bring her in that he's left virtually no time to give her much of a chance for focus. She'll hit things, get occasional one-liners while hitting things, and toss off some exposition about things she's hitting.

We'll see.

[Marvell2100]

Well now that we have a new LGBT character, lets not be so quick to dismiss what Hickman's intentions are or what development Pod will receive. Some of the reactions are understandable but let's not overlook the fact that the first step has been made. All we can do now is continue to follow and see what happens. Aikku's characterization and orientation shoud hopefully remain intact after her transformation.

[Daymare]

No. That's not at all the case. Most people expected either Starbrand, Nightmask or Hyperion to be LGBT. None of them had established preferences, so nothing would've been changed.

With what you said being the case, it is better that he sticks with his style and makes it a random comment. If the "straight" characters in the book are not declaring their preference and we do not even know what said prefernce is, to focus soley on that for the possible only LGBT character would seem like tokenism or pandering imo.
If his entire run has not been impressive to you there are other books out there which could suit your needs better so the option to not buy it is always there.
#savepod

[Tiamatty]

With what you said being the case, it is better that he sticks with his style and makes it a random comment. If the "straight" characters in the book are not declaring their preference and we do not even know what said prefernce is, to focus soley on that for the possible only LGBT character would seem like tokenism or pandering imo.
If his entire run has not been impressive to you there are other books out there which could suit your needs better so the option to not buy it is always there.
#savepod

I haven't actually seen anyone who has a problem with the way it was revealed - in fact, a lot of us argued in the past that it should be done pretty much exactly how it was done here. It wasn't the style. It's the character.

And I actually don't buy the book. I read plenty of books I don't buy. Sharing is great.

[Marvell2100]

I'll wait and see on Pod. I liked the issue but Hickman's Avengers run has become rather famous for introducing characters and then completely ignoring them for issue after issue because of how huge his cast is. He ended up with a team with diverse characters like Falcon, Shang-Chi and Captain Universe who usually go months on end without appearing or doing anything beyond standing in the background.

It's possible that Pod could appear in other titles. She's not just limited to the main Avengers title.